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scottdisco
05-05-2010, 11:54 PM
a little premature, and there are already other threads that are zesty, but, hey...

Sectionfive
06-05-2010, 12:23 AM
May I get my commiserations in early .
This might be old but ye will need all the cheering up ya can get tomorrow..

While walking down the street one day, an MP is tragically hit by a truck and dies. His soul arrives in heaven and is met by St. Peter at the entrance.

"Welcome to Heaven," says St. Peter. "Before you settle in, it seems there is a problem. We seldom see a politicians around these parts, you see, so we're not sure what to do with you."

"No problem, just let me in," says the MP.

"Well, I'd like to, but I have orders from higher up. What we'll do is have you spend one day in Hell and one in Heaven. Then you can choose where to spend eternity."

"Really, I've made up my mind. I want to be in Heaven," says the MP.

"I'm sorry but we have our rules," said St. Peter, and escorts him to the elevator. and he goes down, down to Hell.

The doors open, and he finds himself in the middle of a green golf course. In the distance is a club and standing in front of it are all his friends and other politicians who he had worked with.

They run to greet him, hug him, and reminisce about the good times they had while getting rich at expense of ordinary hard working people.

They play a friendly game of golf and then dine on lobster and caviar. Also present is the Devil, who really is a very friendly guy who has a good time dancing and telling jokes.

They are having such a good time that, before he realizes it, it is time to go.

Everyone gives him a big hug and waves while the elevator rises. The elevator goes up, up, up, and the door reopens on Heaven where St.Peter is waiting for him.

"Now it's time to visit Heaven." So 24 hours pass with the MP joining a group of contented souls moving from cloud to cloud, playing the harp and singing. They have a good time and, before he realizes it, the 24 hours have gone by, and St. Peter returns.

"Well, then, you've spent a day in Hell and another in Heaven. Now, choose the place where you want to spend eternity."

He reflects for a minute and then answers: "Well, I thought I'd never say this, but, I mean Heaven has been delightful, but on reflection, I think I would be better off in Hell."

So Saint Peter escorts him to the elevator, and he goes down, down to Hell.

Now, the doors of the elevator open, and he is in the middle of a barren land covered with waste and garbage. He sees all his friends, dressed in rags, picking up the trash and putting it in black bags. And it's hot, hot, hot. Sweltering hot. Hot and miserable.

The Devil comes over to him and lays his arm on his neck.

"I don't understand," stammers the MP. "Yesterday I was here, and there was a golf course and club, and we ate lobster and caviar, we danced and had a great time. Now it is all wasteland, full of garbage, and my friends look miserable."

The Devil looks at him, smiles, and says, "Yesterday we were campaigning.



..........today you gave us your vote."

badum... tish

grizzleb
06-05-2010, 01:02 AM
If only it was caviar and lobster, instead we get a flocking farce.

Got a right semi for this election, it's gonna be a goodun whatever happens. I like the high drama of political theatre.

scottdisco
06-05-2010, 01:14 AM
local men clash w immigrant in hustings stand-off (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/england/8663681.stm)

mos dan
06-05-2010, 01:49 AM
i can't sleep, which doesn't bode well for tomorrow, since the key seats don't start coming in til after 3.. fully expect to still be up at 7am

these are the two key pieces for me

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2010/apr/29/mervyn-king-warns-election-victor the great un(der)reported story: whoever gets in, we are utterly fucked

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/poverty-and-injustice-in-david-cameronrsquos-model-borough-1962318.html johann hari says everything you ever need to read about cameron's tories. my god he's got so good since he was the 23-year-old scourge of private eye (back when he repeatedly got things very very wrong)

sorry i'm sure these pieces have been posted elsewhere already, i'm too tired to check

alex
06-05-2010, 07:34 AM
none of the above.

crackerjack
06-05-2010, 08:38 AM
i can't sleep, which doesn't bode well for tomorrow, since the key seats don't start coming in til after 3.. fully expect to still be up at 7am

these are the two key pieces for me

http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2010/apr/29/mervyn-king-warns-election-victor the great un(der)reported story: whoever gets in, we are utterly fucked

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/poverty-and-injustice-in-david-cameronrsquos-model-borough-1962318.html johann hari says everything you ever need to read about cameron's tories. my god he's got so good since he was the 23-year-old scourge of private eye (back when he repeatedly got things very very wrong)

sorry i'm sure these pieces have been posted elsewhere already, i'm too tired to check

That Hari piece is a blinder.

I console myself that I live in the only probable Labour gain in the country.

Eeverything else is doom.

routes
06-05-2010, 08:46 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Keegq7anD4I&feature=player_embedded

:(

gumdrops
06-05-2010, 09:08 AM
i still havent decided. :|

crackerjack
06-05-2010, 09:29 AM
9.23am: It appears that Nigel Farage, the flamboyant UK Independence party candidate for Buckingham has been involved in some sort of accident. His light aircraft was forced to crash land after somehow getting tangled up with a Ukip banner. I've just tried to call Ukip on various numbers but no one answering just now. More follows soon.

it would be cruel not to laugh

Mr. Tea
06-05-2010, 10:05 AM
Shit! Thanks for the heads-up Scott, I'd forgotten all about it.

(;))

mistersloane
06-05-2010, 10:14 AM
it would be cruel not to laugh

one down :) more to come

massrock
06-05-2010, 11:11 AM
http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/About/General/2010/5/6/1273139736859/The-light-aircraft-that-c-005.jpg

Doink!

DannyL
06-05-2010, 11:11 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Keegq7anD4I&feature=player_embedded

:(

I thought this was tounge in cheek. It was with a dawning sense of horror I realised it wasn't!

WTF!

computer_rock
06-05-2010, 11:24 AM
I thought this was tounge in cheek. It was with a dawning sense of horror I realised it wasn't!

WTF!

it was done for one of those completely vacuous newsnight closing features. the guy said it was a 'challenge' writing a pro-conservative song so whilst not strictly tongue in cheek, it wasn't serious either.

scottdisco
06-05-2010, 01:50 PM
Pearson of Rannoch is a genuinely malign force, speaking of Ukip. i noted at their conference speech he gave a (admittedly, totally predictable and we knew it was coming, but still) goalposts-shifting turn in which European integration was just one of many concerns, but all the other concerns were packaged up in such a way as to sound to the right of the Tories, definitively torpedoing any media spin that Ukip's top brass are just sober wonks concerned w the opaqueness of Brussels. oh no, it's turns out you're the usual small-state ideologues w some unjustified preconceived ideas.

and what were those concerns?

why, immigration and climate change (the basic message was not much more subtle than 'it's a bit of a con, i think, don't you know, more or less, and, in addition, we need to resist the overbearing governments of this earth in their hubristic methods to try to do something about it') were two of the big ones.

quelle surprise.

a fucking shower.

i'd love to heckle Bob Bailey (that BNP PPC, Romford) w something about him pissing back off to Scunthorpe, the bloody migrant.

scottdisco
06-05-2010, 01:52 PM
The Devil looks at him, smiles, and says, "Yesterday we were campaigning.



..........today you gave us your vote."

badum... tish

:D

i just tried to embed - everybody will be pleased to hear, i'm sure - the Blackadder The Third by-election episode, but sadly nothing doing.

legendary, the soon-to-be-ex Dennis Lill to the Prince Regent, I dined hugely orf a servant before coming to town

"You eat your servants?"

No sir! I eat orf 'em.

Mr. Tea
06-05-2010, 01:56 PM
:D

i just tried to embed - everybody will be pleased to hear, i'm sure - the Blackadder The Third by-election episode, but sadly nothing doing.

legendary, the soon-to-be-ex Dennis Lill to the Prince Regent, I dined hugely orf a servant before coming to town

"You eat your servants?"

No sir! I eat orf 'em.

Haha, superb. Also love the line about the returning officer who "accidentally brutally cut his head off while brushing his hair" or whatever it is. :D

scottdisco
06-05-2010, 02:08 PM
Haha, superb. Also love the line about the returning officer who "accidentally brutally cut his head off while brushing his hair" or whatever it is. :D

and what must surely (?) have been a playful dig (i hope Nomad doesn't see this ;) ) at Kinnock's nationality as the youthful PM Pitt makes his maiden appearance in the House, and 'calls upon the Leader of the Opposition to test me on my Latin vocab', at which point a sheep's baa-ing can very clearly be heard...

paolo
06-05-2010, 06:49 PM
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/poverty-and-injustice-in-david-cameronrsquos-model-borough-1962318.html johann hari says everything you ever need to read about cameron's tories. my god he's got so good since he was the 23-year-old scourge of private eye (back when he repeatedly got things very very wrong)



Yikes. And here I was thinking a Tory government wouldn't be that bad

sufi
06-05-2010, 09:26 PM
roots from yard blog election SPECIAL!

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5IdEvMimaF4/S-MBe0721yI/AAAAAAAAAD8/ID9XexlZ1Ks/s320/Election+Derby+A.jpg

http://rootsfromyard.blogspot.com/2010/05/polling-day.html

crackerjack
06-05-2010, 09:33 PM
roots from yard blog election SPECIAL!

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_5IdEvMimaF4/S-MBe0721yI/AAAAAAAAAD8/ID9XexlZ1Ks/s320/Election+Derby+A.jpg

http://rootsfromyard.blogspot.com/2010/05/polling-day.html

crackerjack likes this,

though I prefer the Derrick Morgan one where Socialist wins rather than Natty Dread

crackerjack
06-05-2010, 10:01 PM
exit poll
307
255
59 for lib dems!!!!!! down on 05 - that doesn't smell right

hucks
06-05-2010, 10:04 PM
exit poll
307
255
59 for lib dems!!!!!! down on 05 - that doesn't smell right

Hung parliament. Yes!

crackerjack
06-05-2010, 10:08 PM
Hung parliament. Yes!

indeed - what's the DUP total gonna be? anyone?


edit: nightmare scenario - SNP support tories in return for referendum on independence, which strips Labour of 35-40 Mps and means we never govenr again. Please tell me it can't happen.

hucks
06-05-2010, 10:13 PM
indeed - what's the DUP total gonna be? anyone?


edit: nightmare scenario - SNP support tories in return for referendum on independence, which strips Labour of 35-40 Mps and means we never govenr again. Please tell me it can't happen.

