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connect_icut
27-09-2010, 06:44 PM
I was just listening to Flow Motion by Can - and rather enjoying it! I also have a penchant for the latter-day Jonathan Richman albums...

Anyone else out there have favourite albums made by artists in the autumn years of their careers, when they were generally considered to be past their best?

Brother Randy Hickey
27-09-2010, 06:54 PM
the later Richman albums are fantastic..

I love Vegas Elvis more than Sun Elvis.

There, I've said it.

And I prefer Husker Du after Candy Apple Grey, not Zen Arcade.

connect_icut
27-09-2010, 07:06 PM
Ha ha! I thought this thread would capture at least one person's attention. Anyone else game?


the later Richman albums are fantastic.

I'm surprised how many people are prepared to 'fess up to liking these. To me, the first album and early demos are fine but the later stuff is the real Jonathan.


And I prefer Husker Du after Candy Apple Grey, not Zen Arcade.

That's a good one. Warehouse is easily my favourite Husker Du album.

Oh and I should probably mention that I prefer Beggars-era Fall to Rough Trade-era Fall. But then I prefer Beggars-era Fall to just about anything.

gragy10
27-09-2010, 07:19 PM
Def agree with teh Warehouse point.
The Love Movement is my favourite Tribe album. Weird that both TLM & Beats Rhymes & Life are both considered the falling off stage of their career but also have sacred cow dilla all over them

connect_icut
27-09-2010, 07:42 PM
Def agree with teh Warehouse point.
The Love Movement is my favourite Tribe album. Weird that both TLM & Beats Rhymes & Life are both considered the falling off stage of their career but also have sacred cow dilla all over them

I like Beats, Rhymes & Life okay but I've never heard The Love Movement. How about the later Gang Starr albums? I thought Moment of Truth was alright. But then I always preferred Hard to Earn to Daily Operation, which seems to be a slightly controversial opinion.

Mr. Tea
27-09-2010, 08:29 PM
http://www.filmandmusicfashion.com/_wizardimages/roxy_music_avalon.jpg

connect_icut
27-09-2010, 09:18 PM
http://www.filmandmusicfashion.com/_wizardimages/roxy_music_avalon.jpg

Ah yes, should've expected that one.

I think "slick-but-I-like-it" could be a whole sub-category here.

Happy Mondays - Pills & Thrills & Bellyaches

zhao
28-09-2010, 04:58 AM
at risk of losing my industrial noise cred, have to say that i enjoy the later more lyrical and narrative Neubauten albums more than their earlier and rougher sound.

but far as can goes nothing beats Future Days. and while some of the 80s disco stuff can be amusing (the pool party song), it is generally wince inducing...

Benny B
28-09-2010, 08:13 AM
at risk of losing my industrial noise cred, have to say that i enjoy the later more lyrical and narrative Neubauten albums more than their earlier and rougher sound.

.

Good one, so do I. All about Silence is sexy and Perpetuum Mobile. They were amazing live around this period too, just as intense as in the old days but in a different way.

zhao
28-09-2010, 09:00 AM
just as intense as in the old days but in a different way.

compositional dynamics... i'm a firm believer of building up the tension until it becomes, not almost, but actually, unbearable, and then, to quote that one guitar dude losing it on the airplane, unleashing the fucking fury. :D

but of course constant stream of noise is good too for other occasions...

gumdrops
28-09-2010, 09:15 AM
love movement is very underrated. in my personal top 3 tribe albums. never liked moment of truth much - thought the ownerz was much better.

luka
28-09-2010, 09:18 AM
ever since i declared hard to earn to be the best gangstarr album its been an acceptable opinion to hold. the love movement on the other hand is beyond the pale. 5 hail marys. kneeling on broken glass. im very fond of kool g raps 4,5,6 though...

luka
28-09-2010, 09:19 AM
if youre floundering... midnight mauraders is the best ATCQ album.

gumdrops
28-09-2010, 09:30 AM
yeah 456 has take em to war and money on my brain. his last good album i think, before he kept going on and on about boring mafioso stuff.

crackerjack
28-09-2010, 12:35 PM
if youre floundering... midnight mauraders is the best ATCQ album.

Damn right. If you think Love Movement is the best Tribe album you shouldn't be listening to Tribe, you should be listening to Little Brother or Slum Village.



yeah 456 has take em to war and money on my brain. his last good album i think, before he kept going on and on about boring mafioso stuff.

