Just what the hell's going on in London?

john eden

male pale and stale
One thing is for sure, putting scores of armed cops on the streets will do nothing to stop this. It is a PR exercise aimed at Lambeth's chattering classes.

The police weren't there when these kids got shot, so whether or not they were armed makes no difference. One of the kids was apparently shot because of a mistaken identity. Having armed police as a permanent presence on estates in south london simply heightens the likelihood of more mistaken identities like Charles De Menzes or Harry Stanley.
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
Oh, I'd agree with that. Plus it's just going to encourage kids to carry guns, I think - in their eyes, they'll have to protect themselves from the cops and other gangs.

It's a tough one, and no mistake. Although I have to say, I think Cameron's on the right track, although whether his ideas could ever be translated into a workable policy that isn't just going to penalise people unfairly is another matter.
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
Yup. In fact I think it's mentioned in one of the murder stories. Pretty depressing all round.
 

matt b

Indexing all opinion
cameron's a bandwagon jumping cnut;

"The Tory leader called for a "complete change in our values"."

he was part of the tory party that started this legacy, he can't turn round and not take any responsibility for it.

he's just spouting vague nothings for political gain
 

swears

preppy-kei
he was part of the tory party that started this legacy, he can't turn round and not take any responsibility for it.

Yeah, it's pretty sickening isn't it?
There's no excuse for going around commiting heinous acts of violence, but if some of these young people could actually get decent jobs, felt like they had a future, then we wouldn't have half these problems.
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
I guess today's teenagers are the kids of people who were teenagers themselves in the 1980s.
What goes around, comes around.
 

matt b

Indexing all opinion
politicians don't give a fuck about these kids, its moral handwringing and platitudes. increase the fear of the middle classes, get them to vote for the 'tough' politicians.

i live in a nice middle class village and plenty of the adults are shit scared of anyone between 10-18: they won't talk to them, walk near them, ask them to pick up litter etc. its assumed they're gangsters.
having lived in plenty of shitholes (meadows in nottm being the least pleasant) i assure them these kids are angels in comparison to some of the neighbours i've had- it makes no difference, they're "scared to go out at night" etc.

its serving its purpose
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
politicians don't give a fuck about these kids, its moral handwringing and platitudes. increase the fear of the middle classes, get them to vote for the 'tough' politicians.

i live in a nice middle class village and plenty of the adults are shit scared of anyone between 10-18: they won't talk to them, walk near them, ask them to pick up litter etc. its assumed they're gangsters.
having lived in plenty of shitholes (meadows in nottm being the least pleasant) i assure them these kids are angels in comparison to some of the neighbours i've had- it makes no difference, they're "scared to go out at night" etc.

its serving its purpose

That'll be the Daily Mail working its magic, then.

I think this report is more about the way things are bad for kids themselves, rather than crime or antisocial behaviour committed by kids, although obviously the two things are related.
 

matt b

Indexing all opinion
I think this report is more about the way things are bad for kids themselves

absolutely- you've got kids with no aspirations, who don't see a long-term future available to them, because generally they haven't- social mobility has collapsed, and these kids are at the bottom of the pile, forgotten.

no wonder they focus on immediate gratification/ excitement through weed, petty crime etc and have such high levels of depression.
 
O

Omaar

Guest
i can see listening to all that grime's having an impact ;)

on C4 news' piece on this last night Jon Snow did suggest it was the drugs, the guns, the gangs ... and the music ... later they played a bit of a roll deep video from some trident media release package or something.
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
I'm reminded of Chris Morris's awesome 'Uzi Lover' video he recorded as the rapper 'Fur Q'.

 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
It's hardly the whole story but I think it's a big part of it. A lot of these kids grow up with no father figure at all, and it's not good for people's development, especially boys, it seems.
 

matt b

Indexing all opinion
its a tiny part of it.

in iceland there is a higher % of single mothers than here.

their prison population is thelowest in the OECD (37 per 100,000)

income disparity, the run down of social networks etc is far more important
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
There are absolutely loads of factors invloved, and the economic one is obviously very important. But it's also the case that kids from single parent families are disproportionatly more likely to have few quailifications, abuse drink or drugs and commit crimes.
 
Top