The Tories would never go for that. Wholly opposed to the Union breaking up.

crackerjack
06-05-2010, 10:18 PM
The Tories would never go for that. Wholly opposed to the Union breaking up.

yeah, you're right. panic over

swears
06-05-2010, 10:30 PM
Sooo... voted Labour tactically (it's a lab/con marginal seat) even though I'm leaning Lib-Dem this time around.

God, I hope that prick Cameron doesn't get in.

Sectionfive
06-05-2010, 10:38 PM
indeed - what's the DUP total gonna be? anyone?
.

8 or 9 seats

crackerjack
06-05-2010, 10:40 PM
Hate to trouble you, but these projections are based on a uniform swing. Polling this week has said Tories doing better in Lab marginals....:(:eek:

Sorry about this, I'm feeling a bit Jeremiah tonight

hucks
06-05-2010, 10:41 PM
Yeah, this from the fivethirtyeight on twitter

"If exit poll seat calculations are based on uniform swing, our non-uniform model would instead project ~340 Tory seats on those numbers"

Bah and balls

crackerjack
06-05-2010, 10:43 PM
Yeah, this from the fivethirtyeight on twitter

"If exit poll seat calculations are based on uniform swing, our non-uniform model would instead project ~340 Tory seats on those numbers"

Bah and balls

fuck

scottdisco
06-05-2010, 10:44 PM
shite

Sectionfive
06-05-2010, 10:52 PM
eh, 2005 the DUP took nine. It could be one either side of that this time round. Most likelt to drop one
If thats what your asking

crackerjack
06-05-2010, 10:52 PM
Labour leading the hotties in parliament race :D

crackerjack
06-05-2010, 11:26 PM
sit-in in Hackney by late voters

some Dissensians there surely?

scottdisco
06-05-2010, 11:46 PM
sober Beeb suits pointing out the BNP haven't quite broke through w their numbers is one thing but polling fourth, above Ukip, in two consecutive Wearside seats, is deeply, deeply dispiriting.

scottdisco
06-05-2010, 11:50 PM
i know they are absurdly split w Alby Walker defecting etc, in Stoke Central, but i had airily assumed their in-fighting in the Potteries might just (at the least) be enough to skittle them. but two consecutive 5% + shares that i wasn't expecting (tbh), i mean, good lord.

Nick Griffin loves Hodge's outbursts down the years, does most of his work for him...

crackerjack
07-05-2010, 12:13 AM
Sky chatter

Hodge to win 'comfortably', Griffin may come 3rd

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 12:16 AM
cheers, haven't a clue what's been going on in Stoke either i must admit, but that is something.

crackerjack
07-05-2010, 12:18 AM
cheers, haven't a clue what's been going on in Stoke either i must admit, but that is something.

stoke odds were heavily on lab a few days back - bnp 8/1 at shortest

Mr. Tea
07-05-2010, 12:32 AM
It was much more exciting than this when Obama got in. :(

Seriously, I can't remember an election with a heavier general air of public cynicism about it. Not without reason, of course.

crackerjack
07-05-2010, 12:40 AM
recognise anyone? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KG6IZtOJcFQ&feature=player_embedded)

nomadthethird
07-05-2010, 12:49 AM
So call me stupid, but I've been to a few websites and I still can't figure out who won.

Did anybody win? Labour has the most seats, right?

This is all very confusing.

Sectionfive
07-05-2010, 12:50 AM
Swiiiiiing, unlucky Peter

STN
07-05-2010, 12:50 AM
I'm not sure it's even properly started yet...

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 12:52 AM
oh we've only just started the counting of the votes. by around breakfast East Coast Time Friday we should know an awful lot more.

Robinson loses Belfast East. wow. is this just because of the personal issues? DUP vote in North Antrim about as fucked on the swings as Lab in Houghton and Sunderland South.

Mr. Tea
07-05-2010, 12:53 AM
So call me stupid, but I've been to a few websites and I still can't figure out who won.

Did anybody win? Labour has the most seats, right?

This is all very confusing.

Um, they've only called ten seats so far. The polls closed three hours ago.

nomadthethird
07-05-2010, 12:57 AM
Ah I see. You guys actually count votes before calling a winner! Imagine that...

We just let the newspeople take exit poles and then project the numbers through some kind of model.

STN
07-05-2010, 12:58 AM
Ah, but we have fewer votes to count as we don't bother actually letting people into the polling stations

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 01:00 AM
Ah I see. You guys actually count votes before calling a winner! Imagine that...

We just let the newspeople take exit poles and then project the numbers through some kind of model.

oh we have all sorts of silly polls too :)

but yeah in about literally twelve hours time from time of this post, things should be much, much clearer. (though if the Conservatives don't do as well as they would like to do, it may be the weekend and there'll be some horse trading going on.)

LOL@ STN! i was impressed w the quiet, patient way in which some chap from Sheffield explained his beef w the situation in Hallam. just saw him on ITV.

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 01:08 AM
Baroness Phwoar-Si, silver-haired charmer Paddy, and stentorian Kinnock, it's the top-shelf card for Paxman at the moment...

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 01:35 AM
Just called @davidcameron to congratulate him on the victory. Even though results aren't in we know the Conservatives had a great day

:rolleyes:

another + 10% swing in an English seat (admittedly Blair's old one and who likes him) for the Tories.

early seats really showing up how the Tories are an English party...

crackerjack
07-05-2010, 01:45 AM
:rolleyes:

another + 10% swing in an English seat (admittedly Blair's old one and who likes him) for the Tories.

early seats really showing up how the Tories are an English party...

I'm really not bothered by huge swings to Cons in very safe Lab seats. The Brum seat was a disaster. Hhave the Cons had any other really impressive wins? Battersea, Basildon...we knew they were going.

Still think it's a Con majority mind, just haven't seen much evidence where it really matters.

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 01:48 AM
yes the London seats are very interesting

Sectionfive
07-05-2010, 01:49 AM
Wonder was there any polls taken of those who didnt get in. Who will lose out ?

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 01:57 AM
Wonder was there any polls taken of those who didnt get in. Who will lose out ?

i noticed John Reid say anecdotally that Tory voters tend to vote earlier, and Lab voters later, but he would say that. (and of course no mention of voters of any other party.)

Sheffield Hallam is certainly LD territory, i think, Mcr Withington is LD (a solid local Labour challenge has been in evidence too in recent weeks tbf), and i don't know about the other areas that have been reporting it, Brum Ladywood i think had probs (a very safe Lab seat) or was it Brum Edgbaston, and various places in Lpool, Leeds and Ldn?

crackerjack
07-05-2010, 02:15 AM
First Lab gain of the night in Glasgow, reclaiming byelection loss from SNP.

Lab holding Bolton NE :)

Tentative Andy
07-05-2010, 02:22 AM
Labour declares for Glasgow Central. No surprise there then. Overturning the Scottish by-election losses so dramatically was somewhat more surprising.
Think I'm going to watch this right to the end now, no sign of sleep coming on.

Sectionfive
07-05-2010, 02:24 AM
02:18am: Nick Griffin concedes he has lost in Barking: No, I think Margaret Hodge will hold the seat fairly comfortably which she was always likely to do, Im not sure about second place.

crackerjack
07-05-2010, 02:25 AM
Labour declares for Glasgow Central. No surprise there then. Overturning the Scottish by-election losses so dramatically was somewhat more surprising.
Think I'm going to watch this right to the end now, no sign of sleep coming on.

You realise 'the end' is midday tomorrow? Even I won't be around that long,

Tentative Andy
07-05-2010, 02:28 AM
For real?
As in all of the seats being declared?
Shows how much I know really...

Tentative Andy
07-05-2010, 02:29 AM
Quite a few Con gains flashing up on screen...

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 02:32 AM
High Peak, Leics NW, both decent Tory gains.

Chester, Nunny, Tamworth too.

not surprised Tories got Aberconwy as that is essentially wealthy English, second homes fare round there, and Lembit for Montgomeryshire pissing it (for SKY's Adam Boulton's wry "personal reasons") not too surprising, but Tories gaining Vale of Glamorgan is unexpected, isn't it?

crackerjack
07-05-2010, 02:33 AM
Quite a few Con gains flashing up on screen...

All easy-peasy ones.

Sectionfive - great news. Having your election agent scrapping in the street doesn't help.


Sky now - Campbell vs Adam Boulton!

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 02:33 AM
overall i must say the aforesaid Adam Boulton is, all things considered, a bit of a disingenuous, facetious cunt.

Tentative Andy
07-05-2010, 02:37 AM
Labour hold Glasgow North against Lib-Dem, also seen off main SNP challenges so far.

crackerjack
07-05-2010, 02:39 AM
overall i must say the aforesaid Adam Boulton is, all things considered, a bit of a disingenuous, facetious cunt.

He stood up for himself, but he must be embarrassed with this election. Sky's had a pretty balanced rep up till now, but they've been partisan as fuck this time round. Not least the man himself, asking inappropriate questions of Clegg.

mistersloane
07-05-2010, 02:42 AM
this is fun

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 02:44 AM
He stood up for himself, but he must be embarrassed with this election. Sky's had a pretty balanced rep up till now, but they've been partisan as fuck this time round. Not least the man himself, asking inappropriate questions of Clegg.

very true. i mean it's not often Alastair Campbell has a valid point.

shame as Boulton's interview w Obama not too long after he got in was very well done (within the obvious limitations) and he normally comes across well.

had to laugh at Kelvin Macca casting aspersions about Campbell's taste in herbal cigarettes...

crackerjack
07-05-2010, 02:45 AM
Lab holding Edgbaston, Sky reckon.

Suck on that.

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 02:48 AM
Lembit Opik versus Paxman quite fun.

mistersloane
07-05-2010, 03:20 AM
Paxman is being genius :

"thank you david milliband, you're a very clever guy, you've answered exactly the question that you were likely to hear"

"it's about twenty past three, can't we just have a straight answer?"

"can you hear me, David Milliband? See if you can do a bit of lipreading if you can find a monitor"

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 04:34 AM
I agree with Clegg.

well, that covers just about anything tbf, doesn't it?!

massrock
07-05-2010, 09:54 AM
You lot crashed out early didn't ya. Lightweights.

Like the BBC headline just now - Uncertainty Now Certain.

