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mucsavage
08-02-2010, 09:33 PM
A question for all you Jamaican music experts....

Are these two riddims essentially the same? Or am I going mad?

Cheers

john eden
08-02-2010, 10:05 PM
Weatherman skank is aka "it's raining"?

If so then you get horns on it. And the baseline is different?

Check the originals mAybe?

It's rainig by the two tops (or was it the three tops?)

and slim smith for answer

mucsavage
08-02-2010, 11:07 PM
Yeah, Its Raining is Weatherman Skank


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=43t_O18_bsE

And then Slim Smith, as you say, is the original for Answer


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=spXqpjF835Y

Its the basslines that are wrecking my head. They are slightly different alright, but, yet, seem so the same.....Weird.

Just trying to separate tracks into riddims, nerding it up a bit

john eden
09-02-2010, 09:19 AM
I love unpicking all that stuff. Did you see the Answer riddim clash me and Paul Meme did?

john eden
09-02-2010, 09:47 AM
Actually this thread is worth a reload:

http://www.dissensus.com/showthread.php?5341-RIDDIMCLASH-DOWNLOAD-John-Eden-vs-Paul-Meme-VOTE-FOR-THE-WINNER-HERE

Funny stuff!

matt b
09-02-2010, 11:19 AM
Different rhythms:

weatherman skank (http://www.jamrid.com/RiddimDBSearch.php?search=Weatherman Skank&type=Riddim)

answer (http://www.jamrid.com/RiddimDBSearch.php?search=answer&type=Riddim)

If you see any 7"s on the Black & White label, I'd suggest you buy on sight- generally excellent, most with Tubby dubs. Been getting repressed over the past couple of years.

droid
09-02-2010, 11:39 AM
Yeah, Id say their definitely different riddims as well.

I read something recently that claimed 'pain' wasn't on the answer... crazy.

<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/hiPlqhzY7l0&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/hiPlqhzY7l0&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

droid
09-02-2010, 11:40 AM
Just trying to separate tracks into riddims, nerding it up a bit

LOL. See you in a few years so.

mucsavage
09-02-2010, 10:36 PM
Nice one John, that clash was before my lurking about here, will download them for commuting tomorrow!

I've sorted out my confusion, with a fresh listen.

Matt, dead on with the Black & White stuff, I have Larry Marshall & Carlton Patterson - Can't You Understand. It's gorgeous.

Anyway, it could be worse I suppose, I could be into stamps or something.

john eden
10-02-2010, 10:07 AM
LOL. See you in a few years so.

I can't muster up the enthusiasm for it. My riddim/collection excel database has stalled at 30 entries. [and not because that's all the records I have, you cheeky fuckers!]

mucsavage
10-02-2010, 09:24 PM
i'm using Serato so doing it from there. Can only do small bits every now and then though.

routes
10-02-2010, 09:59 PM
THIS (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUf-vjI6Pas) is a beautiful tarrus riley song on the midnight hour riddim. when i first heard this i thought it was the weatherman riddim but it obviously isn't. but anyway. any excuse. it's a great tune.

droid
11-02-2010, 01:02 PM
I can't muster up the enthusiasm for it. My riddim/collection excel database has stalled at 30 entries. [and not because that's all the records I have, you cheeky fuckers!]

Thats true. I saw at least 31 records in your place when I was over.

I'm still investigating a custom XML based metadata solution to all this malarky. Something that I can search and filter by artist/album/style/producer/label/sub-genre/year/country/riddim/lyrics/theme etc... so if I want to find a 1993 bhangra style DJ tune on Pick up the pieces riddim about shooting guns at train drivers, all I have to do is search by artist and filter by year/theme etc.. (the answer is 'Ninjman - target practise' btw). Think Ill have to write the interface in Flash, but I'm hoping that doing the dataset in XML will allow it to link in with other systems which I may or may not try out in the future.

Back OT - Ballistic Affair/Get in the Groove... Theyre not that similar but I always get them mixed up!

droid
11-02-2010, 01:04 PM
THIS (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vUf-vjI6Pas) is a beautiful tarrus riley song on the midnight hour riddim. when i first heard this i thought it was the weatherman riddim but it obviously isn't. but anyway. any excuse. it's a great tune.

Id call that an answer recut. The bass is almost identical, the skanks are in the right key. Extra horns, but that's standard. Reminds me a bit of the penthouse cut of answer.

routes
11-02-2010, 03:05 PM
Id call that an answer recut. The bass is almost identical, the skanks are in the right key. Extra horns, but that's standard. Reminds me a bit of the penthouse cut of answer.

cor. i had to got to thinking it was a homage or something. i've seen it called 'the midnight hour riddim'.

droid
11-02-2010, 03:10 PM
That's common enough though. Often recuts are given their own name based on the biggest tune on the riddim. The c2000 reversion of the conversation was called the 'Debate', but its basically the same riddim. When something deviates significantly enough from the original but is still recognisable I'd often use the new name but have a 'based on' category - so the 'Two year Old' would be its own riddim, but it would be based on the 'Lecturer', or 'Political Friction' would be based on "Full Up'. 'Heavenless' is a nightmare for this as a lot of the versions would be very different from each other - see 'Greetings' (Phang digi killer), 'Crying time' (slowed down Jammys cut with new piano melody), 'Informer' (early 80s cut with full horns) and "Deh Wid you' (Jammys cut again with the extra synth melody, used a basis for many 90's versions of the riddim) to name but a few.

mucsavage
11-02-2010, 06:08 PM
I'm quietly thankful that....

1. There are others whose geek-ery surpasses mine

2. I am not alone in riddim confusion

Lecturer is another lovely one, especially the Jim Brown cut on the Soul Jazz DJ comp.

Ah great, just listened to the Midnight Hour, confusion reigns once again :(

droid
11-02-2010, 06:44 PM
Lecturer, Answer, High Fashion. Those riddims ruled soundclash in the mid-late 80s (after Sleng Teng of course).

crofton
11-02-2010, 08:03 PM
shooting guns at train drivers

are there lots of tunes on this theme??

droid
11-02-2010, 08:23 PM
Big time. Thats why there's no trains in Jamaica anymore.

Babylon will of course claim that its because the government couldnt afford to repair the tracks after Gilbert, but the real reason is that all the drivers quit because so many were being shot by Ninjaman.

john eden
11-02-2010, 09:32 PM
Rodigan mentioned this on Sunday - apparently he was clashing with Trooper and played a hot special of "Stop That Train".

But Trooper just pointed that he couldn't play it any more cos there were no trains in Jamaica any more. :D