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simon silverdollar
28-04-2005, 06:01 PM
so...are they good, or are they bad?
they've never done much for me, but lots of people who i like and respect are into them.

even ultra d-i-y people at hardcore gigs seem to like them.

so, futureheads fans, convince me that your way is the one true way, and bring me into the light...

mpc
28-04-2005, 06:10 PM
they must be good if they've already got a tribute band.

owen
28-04-2005, 06:20 PM
hmm, i'm afraid all i've heard is a cover of 'hounds of love' that makes a great song all lumpen and blokey. didn't encourage me to investigate further.

h-crimm
28-04-2005, 06:51 PM
its a little bit odd that the slampt label gets the big final thankyou from what ends up with a completely anti-slampt-aestetic

in the end i think theyre just a bit normal, okay as pop music for indie boybots who want to think that franz ferdinand et al is a bit intellectual.
seen them play two xmasses ago and they have some energy - improvement on big UK bands at the time...
i'm not really feelin it tho.

daren
28-04-2005, 07:42 PM
I listened to one of their songs through a mixtape trade. It wasn't too impressed with their XTC-like vocal stylings.

mms
28-04-2005, 08:24 PM
totally fucking shit , they sound like a jam pub tribute band.
dreadful.
i'll add that this is the worst thing in the world as paul welller is so totally loathesome.

simon silverdollar
28-04-2005, 10:23 PM
oh dear, you guys are just confirming my worst fears about the futureheads...
i don't like them either but so many good people do like them that i can't help but think that there must be SOMETHING there. but i'm not sure what.

annoying xtc vocal stylings, as said upthread = OTM [as i believe is the preferred term...]

martin
28-04-2005, 11:18 PM
so...are they good, or are they bad?
...

They're boring

Diggedy Derek
29-04-2005, 09:49 AM
They're an excellent live band- funny, intelligent, angular, exciting. However the album, although superficially similar to them live, is much less sharp and urgent. It's really fucking dull. The cover of Hounds Of Love is dogshit too.

Nevertheless, their fanbase seems to be growing by the day.

Noah Baby Food
29-04-2005, 10:29 AM
They're OK, better than most of the waste indie from the UK at the moment. Nothing really new though. Nice lads. Interesting though - the album's been out for time and the label tried to break 'em with "Decent Days and Nights" and a few other tunes....obviously didn't blow 'em up as big as required coz then they re-released the Kate Bush cover and the album is advertised ALL THE BLOODY TIME on UK tv. Trying to get 'em to be a big Franz-style act, when before they were marketed as a bit more punk and "quirky".

679 - good label though, nice roster.

ryan17
29-04-2005, 11:12 AM
i don't rate them.

i think one of the reasons people want to like them is cause one of the gang of four guys produced the album or something.

Diggedy Derek
29-04-2005, 11:44 AM
I think they can be defended from the XTC vocal stylings charge- their vocals are quite individual with that Wear-side accent, I think there's some grit there rather than artifice.

I did really like that song of their, First Day, about starting a dead-end new job and being treated like shit ("this is a job that people die for!"). It had the down to earth documentary realism like that 80s indie Rough Trade box that Woebot was going on about, but it was a lot more urgent.

Mind you, I can't be bothered to defend them really. Everytime my flatmate rabbits on about them makes me more determined that they crash and burn.

Woebot
29-04-2005, 01:27 PM
totally fucking shit , they sound like a jam pub tribute band.
dreadful.
i'll add that this is the worst thing in the world as paul welller is so totally loathesome.

completely agree with this

mpc
29-04-2005, 11:31 PM
they're my favourite band of the last 15 years

hint
30-04-2005, 11:11 AM
so, futureheads fans, convince me that your way is the one true way, and bring me into the light...

they...err... write good songs... and...err... the album sounds good.

I think the andy gill attraction holds more weight than simply having his name on the sleeve - the album's clearly "produced" by him and is all the better for it.

it's bread and butter stuff (but I appreciate that bread and butter falls short of what some people demand / expect from music)

Fiddy
30-04-2005, 12:35 PM
I love the version of Fit But U Know It that they did

don_quixote
01-05-2005, 04:32 PM
it's better than franz fucking ferdinand

tryptych
03-05-2005, 01:16 AM
I like the Futureheads. They're great live, they're spikey and loud and I like their vocal harmonies. I also dig their musical "dogme" attitude that they talked about a year or so ago.