Pestario
07-05-2010, 10:14 AM
I got a letter from the government the other day. I opened and read it, it said HUNG PARLIAMENT

Con: 291
Lab: 247
LD: 51

hung like a horse

Slothrop
07-05-2010, 10:34 AM
If the tories can't form an overall majority but are big enough to take on Lib + Lab, what's likely to happen? Will they be able to form a minority government with support from the 'regional' parties to get stuff through? I don't really know enough about the SNP, PC etc to know how happy they'd be to sign up to whatever the Tories want in exchange for some devolutionary concessions...

hucks
07-05-2010, 10:38 AM
If the tories can't form an overall majority but are big enough to take on Lib + Lab, what's likely to happen? Will they be able to form a minority government with support from the 'regional' parties to get stuff through? I don't really know enough about the SNP, PC etc to know how happy they'd be to sign up to whatever the Tories want in exchange for some devolutionary concessions...

PC would do it for lots of money, dunno what conditions the SNP would impose.

Mr. Tea
07-05-2010, 10:41 AM
Poplar and Limehouse still unanounced, dammit! :mad: If Galloway gets in I'm gonna feel sooo guilty for not voting for Alan Titch-, I mean Jim Fitzpatrick.

Yesterday I was all "Bollocks to tactical voting", but hey ho.

john eden
07-05-2010, 10:48 AM
Hackney still counting as well.

Mr. Tea
07-05-2010, 10:50 AM
Hackney still counting as well.

That was one of the places where polls closed before everyone got to vote, wasn't it? Do you know if there's an estimate of the number of people who got turned away?

hucks
07-05-2010, 10:53 AM
Poplar and Limehouse still unanounced, dammit! :mad: If Galloway gets in I'm gonna feel sooo guilty for not voting for Alan Titch-, I mean Jim Fitzpatrick.

Yesterday I was all "Bollocks to tactical voting", but hey ho.

Surely Galloway stands no chance? It's the Tory or Jim F. He is a slimmer Titchmarsh, innee? Hadn't noticed that before.

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 10:56 AM
BNP w the fairly meagre 1.9% of the vote so far a definite positive takeaway.

i know Robinson had a bad time of it in Belfast East but i was expecting the DUP to maybe up to 10, that's another party the Tories go with. instead they have 8.

the three Greater Mcr seats that were Lib remain, and there are now two Gtr Mcr Tory seats (though that was to be expected in Bury North), up from one, pah... (oh and Phil Woolas' seat still up for grabs)

paolo
07-05-2010, 11:16 AM
If the tories can't form an overall majority but are big enough to take on Lib + Lab, what's likely to happen? Will they be able to form a minority government with support from the 'regional' parties to get stuff through? I don't really know enough about the SNP, PC etc to know how happy they'd be to sign up to whatever the Tories want in exchange for some devolutionary concessions...

SNP are centre-left. I'd be very surprised if the Tories made any serious devolutionary concessions, they were against the creation of the Scottish Parliament so it'd be a major u-turn if they did

hucks
07-05-2010, 11:18 AM
i know Robinson had a bad time of it in Belfast East


Has anyone had a shitter year than him?

Swing to Labour in Poplar!

mms
07-05-2010, 11:44 AM
intereresting to note that conservatives will find it alot more difficult to get a coalition running cos of the amount of bad blood around. poplar and limehouse went to lib dems
london is so so different from the rest of the uk it seems.

john eden
07-05-2010, 11:49 AM
That was one of the places where polls closed before everyone got to vote, wasn't it? Do you know if there's an estimate of the number of people who got turned away?

Yeah and there were rumours of sit ins also.

Vague stuff I've picked up on twitter suggests it's a few hundred people. Which sounds like a lot but certainly the margins in Hackney North are much bigger than that - Diane Abbott's majority was 8,000 last time.

Be interesting if anyone was turned away in marginals...

massrock
07-05-2010, 11:50 AM
Does anyone know of a chart that shows population density by region against party allegiance?

Slothrop
07-05-2010, 11:51 AM
Yeah and there were rumours of sit ins also.

Vague stuff I've picked up on twitter suggests it's a few hundred people. Which sounds like a lot but certainly the margins in Hackney North are much bigger than that - Diane Abbott's majority was 8,000 last time.

Be interesting if anyone was turned away in marginals...

Friend of mine's postal vote for Broxtowe (W Nottingham, basically) didn't show up, and that went tory with a margin of about 200. He's fairly gutted, although at least it was Nick 'I Love ID Cards' Palmer that went rather than someone actually good.

Mr. Tea
07-05-2010, 11:59 AM
poplar and limehouse went to lib dems


Say what? Nah, Jim F got back in for Labour with a healthy margin: http://news.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/election2010/results/constituency/d56.stm

LDs fourth behind Tories and Rispeck'.

samdiamond
07-05-2010, 12:06 PM
Say what? Nah, Jim F got back in for Labour with a healthy margin: http://news.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/election2010/results/constituency/d56.stm

LDs fourth behind Tories and Rispeck'.

Happy about this. Respect down 0.7% too

Mr. Tea
07-05-2010, 12:26 PM
According to the Beeb, the Lib Dems have achieved 27% percent of the popular vote, but fill just 52 seats which is less than 8%.

Labour's wound up with 28% of the popular vote! Fucksake. How does a system that allows that represent the will of the people?

Tentative Andy
07-05-2010, 12:34 PM
23% is what I'm seeing for Lib Dem. But yeah, the difference in seats one is way out of proportion to the difference in percentages of the vote.
I'd like to see a move towards electoral reform being made a part of any deals that are hammered out between the parties now, but in my heart I doubt it will happen.

crackerjack
07-05-2010, 12:37 PM
Labour didn't just win Poplar, they reamed 'em. Hard to believe the Tories were ever odds-on. Thought the Labour people there seemed quite confident when I was down there on Saturday.

Galloway didn't even show for the declaration, scummy little demagogic cunt that he is.

crackerjack
07-05-2010, 12:43 PM
Slaughter! (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/shared/election2010/results/constituency/a26.stm)

Gwan Rushanara.

The death of Respect.

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 12:53 PM
SNP are centre-left. I'd be very surprised if the Tories made any serious devolutionary concessions, they were against the creation of the Scottish Parliament so it'd be a major u-turn if they did

yes definitely you'd think?!

@Massrock, re density, did you see early last night one of the BBC people (either Maitlis or Vine) did something w a computer graphic that sort of showed a half-way workable answer to your density query? i forget now so i'm afraid less than useless response! though granted at the top end of density the major urban areas are fairly safely Lab and they are of course the most dense. (sorry to speak the obvious.)

London remains a bit more Tory than the other major provincial cities it seems.

chuffed for Ali in Bow!

massrock
07-05-2010, 02:00 PM
@Massrock, re density, did you see early last night one of the BBC people (either Maitlis or Vine) did something w a computer graphic that sort of showed a half-way workable answer to your density query?
I kept expecting Jeremy Vine to turn into Lawnmower Man so I was a bit distracted.

john eden
07-05-2010, 03:45 PM
lab increase majority in Hackney north and south.

mos dan
07-05-2010, 04:24 PM
Say what? Nah, Jim F got back in for Labour with a healthy margin: http://news.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/election2010/results/constituency/d56.stm

LDs fourth behind Tories and Rispeck'.

can i do a self-plug http://fivedials.com/fivedials

i didn't get paid for it so it feels less cheeky.. 3000 words of (ahem) reportage on the tories attempts to win poplar and limehouse.

hucks
07-05-2010, 04:41 PM
can i do a self-plug http://fivedials.com/fivedials

i didn't get paid for it so it feels less cheeky.. 3000 words of (ahem) reportage on the tories attempts to win poplar and limehouse.

I liked this, good read. Poplar itself (ie the bit near Poplar DLR station) is the weirdest place in London, imo. One half Blade Runner, one half Minder (Geroge Cole original, natch). Must absolutely do your head in to grow up there.

I can't really see how the Tories ever thought they would win there, and, reading that peice by Dan, they never really seemed to have an idea. If it weren't for Respect, they wouldn'thave got anywhere near Fitzpatrick.

Also, more good news! Barnbrook has lost his seat on B&D council. Hats off to Barking!

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 04:51 PM
Also, more good news! Barnbrook has lost his seat on B&D council. Hats off to Barking!

really?

get in.

vimothy
07-05-2010, 05:11 PM
Wow:


4.23pm: If you divide the number of votes each party received by the number of seats they won (as things stand now), you get these figures:

Conservatives: 35,021
Labour: 33,338
Liberal Democrat: 119,397

hucks
07-05-2010, 05:16 PM
really?

get in.

Yup. They've been wiped out - not a single seat on the council

http://www.hopenothate.org.uk/

scottdisco
07-05-2010, 05:33 PM
Yup. They've been wiped out - not a single seat on the council

http://www.hopenothate.org.uk/

lovely stuff, cheers hucks :)

@Vim, yes, that stat is starkly illustrative. isn't it also the case that for Greens the figure is about 200,000?!

Mr. Tea
07-05-2010, 06:03 PM
Replying to whoever it was that said "Tower Hamlets politics is weird, and shit" - I have to say, I voted "No" on the referendum on whether to have a 'mayor' for TH almost without hesitation. I think it'd just add another layer of bureaucracy, expense, potential corruption and general stupidity. Any Towerz boys here vote "Yes", perchance? I'd be interested to know what you think about this.

In other election news, I read that a BNP local council candidate has been chucked out of a pub in Croydon after a female supporter tossed him off (or something, the report is predictably vague) in full view of everyone. Apparently he was recently found guilty of attacking a couple of ANL types last year.

They really are the classiest party, aren't they? :D

crackerjack
07-05-2010, 07:17 PM
Replying to whoever it was that said "Tower Hamlets politics is weird, and shit" - I have to say, I voted "No" on the referendum on whether to have a 'mayor' for TH almost without hesitation. I think it'd just add another layer of bureaucracy, expense, potential corruption and general stupidity. Any Towerz boys here vote "Yes", perchance? I'd be interested to know what you think about this.


