I joined a Gym

NATO

Well-known member
I get the aerobic exercise stuff, running, rowing, skiing machines etc. At a total loss with where to start with weight machines, and what they all do and shit. I know Corpsey's been going gym, help me out here.
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
I get the aerobic exercise stuff, running, rowing, skiing machines etc. At a total loss with where to start with weight machines, and what they all do and shit. I know Corpsey's been going gym, help me out here.

Most gyms will have someone show you the ropes (and pulleys, treadmills, assorted torture devices etc.) if you ask. In fact some will insist you have an intro session before you're allowed to use the equipment.
 
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baboon2004

Darned cockwombles.
Yep, definitely have an induction session, however tedious it seems - most of it is obvious but why risk it...

Advice I wish somebody'd given to me (my goal being to spend as little time in the gym as possible for the same benefits) - almost without exception, don't bother with the machines, cos their movements are so unnatural. Go for free weights and bodyweight exercises (pull-ups, dips), as well as those pulley machines. You'll do the same stuff (more, actually) in half the time.
 

baboon2004

Darned cockwombles.
Both - to my shame I know more about this than I should. Basically the machines isolate larger muscles without using the surrounding smaller stabilising muscles, hence their unnaturalness - so for example the pull-down machines are pretty useless compared to doing pull-ups, although they'd be working the same larger muscle(s) in your back. it's not just machines though - bench press doesn't allow your arms to move in a natural arc either.

I could be wrong in this, but I think overuse of unnatural movements might account for the difference between that 'gym look' some people have, and a more 'natural' athletic look.
 

comelately

Wild Horses
If you're in an empty gym with lots of equipment easily to hand, then free-weights are a good choice. In a busy gym, I think they have their uses and they can potentially be more time efficient. The pulley machines are in many ways the best of both worlds.
 

you

Well-known member
Both - to my shame I know more about this than I should. Basically the machines isolate larger muscles without using the surrounding smaller stabilising muscles, hence their unnaturalness - so for example the pull-down machines are pretty useless compared to doing pull-ups, although they'd be working the same larger muscle(s) in your back. it's not just machines though - bench press doesn't allow your arms to move in a natural arc either.

I could be wrong in this, but I think overuse of unnatural movements might account for the difference between that 'gym look' some people have, and a more 'natural' athletic look.

I'd second this. The machines isolate. If you only want to improve one particular muscle this is fine, but I cannot see why anyone needs such isolation. Use free weights/compound moves as much as possible, this will encourage stabilising and muscle growth and overall strength. Your body works as a whole so work it as a whole. Things like dips and chin ups are good because you lift and push your whole body with your body. I won't go into the details but the isolation machines are not even good for building muscle, even particular muscles you want to focus on. They are not good for increasing your strength (because you need to work the whole body for this), and they certainly don't stabilise.
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
I won't go into the details but the isolation machines are not even good for building muscle, even particular muscles you want to focus on. They are not good for increasing your strength (because you need to work the whole body for this), and they certainly don't stabilise.

I'm not convinced by this. I mean, if you're worried about having weedy legs, let's say, surely doing leg exercises will work on those muscles, even if your chest, back and arms aren't being exercised?

And if using a single machine isn't 'balanced' exercise, isn't that why there are loads of different machines, so you can use several/all of them? Or do the different muscle groups have to be worked at the same time to get the benefit? I don't mean to sound unduly skeptical, just thinking aloud here.
 

you

Well-known member
I'm not convinced by this. I mean, if you're worried about having weedy legs, let's say, surely doing leg exercises will work on those muscles, even if your chest, back and arms aren't being exercised?

And if using a single machine isn't 'balanced' exercise, isn't that why there are loads of different machines, so you can use several/all of them? Or do the different muscle groups have to be worked at the same time to get the benefit? I don't mean to sound unduly skeptical, just thinking aloud here.

Well, if you work the whole body including the core your body naturally reacts to become stronger - so the more muscles you use in an action the more you initiate a muscle growth response. So squats are better than a leg machine because other muscles (core, back, feet) are also used. This is why compound exercises are better for getting bigger than the resistance machines. It is almost a common knowledge in the gym that if you want to bulk up your top do squats! Do legs and the top follows... oddly.

There are many many resistance machines and you could, theoretically exercise everything on these machines. But I think that a beginner is better to do all round compound type stuff to avoid over/under/inconsistent developments - which could lead to injury or bad posture etc etc Why would you want to do such isolated/focused exercises when you could just do a nice all round exercise that will make you stronger anyway. Also compound type exercises are better for your fitness, it's easy to get lazy sat down with machines. The machines are only good to help specific muscles that let you down during more rounded exercises.

See this linky - http://sportsmedicine.about.com/od/strengthtraining/a/compound_ex.htm

But tbh just going to the gym can get boring, best to do fun things. Squash is a nice sport for winter. It's fun to chase a bouncy ball.
 