I haven't been here (dissensus) long, but I really can't understand how there are threads about the futureheads being shit, and then over in the R&B thread people saying how much they like R Kelly and J Lo. I wonder if I belong here....

ryan17
04-05-2005, 12:07 AM
it's better than franz fucking ferdinand



this is really not the best way to justify liking an album.

don_quixote
04-05-2005, 08:31 AM
rather than justifying my liking i think i was rather just using it as a vehicle to express my hatred

ryan17
04-05-2005, 10:36 AM
fair enough then.

k-punk
04-05-2005, 11:35 AM
An 'award-today, gone tomorrow' band, like Gomez. I fully expect them to win 17 Brits, all the NME awards and the Mercury Music Prize before finding their natural home, the boot of a car on a Sunday morning, on sale for 10p.

The ritual slaughtering of 'Hounds of Love' alone deserves our undying hostility. It sounds like the sort of thing a student pub band would do, which is hardly surprising really.

One of the saddest things about last week at the Boogaloo was seeing Joj King being positive about those losers, Bloc Party and all the other pathetic nostalgia crew.

(Disagree with mms about the Jam tho... even tho I obv agree that the post-Jam Weller is a culture criminal).

mpc
04-05-2005, 10:34 PM
i think bloc party are amazing.

simon silverdollar
04-05-2005, 11:32 PM
(Disagree with mms about the Jam tho... even tho I obv agree that the post-Jam Weller is a culture criminal).

yeah the jam were wonderful: so sharp, in every way.

Omaar
04-05-2005, 11:39 PM
The style council did a few good numbers, I reckon.

k-punk
05-05-2005, 02:07 AM
The style council did a few good numbers, I reckon.

I give up, really....

(Flashback to the Mick Talbot: where he is now column in MM, one of the funniest things in recorded history)...

michael
05-05-2005, 07:40 AM
An 'award-today, gone tomorrow' band, like Gomez. I fully expect them to win 17 Brits, all the NME awards and the Mercury Music Prize before finding their natural home, the boot of a car on a Sunday morning, on sale for 10p.

Check out this Guardian article (http://www.guardian.co.uk/arts/fridayreview/story/0,12102,1472110,00.html) about the phenomenon.

Very rock-centric article, which is appropriate, since the expectations for other genres differ quite a bit (wrt release schedules, live gigs, etc.) But still markedly pro-rock, which may not suit the biases of many...

don_quixote
05-05-2005, 07:48 AM
i like the bloc party album, but i also like the cure - boys dont cry, so it figures

mms
05-05-2005, 09:03 AM
yeah the jam were wonderful: so sharp, in every way.

yeah but xerox on late 70's machines is poor.

hint
05-05-2005, 02:58 PM
The style council did a few good numbers, I reckon.

they got breaks for days (http://www.hiphopgame.com/download.php3?id=2222) :D

jam were a good singles band

so are futureheads, funnily enough

mms
06-05-2005, 10:28 PM
can we stop talking about this now, i had to sit through a record by the shins or something today and it made me angry and nauseous to the point of feeling physically sick.
there is nothing good about these parasitical third rate idiots when there are so many other amazing bands/people/types of music to enjoy.

mpc
06-05-2005, 10:43 PM
i'd like to finish off this thread by saying that bloc party are the best band of the last 7 years.

the futureheads also have about 4 good songs, which is more than the fall ever managed.

i'm sure in 15 years simon reynolds will write a book about it all.

he could call it:

Was it really (Paul Ep)worth it?

Post-post-punk 2005-2005

k-punk
07-05-2005, 05:08 PM
i'd like to finish off this thread by saying that bloc party are the best band of the last 7 years.

...

the futureheads also have about 4 good songs, which is more than the fall ever managed.


The Futureheads more good songs than The Fall? Bloc Party the best band of the seven years?

Imagine living in a world where that were true.

Would it really be worth carrying on?

mpc
07-05-2005, 07:48 PM
The Futureheads more good songs than The Fall? Bloc Party the best band of the seven years?


One often contradicts an opinion when what is uncongenial is really the tone in which it was conveyed.




Imagine living in a world where that were true.

You have your way. I have my way. As for the right way, the correct way, and the only way, it does not exist.




Would it really be worth carrying on?