And Fast Life ft Nas - I'd post it up but it's only remixes on YouTube.

Also Iron Flag and Blackout 2.

luka
28-09-2010, 12:40 PM
this is the oringinal
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fdUPpcGmjHo

Corpsey
28-09-2010, 12:48 PM
I thought 'The Ownerz' was pretty shite, personally - Guru had REALLY lost it by that point and I didn't even think the beats were that good. I love 'Moment of Truth'.

I haven't ever really listened to much Kool G Rap but I like this one off 4,5,6


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNGIahjziiE

The only Kool G Rap album I've ever owned was the really boring one about Mafiosi. I bought it in the days before I had the internet and so had to rely on the oxford HMV selection.

luka
28-09-2010, 12:49 PM
guru had lost it when momenyt of truth came out in my opion, i was embaressed when i heard it.... amazig beats tho

Corpsey
28-09-2010, 12:54 PM
I bought 'Moment of Truth' about a year after I got into hip-hop, I wasn't aware that Guru had fallen off really. I remember he wrote into Hip Hop Connection magazine complaining that they'd given him a separate rating to Premier in the review.

I still think Guru's great on 'Betrayal' (feat Scarface) though. That's probably my favourite tune by them.

Once again though I have to admit I haven't actually listened to a lot of their old stuff.

gumdrops
28-09-2010, 01:54 PM
moment of truth is when i thought he fell off.

kool g rap had this one album of outtakes around the time of 4,5,6 that had some pretty good stuff on it, though what era it dates from i dont know.

used to love this one -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCMDScPLPd8

if you can tolerate the sexism, this is also g rap in his prime. must be mid 90s ish -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RBb35VGOFRY

Woebot
28-09-2010, 02:34 PM
scritti's white bread black beer (is that what it is called?) - that's the best thing he ever did. that's my benchmark for this i reckon.

crackerjack
28-09-2010, 04:03 PM
I once had a mate who insisted Blah Blah Blah was the best thing Iggy had ever done. But he was generally wrong about pretty much everything.

nochexxx
28-09-2010, 04:10 PM
I love Pygmalion (Slowdive's final/finest record), the rest of their output I can live without.

michael
28-09-2010, 08:20 PM
I love Pygmalion (Slowdive's final/finest record), the rest of their output I can live without.

Yeah but that's like saying you like Talk Talk's last stuff best - that's the critical consensus anyway. I thought this thread was about where most people slate the later stuff...

I think Pygmalion's fucking boring. :D I tried to like it because of what I thought it stood for, but that never really works does it?

Also, zhao, if you're talking about Holger's 'Cool In The Pool' (mid-80s) when you talk about later Can material, you should hear what he's done in the last 25 years.... the last album (that I know of) was stuff sub-par euro dance stuff.


I was trying to think of anything that might fit the thread, but most of my favourite albums are from artists who released fuck all or are early on in a long career.

padraig (u.s.)
28-09-2010, 08:31 PM
I have a (large) softspot for hair metal Discharge (i.e. Grave New World and beyond).

absolutely can't join you all on later vs. earlier Husker Du tho. the opposite, actually, my favorite by them is Everything Falls Apart.

connect_icut
28-09-2010, 08:53 PM
It's true that the critical consensus on Slowdive is that they got better as they went along but that did get me thinking... It seems to me the critical consensus is increasingly tolerant of Bad Later Albums (BLAs). There have been so many classic artists in recent years who've released albums that have been trumpeted as returns-to-form but have turned out to be utter shite.

I would not include the Scritti album in that, BTW. Big fan of that one. Actually, I like Cupid & Psyche a lot too, which some would probably count as a BLA.

Oh and I can't believe I didn't mention Sonic Youth. I absolutely love Dirty and A Thousand Leaves but it's really all about Murray Street, which is up there with Sister and Daydream Nation, IMHbCO. Seriously, don't sleep on Murray Street. Amazing stuff!

Benny B
28-09-2010, 09:09 PM
Oh and I can't believe I didn't mention Sonic Youth. I absolutely love Dirty and A Thousand Leaves but it's really all about Murray Street, which is up there with Sister and Daydream Nation, IMHbCO. Seriously, don't sleep on Murray Street. Amazing stuff!