I voted 'no', though for different reasons - I'm not sure it would create extra bureaucracy, it would just allow the mayor to act as president, bypassing the council and creating his own administration. This is fine in somewhere the size of London, where people pay attention to what's happening. Less so in a borough council. Oh, and Respect and the IFE are the prime movers behind it, so that's an automatic no. Though I fear it will pass.

hucks
07-05-2010, 11:28 PM
Yeah, I don't think there will be enough bureaucracy. I voted no, too

crackerjack
07-05-2010, 11:44 PM
Respect proper dissed in council elections

http://www.towerhamlets.gov.uk/lgsl/701-750/721_election_results/2010_council_election_result.aspx

referendum result still not in

swears
08-05-2010, 02:55 AM
http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/johann-hari/johann-hari-what-well-lose-if-we-reject-labour-1964247.html

:mad::(

"Choosing the lesser of two evils isn't a bad thing. The cliche makes it sound bad, but it's a good thing. You get less evil"
- Noam Chomsky

jimitheexploder
08-05-2010, 04:54 AM
I live in the late constituency, Thirsk/Malton. We don't get to vote for another three weeks or so. Strange vibes around here. I'm use to a disconected vibe anyway, since I live out in the sticks but its amped up due to the election hype. You usualy get your say on the day and feel part of it all no matter what. But now its posponed, all the results are in apart from ours. Everyone is wondering what is going to go down with the hung parlement. We are too but we have the feeling that we're still yet to join in, but in the back of our minds we're thinkin that its all going to be decided before we even get to vote, I mean three weeks is a long time, we'll have a new PM before we get a say at this point. Its pretty strange. Its a bouns that I can just chill and vote later though, no cues and gettin turned away here, we've got weeks haha.

scottdisco
08-05-2010, 10:49 AM
I live in the late constituency, Thirsk/Malton. We don't get to vote for another three weeks or so. Strange vibes around here. I'm use to a disconected vibe anyway, since I live out in the sticks but its amped up due to the election hype. You usualy get your say on the day and feel part of it all no matter what. But now its posponed, all the results are in apart from ours. Everyone is wondering what is going to go down with the hung parlement. We are too but we have the feeling that we're still yet to join in, but in the back of our minds we're thinkin that its all going to be decided before we even get to vote, I mean three weeks is a long time, we'll have a new PM before we get a say at this point. Its pretty strange. Its a bouns that I can just chill and vote later though, no cues and gettin turned away here, we've got weeks haha.

yes i can't imagine what the vibe must be like in Thirsk, must be random. i gather the poor soul died a fortnight ago though i must admit i only started to hear about it on the day of Farage's escape...

...great use of a Chomsky quote there from Hari swears, nice one. very, very true.

don_quixote
09-05-2010, 10:18 AM
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/8667612.stm

don_quixote
09-05-2010, 10:26 AM
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/election-2010/7686463/Nigel-Farage-of-Ukip-plane-crash-in-pictures.html?image=1

dawn of the dead

don_quixote
09-05-2010, 11:47 AM
total no. of wasted votes by party:
lib dem 5,596,089
labour 3,600,427
con 3,529,549
others 2,941,927

15 million disenfranchised voters.

on the plus side, half a million bnp slips in the bin

Mr. Tea
09-05-2010, 12:09 PM
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/election-2010/7686463/Nigel-Farage-of-Ukip-plane-crash-in-pictures.html?image=1

dawn of the dead

Yeah, I saw that the other day, and that was my exact thought. Great photo!

paolo
09-05-2010, 12:22 PM
Is there any information avaialable on the turnout yet? I'd imagine that more people than usual voted, seeing as the overall result was by no means a foregone conclusion and that

don_quixote
09-05-2010, 12:40 PM
roughly 65%

scottdisco
09-05-2010, 01:17 PM
one of the many (caveat: many, many, which we could endlessly discuss if we want) interesting quirks is how well Labour did in Brum. obviously the large provincial cities in the midlands and north tend to be Labour areas throughout the conurbations (Labour reclaimed Liverpol from the Liberals) anyway (and Brum is no exception) but i believe there was actually an uptick in their share in many of that conurbation's seats.

this is interesting because for a start Birmingham borough council is the largest council in the UK by a mile and has had many upheavals recently thanks to a Lib Dem-Tory coalition under Mike Whitby taking over from Labour there.

scottdisco
09-05-2010, 01:20 PM
though granted Brum Edgbaston was an interesting seat. i see Brum Ladywood is one of three seats now represented by one of the first three women parliamentarians from a Muslim background.

don_quixote
09-05-2010, 02:52 PM
i thought redditch was birmingham?

scottdisco
09-05-2010, 03:20 PM
a very good point D_Q. i was more thinking of inner Brum conurbation seats like Ladywood and Warley tbf but still.

scottdisco
09-05-2010, 03:27 PM
this goes to show i should be safely ignored :cool:

scottdisco
09-05-2010, 07:38 PM
actually although there's no firm pattern in Brum (w a mix of Tory seats in the outer conurbation, a couple of Liberal too and a lot of Labour in the inner conurbation *) three of the inner seats (inc Ladywood, the most deprived constituency in the UK i believe though it also includes the glitzy Mailbox development on the city's southside, and Hodge Hill, another seat w huge pockets of deprivation) did see a swing from Liberal to Labour.

the recent take-over of Brum city council by a Tory-Liberal alliance might be one factor in this. a mate of mine who has been a lifelong Lib Dem voter switched to Labour for the first time ever. he works in the public sector for Brum council. if Liberal Democrat and Tory negotiation talks are successful, we might even see Brum be a sort of canary down the mine (well i know there are quite a few Lib-Tory coalitions in local govt but seems fair to mention Brum given its size).

* i didn't know Redditch seat is actually south of Bromsgrove. that's rather suburban tbf.

don_quixote
09-05-2010, 08:57 PM
yeah i was a little confused i think, just associate redditch with brum. i'm surprised with nottinghamshire going so blue for similar reasons, the new tory council in nottinghamshire has been an absolute disaster by all accounts and kays the head of the council is notorious. the tory swing in nottmshire was enough to see labour mps go but theyre all very narrow. nick palmer lost by around 300 votes in broxtowe.

leicestershire on the other hand has always been very blue. still surprised at the margins in loughborough and nw leics. david taylor probably would have held his seat if he were still alive and contested, but he was going to stand down anyway.

i honestly believe we could have a hung parliament for a while. gordon brown will go before the next general election and labour should be stronger without him now. enough to turn some of those new marginals red at least.

scottdisco
09-05-2010, 09:15 PM
yeah i was a little confused i think, just associate redditch with brum. i'm surprised with nottinghamshire going so blue for similar reasons, the new tory council in nottinghamshire has been an absolute disaster by all accounts and kays the head of the council is notorious. the tory swing in nottmshire was enough to see labour mps go but theyre all very narrow. nick palmer lost by around 300 votes in broxtowe.

leicestershire on the other hand has always been very blue. still surprised at the margins in loughborough and nw leics. david taylor probably would have held his seat if he were still alive and contested, but he was going to stand down anyway.

i honestly believe we could have a hung parliament for a while. gordon brown will go before the next general election and labour should be stronger without him now. enough to turn some of those new marginals red at least.

yeah i saw about Loughborough, i share your surprise. i mean, a good good showing for the Tory party.
and Notts council has been proper slash and burn hasn't it?

those results are interesting read through that light.

tangential: aren't certain bits of Leics - alongside north Yorks and the Cheshire Set - the wealthiest places outside the south east in the country?

from a Labour pov out of realistic alternatives if Cruddas can deliver David M, i think that is about the best to hope for. of course the heart says it'd be nice if John McDonnell were to launch a palace coup but...

don_quixote
09-05-2010, 10:00 PM
well since notts county council is so close to the centre of the city (labour council) there's huge fusses about tram extensions and the world cup bid. loughborough is a surprise because in general andy reed i thought was a decent bloke.

and yes, parts of leics are wealthy. i live near some. check this street out:

ridgeway, rothley (http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=ridgeway+rothley&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=13.022672,39.506836&ie=UTF8&hq=ridgeway&hnear=Rothley,+Leicester,+UK&ll=52.708102,-1.153323&spn=0.001628,0.004823&t=h&z=18)

that's the most expensive postcode in the east midlands

don_quixote
09-05-2010, 10:02 PM
no, that is not a hotel (http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Ulverscroft+Lane&sll=52.709363,-1.151687&sspn=0.003257,0.009645&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Ulverscroft+Ln,+Newtown+Linford,+Leicester+L E6+0AJ,+United+Kingdom&ll=52.700314,-1.244566&spn=0.006515,0.01929&t=h&z=16)

fuck me they have their own bloody golf course.

don_quixote
09-05-2010, 10:03 PM
this lot have a helicopter parked in their garden (http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Ulverscroft+Lane&sll=52.709363,-1.151687&sspn=0.003257,0.009645&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Ulverscroft+Ln,+Newtown+Linford,+Leicester+L E6+0AJ,+United+Kingdom&ll=52.715379,-1.276249&spn=0.001628,0.004823&t=h&z=18)

is it any surprise the tories keep getting elected?

scottdisco
09-05-2010, 10:05 PM
and yes, parts of leics are wealthy. i live near some. check this street out:

ridgeway, rothley (http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=ridgeway+rothley&sll=53.800651,-4.064941&sspn=13.022672,39.506836&ie=UTF8&hq=ridgeway&hnear=Rothley,+Leicester,+UK&ll=52.708102,-1.153323&spn=0.001628,0.004823&t=h&z=18)

that's the most expensive postcode in the east midlands

that just actually made me raise my eyebrows. good lord! swimming pools FTW...


this lot have a helicopter parked in their garden (http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=Ulverscroft+Lane&sll=52.709363,-1.151687&sspn=0.003257,0.009645&ie=UTF8&hq=&hnear=Ulverscroft+Ln,+Newtown+Linford,+Leicester+L E6+0AJ,+United+Kingdom&ll=52.715379,-1.276249&spn=0.001628,0.004823&t=h&z=18)

i am actually gurning when i click on this.

Slothrop
09-05-2010, 10:50 PM
nick palmer lost by around 300 votes in broxtowe.
Couldn't have happened to a nicer bloke...

scottdisco
09-05-2010, 10:59 PM
well since notts county council is so close to the centre of the city (labour council) there's huge fusses about tram extensions

i found this particularly interesting.

and re the Notts tram: it's not a bad system is it? (in my limited experience.) i was impressed you can get it out to Hucknall (non-league footy reasons in my case of course!).

the tram system in Manchester is pretty ropey.

don_quixote
10-05-2010, 07:07 AM
honestly ive never caught it because i dont live in nottm, my sister rates it though. hucknall town are a horrible football club!!!

crackerjack
10-05-2010, 10:20 AM
from a Labour pov out of realistic alternatives if Cruddas can deliver David M, i think that is about the best to hope for. of course the heart says it'd be nice if John McDonnell were to launch a palace coup but...

JMc would be a disaster. I like the sound of Cruddas and wish there was someone better for him to deputise than Miliband Snr (Jnr would be better but won't stand against big brother, they say).