What really raises one's indignation against suffering is not suffering intrinsically, but the senselessness of suffering.

mms
07-05-2005, 09:06 PM
bloc party just sound the pil version of what red hot chilli peppers are to the gang of four, teen friendly good time boys taking all the groovy bits from their heros, ironing out the things that made them interesting and maybe difficult (is it so bad to be a bit difficult) and playing it all back.
nothing revolutionary, reasonable but hardly exciting.
there are many more exciting things out there that are quite tuneful too.

k-punk
08-05-2005, 06:23 PM
The effect these bands have is more social than aesthetic:

1. To convince students (who, as Simon Frith has rightly observed, are THE most conservative, reactionary and nostalgic consumers of pop in British society) of the innate superiority of their own rockist values.

2. To lower expectations about what pop - and ultimately life - can be. 'Want something that is more than a tired, microwave-reheated, low-grade simulation of the past? Forget it, it's the best you can hope for....' 'Thought Pop could be about more than over-hyped rockist posterboys living out the outdated fantasies of record company execs, PR people and journalists? Well, think again....'

But trust me, the only people who will be concerned about Futureheads, Bloc Party, Razorlight, Athlete (add other Indie losers to taste) in five years, never mind about twenty, will be the managers of landfill sites.

mpc
08-05-2005, 08:47 PM
The effect these bands have is more social than aesthetic:

1. To convince students (who, as Simon Frith has rightly observed, are THE most conservative, reactionary and nostalgic consumers of pop in British society) of the innate superiority of their own rockist values.

2. To lower expectations about what pop - and ultimately life - can be. 'Want something that is more than a tired, microwave-reheated, low-grade simulation of the past? Forget it, it's the best you can hope for....' 'Thought Pop could be about more than over-hyped rockist posterboys living out the outdated fantasies of record company execs, PR people and journalists? Well, think again....'



One and the same thing can at the same time be good, bad, and indifferent, e.g., music is good to the melancholy, bad to those who mourn, and neither good nor bad to the deaf.

Only in relation to our imagination can things be called beautiful or ugly, well-ordered or confused.




But trust me, the only people who will be concerned about Futureheads, Bloc Party, Razorlight, Athlete (add other Indie losers to taste) in five years, never mind about twenty, will be the managers of landfill sites.


Snobbery exists in all areas of life. By snobbery I mean, any method of judging someone or something whereby you latch on to one or two features about them/it, and use these to come to a definitive, immovable judgement. In intellectual matters, the snob will often take the external features of a work as a guide to its value.

k-punk
08-05-2005, 10:46 PM
Snobbery exists in all areas of life. By snobbery I mean, any method of judging someone or something whereby you latch on to one or two features about them/it, and use these to come to a definitive, immovable judgement. In intellectual matters, the snob will often take the external features of a work as a guide to its value.


But of course this kind of widespread pompous relativism is its own form of judgementalism.... Why are non-definitive, movable non-judgements better than the reverse?

If subscribing to the obvious truth that Futureheads are unspeakable trash makes me a snob, then, fine. It's better than going along with whatever the PRs-that-be have decided is the latest thing...

If you can even remember them, in five years, you'll probably agree then. But I suppose that is what it is to make non-definitive, movable non-judgements.

don_quixote
08-05-2005, 11:52 PM
why does it matter if they stick in the memory for a long time?

i'd be perfectly happy with a band i loved for 6 months and then never listened to ever again really. fair enough, i loved ash when i was a kid, but i dont listen to their records now.

my main problem right now in alternative rock is a lack of personality. i'm not talking about personality in magazine interviews, pete doherty fucking himself up and robbing some stereos, i'm talking about personality through the music... i'm listening to magazine right now and captivated by the power of devoto over the music and i feel it a lot more in music of the past than i do right now... there's too much focus on the tightness of a band rather than individual attributes.

i havent really thought this through completely, so feel free to pick it to pieces whilst i sleep on it

edit: must exaggerate the focus on indie/alternative stuff here, i certainly feel it elsewhere.

mpc
09-05-2005, 12:08 AM
But of course this kind of widespread pompous relativism is its own form of judgementalism.... Why are non-definitive, movable non-judgements better than the reverse?


We should not pretend to understand the world only by the intellect. The judgement of the intellect is only part of the truth.



If subscribing to the obvious truth that Futureheads are unspeakable trash makes me a snob, then, fine. It's better than going along with whatever the PRs-that-be have decided is the latest thing...