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Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
Cool, thanks for that and the link, I'll have a look later.

What I really joined up for is the climbing wall, will have a go on that later this week I reckon. Don't reckon combination strength exercise gets much more 'combination' than that.

(Squash looks great fun but tbh I'd be slightly scared of one or more organs exploding...)
 

Corpsey

bandz ahoy
I clearly don't really know shit cos I use the machines quite a lot - the free weights are usually harder to get on cos my gym is busy and the guys lifting those weights tend to have no necks. Anyway

With weights, the most important thing is probably just knowing how to do things properly before you do them. For example if you're doing tricep pulley pull downs (that's the technical term) make sure your elbows stay tight to your body when you're dong them cos otherwise you aren't really working the muscles you intend to and you could waste a lot of time and effort. That's really the general rule with bicep/trip related stuff. I see people in the gym doing this type of thing wrong all the time - I used to be one of them until someone who knows his stuff told me. I probably still do stuff wrong, but it made a big difference when I learned how to do a couple of things right.

This guy from work who is a gym sensei made a spreadsheet plan for me for three days a week - one day would be triceps and legs, one day chest and back, one day biceps and shoulders etc. I stuck to this plan pretty rigidly for a long time but lately I just do whatever's available when I go. This probably isn't the best approach but I do try and balance things out - i.e. if I do a couple of shoulder exercises I will also do a couple of leg exercises.

Lately I haven't been doing a set number of reps I just do as many as I can before I can't do anymore (X3). I picked this up off someone online but I know a lot of people recommend following rigid plans.

I'm a complete chancer, basically. I'm quite muscular nowadays my biggest problem is my fat junk food gut which I never shift cos I never stop eating junk food and I don't like doing treadmill stuff cos it bores me.
 

Corpsey

bandz ahoy
Free weights wise the three foundation stones are

- Bench Press
- Squat
- Deadlift

Pull-ups are very good but are fucking hard. I dunno, I reckon the machines might help you build yourself up a bit before you start on the free weights. That's what I did anyway.
 

baboon2004

Darned cockwombles.
Treadmill is death - only doing interval training can get me through it, staying at a regular speed is beyond contemplation.

Pull-ups are so fucking difficult, but practising with negatives (i.e. jumping up to the bar, then lowering yourself, slowly) is the way to build up to being able to do a few. I'm up to three on a good day, and that took a while....
 

Corpsey

bandz ahoy
I can do quite a lot now through just uhhh doing it a lot. The trick for me was learning to keep my eye on a point along the bar while doing it.
 

baboon2004

Darned cockwombles.
I'll give that a go. I found that without the negatives I couldn't even imagine doing one - kind of a psychological block as well as a physical block. Someone else said imagine pulling the bar down to you rather than vice versa, to make it easier - same kind of principle
 

griftert

Well-known member
Yeah it's weird sometimes with stuff like that...where it feels almost like you could do it but can't get started. Just started doing pushups recently ang can't even do one. Doing them from the knee like a weakling. Got to start somewhere.

Never knew how good pullups are meant to be until recently. Should really start them too.

Also running outside which I can only do about 10 minutes stop start before i sack it. From never doing any exercise (and feeling it) it's an improvement.
 

NATO

Well-known member
Some interesting starting points for me to begin my research here. Kind of glad to hear that using the isolated machines isn't the best idea because I was looking at them thinking where the fuck am I going to get the time and motivation to go through them each week.

Matt B mentioned goals, really I working on my insides first, so that's aerobic exercise etc. In terms of more narcissistic shit I would like to build up some more muscle, but have no interest in being 'tonk' (if people still use that word.) Not a fan of the meathead/I spend too much time at the gym look. My arms are really weak so would like to work on them, but my shoulders are ok from years of swimming in my early-mid twenties. My legs are very skinny too so wouldn't mind strengthening them.

I live in Shanghai and there isn't a service economy here (yet), nor any rigid legal institutions for ordinary people to rely on. That's a long way of saying there's no induction at the gym.
 

baboon2004

Darned cockwombles.
Yeah it's weird sometimes with stuff like that...where it feels almost like you could do it but can't get started. Just started doing pushups recently ang can't even do one. Doing them from the knee like a weakling. Got to start somewhere.

Never knew how good pullups are meant to be until recently. Should really start them too.

Also running outside which I can only do about 10 minutes stop start before i sack it. From never doing any exercise (and feeling it) it's an improvement.

Running's a bastard cos it's so boring, but kinda necessary.

For push-ups, I think those stands that you can buy are really good - they lessen the tension on your wrists and they're only about a fiver for the pair.

@NATO - ah, if you did swimming for so long you should be back up to speed pretty quickly
 
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