Balls should be bound and gagged until it's all over.

scottdisco
10-05-2010, 10:32 AM
JMc would be a disaster. I like the sound of Cruddas and wish there was someone better for him to deputise than Miliband Snr (Jnr would be better but won't stand against big brother, they say).

Balls should be bound and gagged until it's all over.

i saw an interview from Parliament Square w Jnr the other day and he really impressed me. i don't mind Snr but he's definitely more patrician.

(good start of a salt-and-pepper vibe w that white streak he's got at the front of his hair, too.)

Jack Dromey's a bit feisty, eh?! saw an interview of his the other day and he was on proper fighting form.

i can see i have my work cut out if i want to steal the fragrant Harriet away from him.

Slothrop
10-05-2010, 10:35 AM
honestly ive never caught it because i dont live in nottm, my sister rates it though.
It seemed quite good and fairly popular when I was there, and an extension to the university and Beeston looks like a no-brainer. But
a) tram systems are bloody expensive to install - they're just about justified because they'll often get people who would never even consider getting a bus to leave the car at home, but it is kind of marginal and
b) it's a big noisy engineering project, and people who live too near the route are, as always, convinced that there's some spectacularly good reason that while they approve of it in principle there's some very compelling reason that it should go by some slightly different route that just happens to not go past their house.

scottdisco
10-05-2010, 10:47 AM
It seemed quite good and fairly popular when I was there, and an extension to the university and Beeston looks like a no-brainer. But
a) tram systems are bloody expensive to install - they're just about justified because they'll often get people who would never even consider getting a bus to leave the car at home, but it is kind of marginal and
b) it's a big noisy engineering project, and people who live too near the route are, as always, convinced that there's some spectacularly good reason that while they approve of it in principle there's some very compelling reason that it should go by some slightly different route that just happens to not go past their house.

well said.

anyone been on the Sheffield or Croydon ones? the Tyne and Wear underground train system is good i think, out to the coast, inner Nwc, down to Sunderland.

the Mcr one ended up w the council having to use compulsory purchase orders (pretty sure Mcr council is a leader in this, alongside truancy rates and ASBOs; neighbouring Salford uses a lot of CPOs i believe too) on shifting out folk from one small area of Baguley in Wythenshawe, s Mcr, cuz the Wythenshawe extension was going to go through there. pensioners and such who had lived in these houses forever, and the houses went to clear the route.

the punchline to this is that the Wythenshawe line is not happening now (when the council lost the congestion charge vote some of the extra money they had planned on evaporated, so they scaled down the new lines from 4 to 3: ie s Mcr, Rochdale and Oldham, and Ashton out east, leaving the W'shawe line in the air). i'm pretty sure this bit of the W'shawe line (that involved the Baguley CPOs) had evaporated even before the congestion charge debate, but still.

i mean there were a lot of demolishments, in Denton, e Mcr, Ashton, Pendlebury in Salford etc, but i believe the Baguley case might have been the only one where the council took the CPO route, think other areas were voluntary purchase.

Mr. Tea
10-05-2010, 11:10 AM
Clearing pensioners' houses for a tram line that wasn't even built in the end? God, that's terrible. :(

I can't comment on trams in this country because, as far as I can remember, I've never used one, but the tram service in Geneva is pretty cool. It's somehow disproportionately exciting to be riding a public conveyance that seems like a cross between a train and a bus.

Geneva also has electric buses that run off overhead power lines. I actually miss the crackle, flash and faint whiff of ozone... :D

crackerjack
10-05-2010, 11:19 AM
Clearing pensioners' houses for a tram line that wasn't even built in the end? God, that's terrible. :(

Hey, if it got them out of Wythenshawe it's not all bad ;)


i can see i have my work cut out if i want to steal the fragrant Harriet away from him.

:eek:

baboon2004
10-05-2010, 11:55 AM
http://www.avaaz.org/en/fair_votes_now/?cl=570785712&v=6165

Not sure how much difference it'll make, but i've signed... :slanted:

crackerjack
10-05-2010, 12:17 PM
So out of curiosity, if, as seems likely, LDs jump ino the Blue bed, how many of the LDs here would still consider voting for them at the next election?

baboon2004
10-05-2010, 12:26 PM
So out of curiosity, if, as seems likely, LDs jump ino the Blue bed, how many of the LDs here would still consider voting for them at the next election?

i was already regretting voting for them by friday morning :slanted: . Not that my vote meant anything in a safe Labour seat anyways....or is likely to mean anything in the future...

crackerjack
10-05-2010, 03:10 PM
So it sounds like the deal is done, on the basis of a Commons free vote for a PR referendum.

As face-savers go, it's gonna fool next to no one.

Irf I'm being kind, I'd concede Clegg was in a shit position, that a deal with Labour was near impossible (damned with Brown, damned without him, and either way still a minority) and one relying on Nats would've been catastrophic, especially for Labour.

As a Labour supporter, this is the best possible news for our party, as the LDs should lose at least 5% of that 23%, a good chunk of it to us. And we get to dodge the immediate blame for these incoming cuts.

Trouble is, it leaves the Etonians swinging the axe... Fuck:(:eek:

edit: Oh, and if anyone can get a pic of the next Guardian editorial meeting...

don_quixote
10-05-2010, 05:15 PM
they reckon that this could put off up to 1 in 4 lib dem voters which would be enough for 55 conservative seats to switch to labour and at least 15 lib dem seats to switch to labour - could be looking at a labour majority if an election is called.

don_quixote
10-05-2010, 05:17 PM
woah, lib-lab-nat alliance in the balance now, with brown leaving. clegg for pm?

hucks
10-05-2010, 05:22 PM
God, I hope not. Though the thought of a ConDem alliance with the poor ickle Lib Dems eaten alive is unpleasant, too.

Jesus, every single option is unpalatable, isn't it?

don_quixote
10-05-2010, 05:47 PM
another general election isn't so bad

crackerjack
10-05-2010, 05:51 PM
woah, lib-lab-nat alliance in the balance now, with brown leaving. clegg for pm?

If it happens, then it has to be Clegg. The prospect of a 'coalition of the losers' led by an 'unelected' PM would see all involved roasted next time out.

grizzleb
10-05-2010, 08:36 PM
If it happens, then it has to be Clegg. The prospect of a 'coalition of the losers' led by an 'unelected' PM would see all involved roasted next time out.Miliband next PM. There's no way the smallest party would get the top job. It's not a presidential system, it's parliamentary. Whoever gets in will get roasted next time round regardless, lib dems need to take that on the chin and angle for PR. I like to think Clegg has been astute by engaging both the tories and labour in talks, looks like the prospect of a bidding war on electoral reform has already started - labour have offered immediate bill on alternate vote pushed through the commons and a subsequent referendum on PR. Looking like a not bad situation to be in for das libs, considering they done so poorly.

grave
10-05-2010, 08:51 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1gkHwU4DRA8

crackerjack
10-05-2010, 08:57 PM
I ws just about to post that

Boulton's lost it

grizzleb
10-05-2010, 09:06 PM
That's fucking hilarious.

crackerjack
10-05-2010, 09:08 PM
This is all too surreal.

Think I might have an evening of Thick Of It to bring a dose of reality.

crackerjack
10-05-2010, 09:13 PM
Ha ha, missed this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=roRAUpph1UM

A very reasonable response to Kay Burley's disgraceful interview with Saturday's demo spokesman.

Sectionfive
10-05-2010, 09:34 PM
Boulton made a complete prick of himself.
Imagine working for sky news and getting pissed off when some tells you how to think.
Does he not get that every day ?

don_quixote
10-05-2010, 09:45 PM
i think i'd take a con-lib coalition

a lab-lib coalition would be ok in the short term and a disaster in the long term

baboon2004
10-05-2010, 10:03 PM
why don't we just invite Obama to come and run the country?

crackerjack
10-05-2010, 10:06 PM
i think i'd take a con-lib coalition

a lab-lib coalition would be ok in the short term and a disaster in the long term

ideal scenario: this is a cunning plan to bounce the Tories into upping their offer. I can't believe Labour want to cling on here, it'll be an electoral disaster

don_quixote
10-05-2010, 10:16 PM
couldn't agree more

scottdisco
11-05-2010, 08:31 AM
I ws just about to post that

Boulton's lost it

i could have told you that on election night ;)

droid
11-05-2010, 10:16 AM
Ha ha, missed this.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=roRAUpph1UM

A very reasonable response to Kay Burley's disgraceful interview with Saturday's demo spokesman.


LOL. Thank you.

baboon2004
11-05-2010, 12:42 PM
No-one's asked the real question here - how can the Tories be so rubbish as to be 13 years in opposition and STILL not win against an ailing government in a financial crisis? It's Labour in 1992 again (except they did even worse, of course). Shocking indictment of their ability to, well, do anything.

massrock
11-05-2010, 12:48 PM
That and that the majority of voters don't want them in government.

grizzleb
11-05-2010, 12:48 PM
No-one's asked the real question here - how can the Tories be so rubbish as to be 13 years in opposition and STILL not win against an ailing government in a financial crisis? It's Labour in 1992 again (except they did even worse, of course). Shocking indictment of their ability to, well, do anything.
Yeah, Cameron has been lauded, for the last 3 years it's seemed like it was fated that he would get an outright majority. I have to say I find it extremely satisfying that he's fucked it up. I think the Labour message about 'We're trying to secure the recovery/Gordon Brown has done well in the financial crisis/The Tories will cut jobs" all got through to the electorate - purely from anecdotal evidence. But for loads of folk I spoke to prior to the election who aren't that fussed about politics that was what they were telling me. Fear of Tory cuts is still strong, regardless of what has happened under Labour. I'm tempted to say that the financial crisis is one of the reasons there wasn't a total Labour implosion... :confused:

Mr. Tea
11-05-2010, 01:03 PM
I think the Labour message about 'We're trying to secure the recovery/Gordon Brown has done well in the financial crisis/The Tories will cut jobs" all got through to the electorate

...and this, despite the paucity of Labour propaganda! Did anyone else notice that there was far, far more election prop' from the Tories than the incumbents? I mean, I know I live in a safe Labour seat so maybe they just didn't bother so much here, but all across town you had Cameron's big posh spoony face staring down at you (as well as a glowering Brown, but on Tory posters) - and hardly any Labour stuff at all. I read a year or two ago that the Tories' campaign budget was bigger than Labour's several times over, and I can certainly believe it.