Great is truth, but still greater, from a practical point of view, is silence about truth. By simply not mentioning certain subjects... totalitarian propagandists have influenced opinion much more effectively than they could have by the most eloquent denunciations.



If you can even remember them, in five years, you'll probably agree then. But I suppose that is what it is to make non-definitive, movable non-judgements.
[/QUOTE]

Memory is the mother of all wisdom.

mms
09-05-2005, 08:10 PM
We should not pretend to understand the world only by the intellect. The judgement of the intellect is only part of the truth.



Great is truth, but still greater, from a practical point of view, is silence about truth. By simply not mentioning certain subjects... totalitarian propagandists have influenced opinion much more effectively than they could have by the most eloquent denunciations.




Memory is the mother of all wisdom.[/QUOTE]

cute but music is actually much better than that .

mpc
09-05-2005, 08:55 PM
cute but music is actually much better than that .


The very being of music is created by cognitive attributions made by individual perceiving or conceiving imaginers, in individual acts of perceiving or conceiving - that, in fact, the only real music 'theory' is the creative-intellectual transaction which ontologizes music itself.

mms
09-05-2005, 08:59 PM
The very being of music is created by cognitive attributions made by individual perceiving or conceiving imaginers, in individual acts of perceiving or conceiving - that, in fact, the only real music 'theory' is the creative-intellectual transaction which ontologizes music itself.

now you''re just being boring.

instead why not say why you thing bloc party are so amazing, why are they so important and how do they make you feel in 2005 (seven years after 1998) ?
thats one thing you haven't said and i'm interested to hear why you have picked them as your number one band, you seem to have good taste in music ;) but i don't understand your hardline defense of this lot, i'm genuinley not a snob i think.

mpc
09-05-2005, 10:37 PM
what's annoyed me in this thread is people writing off new bands because they've been influenced by previous bands and/or mentioned in the NME.

there will never be another band that doesn't, in some way, resemble what has gone before them.

you don't collectively refer to RnB, hip hop and grime all in the same breath because these genres are mentioned in RWD magazine, so why do the same with every band that the NME mentions.

i like bloc party because they have nice riffs (not just catchy, but affecting) ; their drumming is interesting/exciting, ie. lots of drum rolls etc. (in most of their songs, i'd be quite content even if there were no vocals); their songs evoke emotion. That's enough for me.

mms
09-05-2005, 11:00 PM
what's annoyed me in this thread is people writing off new bands because they've been influenced by previous bands and/or mentioned in the NME.

there will never be another band that doesn't, in some way, resemble what has gone before them.

you don't collectively refer to RnB, hip hop and grime all in the same breath because these genres are mentioned in RWD magazine, so why do the same with every band that the NME mentions.

i like bloc party because they have nice riffs (not just catchy, but affecting) ; their drumming is interesting/exciting, ie. lots of drum rolls etc. (in most of their songs, i'd be quite content even if there were no vocals); their songs evoke emotion. That's enough for me.

i don't think that is the problem though at all.
it's when new bands sound like watered down lo rent idealess utterly cynical versions of old bands and are blanketly heralded as 'the best band of the last seven years ' or whatnot.

lots of these bands are like a lenny kravitz with more 'edgy'record collections for fucks sake.

the other thing is you've just described 3 things that rwd cover in their mag, whilst nme almost completley just cover new rock bands that sound like older better bands (usually on major labels,as the magasine is now almost completley ad driven) at the cost of everything else, rather than opening up to other music, except for the odd gesture towards hip hop, pop or grime. it's almost a stalin-like piece of pr work, cutting the life out of the picture, the real hope, with decadent drunken lowest common denominator rock n roll boy slavering.

just imagine how things could be, think about how great the greatest pieces of music you've enjoyed affected you, how you reacted, what they actually meant, how they propelled you to spend time discussing music on boards like this.

mpc
09-05-2005, 11:26 PM
the anti-bloc party feeling you have is more of an anti-anything-the-nme-mentions feeling.

i don't read the nme, so i've got no idea what they mention or don't mention.

the comment about bloc party being the best band of the last 7 years was not a serious one.

i am not sure which older bands you think bloc party are trying to imitate.

it's been said that they take in influences from the fall, joy division, the cure, gang of four etc. Maybe you've grown up listening to these bands, but they are well before my time. I have heard a good deal of music from all of these bands, as well as bloc party and I certainly wouldn't say bloc party are a watered down version of these bands. I'm guessing you hold the bands you grew up listening to in very high esteem, but they hold very little relevance to me now.