Yes! Haven't really listened to SY for ages but Murray St was always my fave by them, especially 'Rain on tin' with all that beautiful Neil Young/Television-esque guitar duelling. Stunning track and as good as anything on Sister and Daydream nation if you ask me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HwIDcobO4l4

baboon2004
28-09-2010, 09:10 PM
moment of truth is when i thought he fell off.


But the beats, the beats...

The words 'fell off' always remind me of Still DRE anyways. And I'll stick out my neck and say that 2001 is a better album than the Chronic.

Benny B
28-09-2010, 09:21 PM
Street Legal and New Morning: Not many people have good things to say about these Dylan albums but I reckon they're both excellent. I have seen Self Portrait being critically reappraised but not these two I think.

nochexxx
28-09-2010, 10:35 PM
Yeah but that's like saying you like Talk Talk's last stuff best - that's the critical consensus anyway. I thought this thread was about where most people slate the later stuff...


at time of release this record was panned by critics and consequently ignored by the public. i found my copy in a bargain bucket! the word did eventually catch up, but this record wasn't lauded until way after it's retail shelf life.

Bang Diddley
28-09-2010, 10:40 PM
Can I mention Sade on Dissensus : ) Stronger Than Pride so much better than Diamond Life.

Diamond Life reminds me of Matt Bianco now.

michael
28-09-2010, 11:01 PM
at time of release this record was panned by critics and consequently ignored by the public. i found my copy in a bargain bucket! the word did eventually catch up, but this record wasn't lauded until way after it's retail shelf life.

Ah OK, I wasn't aware of that. Thanks for the correction.

I picked up my copy cheap too, I think it was in about 2000.

baboon2004
28-09-2010, 11:06 PM
Can I mention Sade on Dissensus : ) Stronger Than Pride so much better than Diamond Life.

Diamond Life reminds me of Matt Bianco now.

I think Sade is some kind of Dissensus patron saint in fact.

nochexxx
28-09-2010, 11:16 PM
I picked up my copy cheap too, I think it was in about 2000.

if you have it on vinyl and wouldn't mind selling it, PM me ?

gnome
29-09-2010, 12:31 AM
I've come to really like some of the cheesier mid-late 80s New Order stuff after glossing over it in my Joy Division period


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YkZk-1hw26s

Mr. Tea
29-09-2010, 11:03 AM
Some good Cabs from that era, too:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qgeVg-1LLwk

gumdrops
29-09-2010, 11:50 AM
i'll stick out my neck and say that 2001 is a better album than the Chronic.

never that. ever. ever ever. :p

martin
29-09-2010, 12:07 PM
Not defending it as a great album, but I prefer "Cut the Crap" to most of "Sandinista". It's also a good way of weeding out the Mojo / TV retro talking head-types who want to pretend it never happened. It still makes me laugh, which is as good a response as any.
Agree with the bloke who mentioned the Fall, the Brix 84-86 era was way better than 'Hex' or the early stuff.

Tim F
29-09-2010, 01:28 PM
The big ones for me are:

Wu-Tang Clan - Iron Flag (2001)
Joni Mitchell - Night Ride Home (1991)
Fleetwood Mac - Say You Will (2003)

Corpsey
29-09-2010, 08:46 PM
The big ones for me are:

Wu-Tang Clan - Iron Flag (2001)


Only the other day I dismissed that album on here, I'd be interested to know why I am wrong.

baboon2004
29-09-2010, 11:22 PM
Fleetwood Mac - Say You Will (2003)

Wow, this is sounding bloody great. Why did I ever doubt it would?

Tim F
30-09-2010, 01:43 AM
Only the other day I dismissed that album on here, I'd be interested to know why I am wrong.

Banger after banger after banger. Easily the most kinetic Wu album in my opinion.

But then with a couple of exceptions I've never been a huge fan of Wu in clapped-out bang-on-a-trash-can mode (can't get with '8 Diagrams' for this reason); if that's what draws you to Wu then obv your mileage will vary.

connect_icut
30-09-2010, 04:27 PM
I've come to really like some of the cheesier mid-late 80s New Order stuff after glossing over it in my Joy Division period

At what point are New Order generally considered to have fallen off? I only know the singles and I like most of them right up to "Touched by the Hand of God" and "Fine Time" (is that what it was called?) but there are a few clunkers along the way (e.g. "State of the Nation").

paolo
01-10-2010, 08:02 AM
I actually can't think of any not so well-regarded later albums that I prefer to more critically acclaimed early material from just about any group/artist

Damien
01-10-2010, 01:11 PM
I love Yes when they stopped with the proggy mentalist shit and got Trevor Horn on board to make lovely little pop songs

connect_icut
01-10-2010, 06:04 PM
I heard "Owner of a Lonely Heart" in a supermarket the other day and it was rather catchy!

