Whither Dancehall?

Woebot

Well-known member
Or should that read wither?

2003 the form experiences a minor explosion. And then last year, not much.

I know fans like the esteemed Stelfox can appreciate the genres subtleties (and thanks Dave for the double CD round-up) but as far as something as infectious as Diwali/Coolie Dance (a 2003 riddim!) there's not been much in the way of greatness.

Another weird thing about Dancehall, the sound has (to my ears at least) crept into the zone of First World Music, perhaps a result of:

a) universalising technology/audio parity
b) assimilation with US r'n'b

to the extent that (again to me at least) its lost the alien-other sonic appeal which drew me into it in the first place.
 

steve-k

Active member
Timbaland and the Neptunes didn't do too much in 2004 either, so maybe it just wasn't a great year for beat-making on this side of the pond, but they'll all come back in 2005. Wait till next year as baseball fans would say.
 

Hadean

10 below
still nice again

still loving it, though trying to come up with a good response to your interesting points

currently well into Chaka Chaka riddim
Beenie Man's dissonant vocal melody version
and either Wayne Marshall or Busy Signal's singsongsyncopation one

and Lenky's Bubble Up
which (per Zemko, Harvell & Stelfox) has exquisitely elaborate versions
like an incredibly poignant/mysterious fairytale videogame world
 

Logan Sama

BestThereIsAtWhatIDo
Not to be a negative voice, but riddims like the Chaka Chaka are why Dancehall is currently in a decline.
 

john eden

male pale and stale
the eternal return.

It's really hard to get a proper chronolgy sorted because of the "lag" between stuff coming out on dubplate and the on pre 7" and then on riddim compilations.

But I think it's a classic case of things going in cycles. For example there were some great tunes maybe 1998/1999 like Space Invaders, Bruk Bottle and other bits and bobs with decent basslines on them.

Then in 2001-ish you had the first flush of Ward 21 and TOK (anti-spy etc). And then late 2002 early 2003 you had Sean Paul, Diwali and a whole heap of other stuff.

The question I suppose is twofold: why does this happen, and when will the next wave be?

I suppose it could happen because producers react against the poppiness emerging by getting more abstract or underground. Or it could be because every innovation is met with tiny bits of incremental imitation for a while until someone shakes things up.

Buggered if I'm going to put my neck on the line though and predict the next outcrop of insanity.

What did people think of Red Alert though? Doesn't that fit into Simon R's thing about E culture moving from US Hip Hop over to JA? Molex or Stelfox probably know better but I'm sure I've heard a couple of riddims recently there were distinctly acidy/technoey.
 

Logan Sama

BestThereIsAtWhatIDo
Has anyone looked into reasons behind the recent rise in bpm counts of many of the big riddim tracks compared to previous years?
 

dubplatestyle

Well-known member
"red alert" was my favorite riddim from last year, with "bubble up" and "scoobay" right behind. a lot of stuff seems to be moving at a techno-ified clip these days.

logan why is "chaka chaka" sign of a decline? (i haven't heard it.)
 

dubplatestyle

Well-known member
the tempo/structure of the tunes surely has something to do with the (current?) vogue for dance crazes ala the mashed potato too.
 

Hadean

10 below
man a badman DJ !

Red Alert is also one of my faves of 2004
Kananga & Zaire - "Real King" may even be my fave song of the year

"Me and my warriors trod into town
just to pick'up a few things and look around
stop in a moneygram so I that could catch a loan..."


very Chaka Demus & Pliers, but one of the most exuberant songs I've ever heard
 

john eden

male pale and stale
Hadean said:
very Chaka Demus & Pliers

Chaka Demus & Pliers RULE! :D Burst out laughing when I saw the pub in Little Britain named after them...

will have to check that tune.
 
C

captain easychord

Guest
red alert was definitely my fav of the year. it's true, a lot of the riddims are getting pretty quick, summer bounce has got to be close to 130, kopa is up there too. i think it has a lot do with dancehall's burgeoning popularity, in particular as functional dance music, with producers upping the BPM's and DJ's upping the whole dance craze thing. and maybe its popularity (esp, as woebot has pointed out, in the first world) is responsible for a purging of a lot of the more spiritual/philosophical or conversely "i'm a bodmon" lyrical aspects (which both seem to fit better with slower, low-slung grooves.)
 

bun-u

Trumpet Police
I tend to concur with Woebot having felt underwhelmed by recent dancehall. That said, I base this only on my purchasing of Greensleeves best of 2004 cd and a couple of riddim LPs ((Scoobay, Marmalade).

99/00 was my favourite period of dancehall ….Mr Vegas and Buccaneer, what ever happened to them?
 
I'll agree to the decline as well, and to the convergence of reggae/soca. Probably "Dude"/"Vitamin S" continued to run things in 2004 (as least in NYC) - as far as break out tunes go.

On the year end Hot97 MassiveB/Bobby Konders show, they asked people to vote for their fave tracks of the year. Elephant Man's "Bad Bun Mind" came out on top followed by I-Wayne's "Can't Satisfy Her".

Actually, I've wondered if the HUGE explosion in Reggaeton's popularity has taken away steam from Reggae (most likely a far flung idea). But by the sound of this thread, it seems like the actual weakness of the music itself, is the primary cause for it's declining popularity?
 

Woebot

Well-known member
Nostra Namus said:
Elephant Man's "Bad Bun Mind"
pains me as it does to admit it, but i just dont enjoy elephant mans stuff. saw a video of him performing live (swarming with ladies) and that went some way to accounting for his appeal.

bun-u said:
Greensleeves Comps
its a respectable option bun-u! i tend to pick up the VP comps vol32 out now. but interestingly their vol31 which came out amidst the diwali fever was a double LP whereas this one (again as per usual) a single. good indication methinks. i'm not a hardcore dancehall fan like molex roots, stelfox or eden so my default position these days tends to be to pick up the comps unless (like it was in 1991-2 in the past) tings are hot. lame i know....

reggae DOES have these periodic surges doesnt it:

era1: Guns of Navarone
era2: Liquidator
era3: Uptown Top Ranking
era4: Murder She Wrote
era5: Get Busy
 

dubplatestyle

Well-known member
i used to like elephant man quite a bit, but now i'm all but burnt out on him. i can feel vybz kartel fatigue coming on too. you know, they pump out so much material, and when they become the fan favorite for a season or two and are on every comp...you just get sick of their little catch phrases, their shtick.
 

Clubberlang

Well-known member
WOEBOT said:
reggae DOES have these periodic surges doesnt it:

era1: Guns of Navarone
era2: Liquidator
era3: Uptown Top Ranking
era4: Murder She Wrote
era5: Get Busy

I think those are just the points when the rest of the world notices, but music in Jamaica is almost always of a very consistently high quality (a glance at the last five-six years of Greensleeves/VP comps will confirm that "Get Busy"/Diwali was certainly no fluke and just one of hundreds of amazing tracks which dancehall was churning out over that period.)

I do miss Elephant Man though (although I will concede that after four albums and a million singles he does sort of lose a bit of novelty--even Bounty Killer and Beenie Man can provoke this kind of fatigue in me eventually.) Still I am sad he's almost completely non-present on the recent spate of years-best compilations which were definitely a little weaker this year than in years previous. I don't think this had as much to do with lack of quality as perhaps with licensing problems--given the huge sucesses of the previous year, I think perhaps the best artists held their tracks back for release on their own albums. I could be wrong about this, but it would explain their conspicuous absense from Greensleeves' collections this time around.
 
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