bloc party certainly aren't the best band ever, but they certainly are one of the best bands around now.


just imagine how things could be, think about how great the greatest pieces of music you've enjoyed affected you, how you reacted, what they actually meant, how they propelled you to spend time discussing music on boards like this.

if i did this for every piece of music I hear from now on, then i doubt I would like much of the music I hear.

mpc
09-05-2005, 11:30 PM
i'd like to add, i'm not defending every over-hyped band around at the moment.

all i've said is that i like bloc party and i think the futureheads have 3 or 4 good songs.

i don't like razorlight, athlete, the libertines, the killers etc.

mms
10-05-2005, 09:27 PM
the anti-bloc party feeling you have is more of an anti-anything-the-nme-mentions feeling.

i don't read the nme, so i've got no idea what they mention or don't mention.

the comment about bloc party being the best band of the last 7 years was not a serious one.

i am not sure which older bands you think bloc party are trying to imitate.

it's been said that they take in influences from the fall, joy division, the cure, gang of four etc. Maybe you've grown up listening to these bands, but they are well before my time. I have heard a good deal of music from all of these bands, as well as bloc party and I certainly wouldn't say bloc party are a watered down version of these bands. I'm guessing you hold the bands you grew up listening to in very high esteem, but they hold very little relevance to me now.

bloc party certainly aren't the best band ever, but they certainly are one of the best bands around now.



if i did this for every piece of music I hear from now on, then i doubt I would like much of the music I hear.

i'm probably nearer your age than kpunks age to be honest i'm just going by my feelings -
it's worth searching though. always worth searchin

don_quixote
10-05-2005, 11:49 PM
not sure i hear the fall, joy division or gang of four in bloc party, but i certainly hear boys dont cry cure. and the wedding present.

Ned
11-05-2005, 02:36 PM
Just to throw in my opinion: I really think Bloc Party are one of the best bands of the last five years. I agree that Franz Ferdinand, Futureheads, Kaiser Chiefs etc. don't deserve all the attention, but Bloc Party definitely do. I am a student, so perhaps my opinion doesn't count for anything on this board, but I did do a four-part series on grime for my student paper so I don't think I can be accused of rockist nostalgia or whatever. I think they do owe a lot to post-punk, and their lyrics certainly aren't as good, but I can emotionally engage with Bloc Party in a way I have never be able to with e.g. Gang of Four.

Also Kele, the singer, said in an interview recently that if he thinks the real innovation is going on in grime. I know that's not a reason to like him but it does show that Bloc Party aren't living in this smug NME bubble like a lot of other current bands.

craner
12-05-2005, 02:58 AM
To (attempt) to put an end to this desperate fucking thread

you can tell how shit the Futureheads and Bloc party are going to be by their shit names

full stop.

Ness Rowlah
12-05-2005, 03:30 AM
To (attempt) to put an end to this desperate fucking thread

you can tell how shit the Futureheads and Bloc party are going to be by their shit names

full stop.

What is disappointing with a lot of these bands (and Tom Vek) is that they all
SOUND the same. It's like the post-postpunk meatgrinder has just one hole ...

(having said that: I don't have much against Bloc Party, but if I hear another band
with "angular guitars" it's time to turn the power off on that grinder and put some
other things in (ACR/Defunkt?))

tryptych
24-05-2005, 02:58 PM
How can the Futureheads et al "create the worst music that has ever existed" yet be "a breath of fresh air compared to coldplay and travis" and "be a fun listen to once in a while" (Silverdollar)?

simon silverdollar
24-05-2005, 03:44 PM
i guess the thought is that a lot of baggage comes with this new 'post-punk' stuff that's coming out, that can make listening to it very depressing.
if a band presents itself as exciting, and takes its cues from music that is/was exciting, then the fact that the band are not exciting can be very sad, sadder than than other non-exciting music that is not presented, and influenced, in the same way.

also, there's the thought that aiming just low enough can be worse than aiming high and failing miserably. even, travis, who i don't like at all, do aim pretty high: they're always striving to be epic, to do this ultra-serious, poignant stadium filling music. now, you can say that those aren't worthy goals, and i'd kind of agree, but even aiming high at the wrong targets can be better than just aiming to be an inoffensive, catchy take on music made 20 years ago.

but i'd rather not use dissensus as a comments box for defending my blog, so may be PM me or e-mail me if you want to continue this.