Surprised nobody's mentioned Neil Young yet. I kind of like "Harvest Moon".

bb_rebozo
11-10-2010, 11:48 PM
when it comes to tim buckley i'd rather prefer the late overproduced la-albums. never really liked his so-called masterpieces lorca or starsailor (song to the siren is the only exception), not to mention his early folksinger career (i never asked to be your mountain is the only exception in this case). the late tim buckley is the deal. 70s la-studio-slickness at its peak plus the soul of a white boy. :cool:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N1TRlmCvYyk

connect_icut
12-10-2010, 01:57 AM
when it comes to tim buckley i'd rather prefer the late overproduced la-albums. never really liked his so-called masterpieces lorca or starsailor (song to the siren is the only exception), not to mention his early folksinger career (i never asked to be your mountain is the only exception in this case). the late tim buckley is the deal. 70s la-studio-slickness at its peak plus the soul of a white boy.


Well, I can't agree with the specifics of this but I do understand the general principle.

I love everything by Tim Buckley up to and including Starsailor (to my ears, Lorca just sounds like Starsailor with all the life sucked out of it). Starsailor would have to be in my top 20 albums of all time. "Monterey"!

Not a fan of the later stuff, though. I don't even like Greetings from LA.

Still, I do understand the principle of preferring artists' slick, easy-on-the-ears stuff to their ground-breaking avant garde statements. That's why I prefer the later, folky goth-rock version of the Swans to the early abject noise catharsis incarnation. Love of Life!

connect_icut
19-10-2010, 03:58 PM
Somebody just reminded me about this one:

Pixies - Trompe le Monde

craner
19-10-2010, 04:16 PM
I am not sure if this really counts, but I have a soft spot for Starship -- that is, as well as Jefferson Airplane. I don't know how Grace Slick & Co quite got there, but I enjoy the fact that they did. They are like the pulse of their generation -- like Neil Young or P J O'Rourke.

Damien
21-10-2010, 04:23 PM
Obviously the best 'bad later album' is Celtic Frost-Cold Lake


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bI74tyUefY4

Really pissed me off to hear Tom G calling this album a mistake just so he could promote his newer album to the 'real' metal fans, lost respect for him for that. Cold Lake is one of my favourite albums of all time, love it

franz
21-10-2010, 05:32 PM
i'll see your Sade and raise you...
http://israbox.com/uploads/posts/1159013215_george_michael__older.jpg

also, whilst it isn't really playing along with the spirit of the thread, but i have to say that i'll probably never learn to love anything Horace Andy has done as much as his vocal work with Massive Attack (and really mostly just on Mezzanine).

craner
22-10-2010, 10:27 AM
So why don't we make a little room in my BMW...

(Victoria Beckham's favorite song -- upwardly mobile Essex disco.)

rubberdingyrapids
06-08-2015, 11:56 AM
there is something easier about listening to the later period without all the baggage of the classic eras.

prob why i like listening to 90s prince more than the 80s stuff.
or late 70s/early 80s rolling stones (i hate beggars banquet, let it bleed for the most part).
or 80s joni mitchell (does anyone else like dog eat dog and ethiopia like me?)

CrowleyHead
06-08-2015, 12:36 PM
Its always cool to come to a band's later discog knowing it isn't 'CLASSICS' and enjoying yourself. I once binged on the Nick Lowe discography and I loved his weird 90s 00s stuff where he was trying to be an old country singer instead of a power-pop guy. It was so transparent, but he's such a good songwriter it has such charm.

Frankstah
22-08-2015, 01:14 AM
oasis - be here now. 18 today co-incidentally.

CrowleyHead
23-08-2015, 04:29 PM
Oasis gets better once Noel (who's actually a much better singer) gets to sing his own songs. Liam is so atrocious once the millennium turns.

subvert47
27-02-2016, 11:05 AM
Not a fan of the later stuff, though. I don't even like Greetings from LA.

not even this? :)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gMoBLR86t8o