Fear of Tory cuts is still strong

That missing 'n' again, eh? ;)

I agree, someone's going to have to swing that axe but it could fall in very different places depending on who's wielding it. [/crappy extended metaphor]

grizzleb
11-05-2010, 01:11 PM
That missing 'n' again, eh? ;)
Hahaha.

Yeah the axe thing holds up.

craner
11-05-2010, 03:37 PM
Everyone seems to have forgotten that we don't actually elect a Prime Minister. We only elect MPs. MPs elect Prime Ministers.

I watch Sky News quite a lot, although I admit that this has a lot to do with weather girl Lucy Verasamy.

Talking of TV, surely this is the election where the Paxman Type ran its course? Is Huw Edwards the way forward?

craner
11-05-2010, 03:42 PM
Who was that horrible slag at the Sky Leader's debate?

craner
11-05-2010, 03:45 PM
She was no Emily Maitlis.

Slothrop
11-05-2010, 03:48 PM
Everyone seems to have forgotten that we don't actually elect a Prime Minister. We only elect MPs. MPs elect Prime Ministers.
Not to mention that the lib dems don't have any particular duty to base their decisions on the wishes of people who didn't vote for them - so the fact that the tories have more votes / seats than labour doesn't mean jack. The level of moaning from disgruntled tories at the moment is pathetic. If 'the people' wanted your party in power they could have fucking voted for them.

If it had been a socialist / trades unionist party well to the left of labour that people were looking to form coalitions with, noone would be saying that the people have spoken and they should only be considering allying themselves with the tories because representative democracy doesn't work like that.

grizzleb
11-05-2010, 04:05 PM
Totally agree. All this chat of 'it's clear who lost the election' or 'it's a coalition of the losers' is laughable. If a majority of parties can work something out then surely that's entirely justified. LOL at any moaning Tories.

crackerjack
11-05-2010, 04:27 PM
Everyone seems to have forgotten that we don't actually elect a Prime Minister. We only elect MPs. MPs elect Prime Ministers.


Well, yes, just another reason why the leaders debates were a ton of guff. if they were gonna happen, they should've done 4 debates - one with each of the great offices, all at prime-time, not shunted off to the small hours, leading up to the final one with the leaders.

Instead we got absurd hullabaloo about some pretty tepid TV shows and now we're meant to accept that we have some de facto presidential system. Fuck. Right. Off.

And Sky should be burned to the ground.

And its ashes sprinkled on James Murdoch's toast.

For the rest of his life.

crackerjack
11-05-2010, 04:28 PM
But, back to the main issue...

The old party animals are right, Lab should reject any deal with the LDs as too unstable cos of the need to bring in Nats.

hucks
11-05-2010, 04:46 PM
But, back to the main issue...

The old party animals are right, Lab should reject any deal with the LDs as too unstable cos of the need to bring in Nats.

Which sems to be what they've done. Cameron to be announced as PM tonight, apparently.

Edit: Actually, that's going too far. But seems that a Lib Con deal has been struck, and the parties now need to sign up to it.

crackerjack
11-05-2010, 05:17 PM
Which sems to be what they've done. Cameron to be announced as PM tonight, apparently.

Edit: Actually, that's going too far. But seems that a Lib Con deal has been struck, and the parties now need to sign up to it.

Good.

This is fascinating reading. (http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/wintour-and-watt/2010/may/11/david-cameron-nick-clegg)

Crackerjack prediction: the referendum bill only passes with the help of Labour votes.

paolo
11-05-2010, 06:13 PM
Say what you like about Cameron* but the Tories did get more votes than any other party...







*One of Mogwai said that he looks like C3PO made out of ham

Mr. Tea
11-05-2010, 06:57 PM
Say what you like about Cameron* but the Tories did get more votes than any other party...


Therein lies democracy's fundamental flaw: idiots get to choose who runs the country.

crackerjack
11-05-2010, 07:22 PM
apparently the right aren't happy about sharing power with the old limpwristed libbys and have extracted their price in cabinet seats

so it won't just be Hague, Fox and Grayling (assuming her survives) keeping it real for the headbanger tendency in the new govt

if CalllMeDave keeps everybody happy for more than 5 mins, maybe he is the great leader The Sun are pretending he is

Webstarr
11-05-2010, 08:15 PM
apparently the right aren't happy about sharing power with the old limpwristed libbys and have extracted their price in cabinet seats

so it won't just be Hague, Fox and Grayling (assuming her survives) keeping it real for the headbanger tendency in the new govt

if CalllMeDave keeps everybody happy for more than 5 mins, maybe he is the great leader The Sun are pretending he is

appart from cleggy weggy (I assume), which lib dems are likely to be offered cabinet positions then?

Slothrop
11-05-2010, 08:24 PM
if CalllMeDave keeps everybody happy for more than 5 mins, maybe he is the great leader The Sun are pretending he is
Let's not ignore the fact that his not actually winning the election outright despite being up against a government that had managed to make themselve less popular than herpes and having most of the press queueing up to fellate him isn't exactly going to strengthen his position.

crackerjack
11-05-2010, 08:26 PM
appart from cleggy weggy (I assume), which lib dems are likely to be offered cabinet positions then?

You know, I'm still embarrassed but my total ignorance of the leading LDs (I'm not even totally au fait with all the Tories). So, er, King Vince, obviously; Huhne, I'd guess. Er, um....Sarah Teather?

I saw someone mention six, but that seems a bit much to me.

crackerjack
11-05-2010, 08:28 PM
Let's not ignore the fact that his not actually winning the election outright despite being up against a government that had managed to make themselve less popular than herpes and having most of the press queueing up to fellate him isn't exactly going to strengthen his position.

Oh, exactly. That's why there was all this going-the-extra-mileage. If he'd stuck around waitiing for the Lab-Lib-Nat coaliton to collapse there's a very good chance he wouldn't have been in the ring for round two.

hucks
11-05-2010, 08:50 PM
Is there someone called Laws?

Anyway, seeing Cameron outside Number 10 was pretty fucking miserable, even it wasn't the triumphalist horror it could have been

Slothrop
11-05-2010, 09:00 PM
Apparently Simon Hughes is in "the radical centre-left of the party."

swears
11-05-2010, 09:48 PM
Ah fuck. Fuck fuck fuck.

IdleRich
11-05-2010, 09:51 PM
That's gotta be the end of the Lib Dems.

Leo
11-05-2010, 10:36 PM
Ah fuck. Fuck fuck fuck.

i remember the feeling, when bush was elected. twice.

massrock
11-05-2010, 10:41 PM
It's horrible, but...

The other option wasn't really going to work, and Labour would have been nuts to go for it under the circumstances.

The Lib Dems could have left the Tories to a precarious minority government but would that really have been preferable to having at least some direct influence and people in government positions? (On principle I think it might have been actually.)

massrock
11-05-2010, 10:53 PM
Am guessing a lot of Lib Dem voters must feel pretty shafted.

IdleRich
11-05-2010, 10:55 PM
The Lib Dems could have left the Tories to a precarious minority government but would that really have been preferable to having at least some direct influence and people in government positions?
Well, the amount of influence they will have will not be large and at the next election they will be wiped out. I know loads of people who voted for the LDs precisely to stop Cameron and to see their vote go to him will constitute a massive betrayal. Seems like short-sighted short-termism to me.

Slothrop
11-05-2010, 10:58 PM
Well, the amount of influence they will have will not be large and at the next election they will be wiped out. I know loads of people who voted for the LDs precisely to stop Cameron
The grauniad for starters.

craner
11-05-2010, 11:03 PM
Poetic justice will come when blue and yellow party activists start going at their leaders like packs of piranhas -- while Labour can sit back and sort themselves out in leisure. Rumours of an existential crisis (and bankruptcy) have been wildfly overstated. Didn't Sarah look lovely in dusk blue?

crackerjack
12-05-2010, 12:25 AM
Poetic justice will come when blue and yellow party activists start going at their leaders like packs of piranhas -- while Labour can sit back and sort themselves out in leisure. Rumours of an existential crisis (and bankruptcy) have been wildfly overstated. Didn't Sarah look lovely in dusk blue?

Wot Craner said (except it should've been 'at leisure', not 'in').

scottdisco
12-05-2010, 10:44 AM
i am surprised that a party who have joined up w the Tories across eighteen councils - even where Lab has been the biggest party - in order to take over, and then merrily push through the Tory agenda, w out any ameliorating influence to soften Tory blows, would join them nationally, especially when the Tories offered them the best deal. i mean, you never saw it coming a mile off or anything, so i can quite understand any hypothetical liberal voter upset.

we'll be hearing that a quintessentially metropolitan, middle-class-in-the-pejorative-sense publication comprised of such luminaries as anarcho-Tory loon Simon Jenkins and Blairite shill Martin Kettle endorsed them at the election next.

(incidentally i note Cable's recent Keynesianism - which of course frankly he'd have to have been a tool not to - hasn't been enough to make him sign up to the Beveridge Group rolls. Clegg isn't a member, naturally.)

crackerjack
12-05-2010, 10:55 AM
i am surprised that a party who have joined up w the Tories across eighteen councils - even where Lab has been the biggest party - in order to take over, and then merrily push through the Tory agenda, w out any ameliorating influence to soften Tory blows, would join them nationally, especially when the Tories offered them the best deal. i mean, you never saw it coming a mile off or anything, so i can quite understand any hypothetical liberal voter upset.

we'll be hearing that a quintessentially metropolitan, middle-class-in-the-pejorative-sense publication comprised of such luminaries as anarcho-Tory loon Simon Jenkins and Blairite shill Martin Kettle endorsed them at the election next.

(incidentally i note Cable's recent Keynesianism - which of course frankly he'd have to have been a tool not to - hasn't been enough to make him sign up to the Beveridge Group rolls. Clegg isn't a member, naturally.)

Ha ha

baboon2004
12-05-2010, 11:01 AM
Hmm, depressing. But an electorate gets what it deserves.

Though I'm still somewhat convinced that with a significantly higher turnout than 65 per cent, the Tories could never win.

matt b
12-05-2010, 11:12 AM
Going to Eton "not a handicap" shocker (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/8622933.stm)

"The success of David Cameron in becoming Conservative leader and now prime minister would suggest [fears that having been to Eton was a handicap] were premature.

In fact, when Mr Cameron unveiled his first front-bench team, it included 13 people from his old school.

[...]present-day pupils, he says, are well aware of this.

"There's a renewed confidence that there is no reason that having been here, we should suffer thereby.

"We can do what we want to do in life. Etonians are back on the scene." "


Thank God the rich are back in their proper place, eh?

