luka said:should there be laws against him? eh? eh?
matt b said:mr irving chose to go back to a country where he had previously made statements that had broken the law. he is led solely by his ego, but his ego is dumb. deserved.
IdleRich said:I think that it is better with someone like this to hold up their arguments for everyone to see, show clearly that they are wrong and treat him with this distain that he deserves rather than prosecuting him.
droid said:What about freedom of speech? Do his particular statements about the particulars of what he describes as 'the Jewish tragedy in WW2' (he wont use the word 'holocaust') constitute incitement to hatred and a danger to individuals and society?
droid said:The fact that the prosectuition was based on something Irving said 15 years ago, and has since rescinded. makes me wonder about the motivations behind the trial and the strength of the Neo-Nazi movement in Austria...
IdleRich said:... but you can't arrest someone for what they say can you?
"It's the same as "Intelligent Design" and "AIDs is a myth" - some stuff is SO BOLLOCKS that it just deserves a flat kicking every time it rears its head"
"i don't see the link with islam in this case- freedom to offend is different from freedom to peddle lies."
"That does put it in a different context and I wasn't aware of it. I would ask in what manner he has rescinded it though and whether he still comes out with objectionable nonsense at his lectures etc"
IdleRich said:The offended Muslims will clearly see that as one law for them and another for Jews. In fact they had already drawn this comparison
"well, there is 'one law' for jews (along with all other ethnic groups) and muslims (who are not an ethnic group)- the race relations act 1976."
IdleRich said:but that's not how they are seen in the Islamic world..
IdleRich said:Also, when people say that the reason there couldn't be a law against such cartoons because it would contravene "freedom of speech" then this principle is being held up as absolute so Muslims are entitled to feel hard done by when two weeks later it is shown that there are exceptions..
IdleRich said:At bottom I do think that arresting holocaust-deniers contravenes freedom of speech.
matt b said:yes. but seeing irving's face as the verdict was read out made me laugh- snivilling nazi-apologists don't get ANY sympathy from me
"has 'freedom of speech as an absolute' been the central point raised"
"yes. but seeing irving's face as the verdict was read out made me laugh- snivilling nazi-apologists don't get ANY sympathy from me"
IdleRich said:I thought that it was implicit in some of the things that were said..