They were downtrodden throughout the prime ministership of the privately educated Blair- hoodies ran parliament.

Back to the natural order of things

john eden
12-05-2010, 11:18 AM
fuck's sake.

crackerjack
12-05-2010, 11:31 AM
Going to Eton "not a handicap" shocker (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/8622933.stm)

"The success of David Cameron in becoming Conservative leader and now prime minister would suggest [fears that having been to Eton was a handicap] were premature.

In fact, when Mr Cameron unveiled his first front-bench team, it included 13 people from his old school.

[...]present-day pupils, he says, are well aware of this.

"There's a renewed confidence that there is no reason that having been here, we should suffer thereby.

"We can do what we want to do in life. Etonians are back on the scene." "


Thank God the rich are back in their proper place, eh?

They were downtrodden throughout the prime ministership of the privately educated Blair- hoodies ran parliament.

Back to the natural order of things

Is that a direct quote from Cam? Jesus Christ.

mistersloane
12-05-2010, 11:47 AM
Given that some people were denied their constitutional right to vote, why hasn't the entire election been declared void? Genuine question.

craner
12-05-2010, 11:49 AM
Oh, come on, how hard can it be to get to a polling station by half past nine at night?

scottdisco
12-05-2010, 11:52 AM
i'm just grateful that instead of that Home Counties posho Prescott w his suspiciously smooth, blue-chip lobbying background & elite education, we finally have in Nick Clegg a decent working class Deputy PM w a solid trades union background who can reach out to the people of Wales, Scotland, Northern Ireland, the urban north and midlands, inner and exurban London, and marginal parts of the southwest and south coast.

mistersloane
12-05-2010, 11:54 AM
Oh, come on, how hard can it be to get to a polling station by half past nine at night?

Thanks for that answer, that really clears it up for me.

Slothrop
12-05-2010, 11:55 AM
Going to Eton "not a handicap" shocker (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/election_2010/8622933.stm)

"The success of David Cameron in becoming Conservative leader and now prime minister would suggest [fears that having been to Eton was a handicap] were premature.

In fact, when Mr Cameron unveiled his first front-bench team, it included 13 people from his old school.

[...]present-day pupils, he says, are well aware of this.

"There's a renewed confidence that there is no reason that having been here, we should suffer thereby.

"We can do what we want to do in life. Etonians are back on the scene." "

Needs more Obama comparisons.

baboon2004
12-05-2010, 11:56 AM
Given that some people were denied their constitutional right to vote, why hasn't the entire election been declared void? Genuine question.

Because this country thinks it's above that...

That picture of the Queen and Cameron yesterday made me feel physically sick.

craner
12-05-2010, 11:56 AM
Incidentally, what an odious little toe rag Danny Alexander is. Bad luck Scotland!

Also, Mandelson has gone from pantomine villian to coolest cat in British politics. How deft was this? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIxsVus15ac)

jenks
12-05-2010, 12:00 PM
Also, Mandelson has gone from pantomine villian to coolest cat in British politics. How deft was this? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KIxsVus15ac)

My wife couldn't believe me when i started making approving noises about Mandelson but I think he has come across well - less sharp, less machiavellian - has he become more camp or have I just not noticed it before?

As i posted some where else - that careers' teacher at Eton must be pretty good;)

scottdisco
12-05-2010, 12:06 PM
Needs more Obama comparisons.

is Barack Obama the American Nick Clegg?

etc

Sectionfive
12-05-2010, 12:06 PM
Given that some people were denied their constitutional right to vote, why hasn't the entire election been declared void? Genuine question.


All this can be avoided next time. I know where theres a few e-voting machines going cheap.

craner
12-05-2010, 12:10 PM
Thanks for that answer, that really clears it up for me.

Well, I mean, really. What were those people doing all day?

mistersloane
12-05-2010, 12:17 PM
Well, I mean, really. What were those people doing all day?

Didn't the ones who weren't getting stoned queue for three hours though?

baboon2004
12-05-2010, 12:19 PM
"In his Sheffield Hallam constituency, Liberal Democrat leader Nick Clegg went to offer his apologies to frustrated voters at a polling station in Ranmoor after they queued for more than three hours."

Lots of people going along to vote at about 9-ish, after getting back from work, got turned away...

craner
12-05-2010, 12:20 PM
Wasn't it a bunch of students in Sheffield who all decided, in the pub at about 7pm, to pile down the polling station for a vote? Buttheads.

craner
12-05-2010, 12:22 PM
At 9-ish, after work? Who was that, then? After work is 5-ish.

baboon2004
12-05-2010, 12:28 PM
People who have kids and other responsibilities, or who don't live round the corner from polling stations! They should probably run from 10am til midnight, ot something like that - who goes to vote at 7am?

mistersloane
12-05-2010, 12:30 PM
At 9-ish, after work? Who was that, then? After work is 5-ish.

Cinema workers. Shops open til late now too you know!

Mr. Tea
12-05-2010, 12:31 PM
At 9-ish, after work? Who was that, then? After work is 5-ish.

People doing shift work? Doctors and nurses, for a start. Or students with evening bar jobs. Mature students taking evening classes. Loads of people could be busy for pretty much most of the day until 9ish.

craner
12-05-2010, 12:37 PM
Presumably, if they finish work at 9, they could get down the polling station before work then? People not getting to polling station on time does not = void election, banana republic.

scottdisco
12-05-2010, 12:43 PM
At 9-ish, after work? Who was that, then? After work is 5-ish.

at least two of my mates worked 12 hour shifts on election day. they managed to vote.

stations were open 7a-10p (well, in theory at least).

a, say, 14 hour shift would be problematic, granted, but you can apply for a postal vote beforehand, as people obviously know shift patterns in advance as a rule, don't they (often very far in advance, certainly in my experience in call centres, factories, etc, though i have quite a lot of shift mates who tend to know a week or two or so, which is not much).

there are ways around it. a few constituencies that were overwhelmed by the turnout is very sad and a huge pain, but given the relatively low numbers involved, kicking off w this new unity govt is the only way forward (viz. k-punk's Capitalist Realism, etc). to contemplate voiding it all for, what, hundreds (i saw one report that said it could be into the thousands which sadly i can well believe) of missed voters is, unfortunately, not going to happen.

(i'd like it to, heck, if only so i can dream on a Labour landslide in a new election, w TUSC picking up a decent vote, but i don't think that will happen...)

if liberals can join up w the Tories in at least 18 local authorities (as i said upthread), even when Labour was the biggest local party, to eagerly carry out a Tory agenda, they are not going to spoil any chance they have of voting reform nationally because some students in Hallam and Withington * (which are LD seats, tbf) sadly, didn't get to use their democratic right to vote.

i see this new cabinet's looking very 'Lib Dem' template, ie white and male.

* i know they were hardly the only constituencies affected, sadly, but my memories are the most vivid of seeing TV reports from those two seats, tbf


Presumably, if they finish work at 9, they could get down the polling station before work then? People not getting to polling station on time does not = void election, banana republic.

ah.
Oliver just said everything i said, except better and quicker.

if there's one thing it may do, it may bring about some nimble thinking about extended hours, or better use of technology, or whatever, next time. onwards and upwards and all that...

matt b
12-05-2010, 12:44 PM
Is that a direct quote from Cam? Jesus Christ.

nah from an ex-eton teacher

mistersloane
12-05-2010, 12:50 PM
Presumably, if they finish work at 9, they could get down the polling station before work then? People not getting to polling station on time does not = void election, banana republic.

They did get to the polling station on time though. Go back to bed and come back a nice person.

Slothrop
12-05-2010, 12:51 PM
Presumably, if they finish work at 9, they could get down the polling station before work then? People not getting to polling station on time does not = void election, banana republic.
I see why 'could' has anything to do with it. It's not like the polling cards said "7am-10pm, arrive before 7pm to avoid disappointment".

I don't think it makes any significant difference overall, but it's definitely a failure of the polling stations, not the voters. If you tell people they can vote any time before 10pm, don't be surprised when they turn up any time before 10pm.

baboon2004
12-05-2010, 12:53 PM
I see why 'could' has anything to do with it. It's not like the polling cards said "7am-10pm, arrive before 7pm to avoid disappointment".

I don't think it makes any significant difference overall, but it's definitely a failure of the polling stations, not the voters. If you tell people they can vote any time before 10pm, don't be surprised when they turn up any time before 10pm.

Agreed. Way more people wanted to vote after work, so why couldn't the polling stations be open later (even if this means inconveiencing the TV stations by having the result the next day)? Surely the system should be set up to benefit the most voters, not to inconvenience them, otherwise we might as well have polling stations open from 10 til 4...

mistersloane
12-05-2010, 12:54 PM
to contemplate voiding it all for, what, hundreds (i saw one report that said it could be into the thousands which sadly i can well believe) of missed voters is, unfortunately, not going to happen.

.

who decides this, specifically. you seem to be saying that "the government" has decided this is "in our best interests". I'm just wondering who makes these sort of decisions when things do - as they have - gone wrong. I know Liberty are all over it, but who's decision is it?

scottdisco
12-05-2010, 12:59 PM
who decides this, specifically. you seem to be saying that "the government" has decided this is "in our best interests". I'm just wondering who makes these sort of decisions when things do - as they have - gone wrong. I know Liberty are all over it, but who's decision is it?

i honestly don't know sloane. as you saw from my post upthread, i don't like it any more than anyone else, and feel very sorry for people who wanted to vote but were not able to. it's business as usual. (w the emphasis here being on the word business.)

there's a committee that will 'look into it' (or whatevs), an independent electoral body, but you can hardly imagine even if they find massive fault a few months down the line they can do anything more than make it better for the next time. none of us expect them to have the power to call a snap re-election, alas.

in one way (and i write this at least slightly tongue-in-cheek), it's almost living up to typically British stereotypes. ie the stations and election personnel were overwhelmed in an almost charming-if-it-wasn't-so-serious manner tinpot sort of way because, oh i don't know, they ran out of pencils and printers hadn't printed enough blank ballot papers.

baboon2004
12-05-2010, 01:04 PM
Apparently anyone denied the opportunity to vote can sue under the European Convention. So maybe a class action is possible?

mistersloane
12-05-2010, 01:04 PM
i honestly don't know sloane. as you saw from my post upthread, i don't like it any more than anyone else, and feel very sorry for people who wanted to vote but were not able to. it's business as usual. (w the emphasis here being on the word business.)

there's a committee that will 'look into it' (or whatevs), an independent electoral body, but you can hardly imagine even if they find massive fault a few months down the line they can do anything more than make it better for the next time. none of us expect them to have the power to call a snap re-election, alas.

in one way (and i write this at least slightly tongue-in-cheek), it's almost living up to typically British stereotypes. ie the stations and election personnel were overwhelmed in an almost charming-if-it-wasn't-so-serious manner tinpot sort of way because, oh i don't know, they ran out of pencils and printers hadn't printed enough blank ballot papers.

I just woke up wondering about it and there's so much media on the election that wading through it all to find an answer, seemed easier to ask dissensus. I'm so sick of things going wrong and there being "enquiries". They don't do anything. I know that the amounts wouldn't change anything with regard results, but surely that's not the point. Was just wondering, really.

mistersloane
12-05-2010, 01:07 PM
Apparently anyone denied the opportunity to vote can sue under the European Convention. So maybe a class action is possible?

Yeah, I just wonder what would be possible in order to make an election void, would a class action? If you go by a theory that it happened by incompetence (Sorry! can't vote! better luck next time, old chap!), would that make the entire election void? Does the few not represent the whole?

Mr. Tea
12-05-2010, 01:09 PM
I think both the authorities and the voters themselves were surprised by the high turnout. I mean, when was the last time this happened? People aren't used to turning up at a polling station and finding a massive queue.

Couldn't there have been an emergency ruling to keep the polls open till midnight or so? Or would that have been illegal, "unconstitutional" somehow (not that we have a written constitution)?

baboon2004
12-05-2010, 01:11 PM
I think both the authorities and the voters themselves were surprised by the high turnout. I mean, when was the last time this happened? People aren't used to turning up at a polling station and finding a massive queue.

Couldn't there have been an emergency ruling to keep the polls open till midnight or so? Or would that have been illegal, "unconstitutional" somehow (not that we have a written constitution)?

1997, 71 per cent, this year 65 - I think this is right.

yeah, emergency ruling should definitely've been in place. yet people are so in love with process rather than genuine fairness, that, as you say, it would have been outlawed somehow.

crackerjack
12-05-2010, 01:18 PM
I think both the authorities and the voters themselves were surprised by the high turnout. I mean, when was the last time this happened? People aren't used to turning up at a polling station and finding a massive queue.

Couldn't there have been an emergency ruling to keep the polls open till midnight or so? Or would that have been illegal, "unconstitutional" somehow (not that we have a written constitution)?

The highest turnout (at least that I can remember) was in 1992. And what was the similiarity? Oh yeah, everyone thought it would be close.

Councils who didn't see this coming are fecking eejits. And, there should be a new rule - anyone even in the queue by 10 can vote, no matter how long that queue is. Anyone coming after can piss off. Not difficult.

baboon2004
12-05-2010, 01:22 PM
http://www.ukpolitical.info/Turnout45.htm

crackerjack otm.

but jeez, the decrease from that poll is astonishing, given that this has been the most talked-about election in 13 years - this was still (easily) the third lowest post-war turnout.

Mr. Tea
12-05-2010, 01:38 PM
Fair enough, I guess the turnout was only "high" compared to the last two (i.e. the only other elections I've been able to vote in). I stand corrected.

Slothrop
12-05-2010, 01:40 PM
apparently the right aren't happy about sharing power with the old limpwristed libbys and have extracted their price in cabinet seats

so it won't just be Hague, Fox and Grayling (assuming her survives) keeping it real for the headbanger tendency in the new govt

Any updates on this, Tory spotters?

crackerjack
12-05-2010, 01:50 PM
Anyone else notce this?


The parliament will sit for a fixed five-year term and there will not be another election until 7 May 2015, unless 55% of MPs vote for an earlier election. (http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2010/may/12/david-cameron-cabinet-posts-coalition)

In other words, no early election unless the Tories want it. Is this even constitutional? What happens if they lose a confidence vote?

scottdisco
12-05-2010, 01:52 PM
Tory 'headbangers' or not aside, hey, at least i see that ex-investment banker David Laws - rightly criticised even by his own colleague Chris Huhne for favouring health social insurance schemes that (as Huhne pointed out) invariably exclude some of the poorest sections of society - is chief secretary to the Treasury.

w ex-Royal Dutch Shell chief economist Vince Cable (honest bloke: as long ago as 2005 he was saying he'd go into a coalition w the Tories) as business secretary it's some firm pairs of hands from the liberals to go alongside George Osbourne, Michael Gove and the like as we go about the business of cuts, cuts, and, er, cuts again.

oh, er, where was i?

john eden
12-05-2010, 02:03 PM
who decides this, specifically. you seem to be saying that "the government" has decided this is "in our best interests". I'm just wondering who makes these sort of decisions when things do - as they have - gone wrong. I know Liberty are all over it, but who's decision is it?

I think the Electoral Commission oversees everything but its down to individual local authorities to actually carry stuff out properly and ensure it is all properly resourced.

Seems like the returning officer in Sheffield has agreed to forgo his fee because of the cock up.

Whilst I can see that this is all a monumental pisser for the hundreds of individual voters involved, it is a bit of a sideshow. If 1,000 more people had voted in Hackney it wouldn't have made any difference whatsoever to the outcome.

baboon2004
12-05-2010, 02:06 PM
Anyone else notce this?



In other words, no early election unless the Tories want it. Is this even constitutional? What happens if they lose a confidence vote?

fixed-term elections were part of the Lib Dem negotiations, to prevent the Tories doing a 1974 and calling an election in November. basically, it is constitutonal, now, 'cos they changed the constitution.

Mr. Tea
12-05-2010, 02:09 PM
oh, er, where was i?

In the throes of multiple sarcgasms if this thread is anything to go by! ;)

baboon2004
12-05-2010, 02:09 PM
I think the Electoral Commission oversees everything but its down to individual local authorities to actually carry stuff out properly and ensure it is all properly resourced.

Seems like the returning officer in Sheffield has agreed to forgo his fee because of the cock up.

Whilst I can see that this is all a monumental pisser for the hundreds of individual voters involved, it is a bit of a sideshow. If 1,000 more people had voted in Hackney it wouldn't have made any difference whatsoever to the outcome.

in this case (tho I hate the phrase generally) it is about the principle. it's a complete lack of respect for (non) voters. Most of our votes meant nowt, anyway.

john eden
12-05-2010, 02:24 PM
in this case (tho I hate the phrase generally) it is about the principle. it's a complete lack of respect for (non) voters. Most of our votes meant nowt, anyway.

it's just cost cutting, and this is nothing compared to what will follow.

scottdisco
12-05-2010, 02:35 PM
it's just cost cutting, and this is nothing compared to what will follow.

otm.

crackerjack
12-05-2010, 02:36 PM
it's just cost cutting, and this is nothing compared to what will follow.

indeed (http://blogs.ft.com/westminster/2010/05/cameron-drops-pledge-to-raise-nhs-spending-in-real-terms/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+ft%2Fwestminster+%28Westminst er+Blog%29&utm_content=Twitter)


fixed-term elections were part of the Lib Dem negotiations, to prevent the Tories doing a 1974 and calling an election in November. basically, it is constitutonal, now, 'cos they changed the constitution.

OK, accept it's constituional, at least once the bill's passed, but what happens if the govt fails a confidence vote?

scottdisco
12-05-2010, 02:43 PM
btw T, dunno what you are on about!

next, you will be trying to imply that i have a problem w the nutty group of provocateurs that cluster around Frank Furedi, such as Claire Fox, Hume, O'Neill, Patrick West, that lot :p

hucks
12-05-2010, 02:47 PM
indeed (http://blogs.ft.com/westminster/2010/05/cameron-drops-pledge-to-raise-nhs-spending-in-real-terms/?utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+ft%2Fwestminster+%28Westminst er+Blog%29&utm_content=Twitter)

"Cameron drops pledge to raise NHS spending in real terms"



Good. Ringfencing the NHS was the stupidest way to go about cutting expenditure. Spending on the NHS has doubled in real terms since 1997. It's gone up by 5% (again, in real terms) since the start of the recession, which is just crazy.

OK it means he lied, but whatever

craner
12-05-2010, 03:07 PM
They did get to the polling station on time though. Go back to bed and come back a nice person.

Excuse me? I may not be "a nice person" but I think this is fair enough: polling stations are open all day and everybody knows they close at 10pm, it's a clear law and means ballot boxes can start being counted at a reasonable hour, and if people are refused admittance because they arrive late to vote then they have not been "disenfranchised" -- and they can always circumvent problems with timing by applying for a postal vote. So how fucking hard can it be? As far as I know or have seen, plenty of polling stations that were overwhelmed with late voters allowed anyone who arrived at the stations before 10pm to vote after 10pm, but in some this wasn't the case and queues of people were turned away -- well, sorry, that's tough, but it's not a scandal. Taken aback, I must say, by the hysterical and self-important tone taken by voters and commentators on this; it's like the expenses thing has inculcated -- or maybe just consolidated or aggravated -- this culture of hair-trigger hysteria. Anyway, enough. I don't think this story actually warrants much debate.

baboon2004
12-05-2010, 03:27 PM
People in Hackney, for example, were queueing for an hour and a half, and were turned away. The only conclusion you can come to is that certain polling stations were massively underresourced. Not hysteria, just plain fact. The expenses 'scandal', I personally didn't give a fuck about.

People shouldn't have to apply for a postal vote just because they work long hours/live in an area which is underresourced. Maybe a public holiday on election day next time?

It's not the biggest scandal ever, true, but it's entirely symptomatic of utter contempt for people on the part of those organising the election.

craner
12-05-2010, 03:34 PM
Actually, yes -- that's always seemed like a fine idea to me.

As for Hackney, I don't know what to say -- bloody Hackney North militant wreckers.

craner
12-05-2010, 03:35 PM
It's not the biggest scandal ever, true, but it's entirely symptomatic of utter contempt for people on the part of those organising the election.


Of course it's not! There you go, being hysterical.

baboon2004
12-05-2010, 03:38 PM
How long did you have to wait to vote? If you'd been waiting for an hour and a half after a long day, and then told you couldn't vote, you'd be complaining too, and to deny that is rubbish.

It's called empathy for other people in more difficult circumstances, not hysteria. Really...

craner
12-05-2010, 03:40 PM
People shouldn't have to apply for a postal vote just because they work long hours/live in an area which is underresourced.

Why not?