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IdleRich
24-09-2007, 01:49 PM
At least the fashion industry has benefitted from the Iraq war

http://www.style.it/cont/vogue/photo/default.asp

Or maybe that should be in the humour thing or who the fuck knows where really. It's certainly beyond satire.

jenks
24-09-2007, 02:16 PM
Isn't that just the oddest thing?

I can't work out if it is a work of genius or the crassest thing i have ever seen.:confused:

zhao
24-09-2007, 03:25 PM
it's the crassest thing you've ever seen. trust me.

swears
24-09-2007, 03:40 PM
I wonder what people will think of that spread long after the war is over, say in...oh, sorry I forgot, it'll probably never be over.

turtles
24-09-2007, 06:31 PM
yeah that's pretty horrifying. there's all sorts of real creepy red-white-and-blue "American" fantasies being played out there...war porn, essentially.

nomadologist
24-09-2007, 07:51 PM
it's crass, but I can't help but think that the person who made it fancied themselves ingenious while doing it. they were probably trying to make the point about american obsession with violence and war porn like the endless stream of Saving Private Ryan remakes and they thought they were all clever by going way out there on that limb and trying to make war look sexy.

i have this drop-waisted minidress that is in desert storm camo print that i used to wear. it stopped being funny about 3 years ago, though...

petergunn
24-09-2007, 09:06 PM
At least the fashion industry has benefitted from the Iraq war

http://www.style.it/cont/vogue/photo/default.asp

Or maybe that should be in the humour thing or who the fuck knows where really. It's certainly beyond satire.

moral of story: it appears far more enjoyable to be in the fashion industry than to serve in the armed forces...

nomadologist
24-09-2007, 09:08 PM
hey wait--this isn't even american. it's in italian vogue.

Guybrush
24-09-2007, 10:27 PM
I don’t really keep up with fashion photography trends, but I find this unimaginative and slightly offensive. It’s like you can tick yourself through a checklist with these kinds of projects: the homoerotic innuendos (check!), the cod-risqué upending of societal power structures (check!), the stylization of death and grief as a means to evoke publicity (check!). Deadly dull.

Dunninger
25-09-2007, 10:35 AM
War as a fratboy party gangbang scenario, nice.:eek:

Shows some of the fantasies about 'going to war' and having a great adventure that are still in people's minds.

hundredmillionlifetimes
26-09-2007, 05:27 AM
War as a fratboy party gangbang scenario, nice.:eek:

Shows some of the fantasies about 'going to war' and having a great adventure that are still in people's minds.

Unlike many of the posts above, I don't easily dismiss Meisal's work as simply crass; that's just too easy, and perhaps misses their actual affects. The whole point of these photos is to engender an uneasy hesitation, a simultaneous attraction/repulsion, which should be obvious given their clear-cut status as pure surreal appearance.

For crassness, might it not be more appropriate to try instead Brian De Palma's latest 'fratboy party gangbang scenario" - but masquerading as outraged sanctimonious piety - here:


"Redacted" stuns Venice, Fri Aug 31, 2007, By Silvia Aloisi

VENICE (Reuters) - A new film about the real-life rape and killing of a 14-year-old Iraqi girl by U.S. soldiers who also murdered her family stunned the Venice festival, with shocking images that left some viewers in tears ... (http://today.reuters.com/news/articlenews.aspx?type=entertainmentnews&storyid=2007-08-31t150344z_01_l31903844_rtrukoc_0_us-venice-iraq.xml&src=rss&rpc=22&sp=true)

tate
26-09-2007, 06:49 AM
Unlike many of the posts above, I don't easily dismiss Meisal's work as simply crass; that's just too easy, and perhaps misses their actual affects. The whole point of these photos is to engender an uneasy hesitation, a simultaneous attraction/repulsion, which should be obvious given their clear-cut status as pure surreal appearance.

For crassness, might it not be more appropriate to try instead Brian De Palma's latest 'fratboy party gangbang scenario" - but masquerading as outraged sanctimonious piety - here:


"Redacted" stuns Venice, Fri Aug 31, 2007, By Silvia Aloisi

VENICE (Reuters) - A new film about the real-life rape and killing of a 14-year-old Iraqi girl by U.S. soldiers who also murdered her family stunned the Venice festival, with shocking images that left some viewers in tears ... (http://today.reuters.com/news/articlenews.aspx?type=entertainmentnews&storyid=2007-08-31t150344z_01_l31903844_rtrukoc_0_us-venice-iraq.xml&src=rss&rpc=22&sp=true)
I virtually never respond to your posts concerning art or aesthetics because frankly I've never thought them worth replying to.

But this one is worth addressing, as it exposes you for the philosophical fraud that you are. You do a nice job of keeping dissensians informed with numerous cut-and-paste links, the majority of which are interesting. But when you attempt to articulate an aesthetic position yourself, you produce embarrassing results.

The fact of the matter is that your fondness for Meisal's work is an excellent example of the kind of 'postmodern' relativism or whatever it is that you rail against so frequently. Since you find this kind of thing "attractive/repulsive," you attempt to justify the pictures, or explicate them, claiming that to call them "crass" is "too easy, and perhaps misses their actual effects." Well maybe the dismissal misses their "effects" on you lol, but that's apparently because you like this kind of thing, as has been well documented on many occasions on dissensus.

But for many others -- or maybe it's just me, I don't know, and frankly I don't care -- there is no "attraction/revulsion" created by these photographs, as they are about as obvious, cliched, easy, and predictable as one can imagine. It is not at all "too easy" to dismiss them but in fact very easy, as they are fucking boring, unimaginative, and practically paint-by-numbers, with all of the predictable ingredients.

Also, these photographs do not, in any way, "engender an uneasy hesitation" in this particular viewer, as I know very well what I am looking at, and the only thing that they invoke is boredom, and a feeling that I am in the presence of shlock. Well-lighted, well-made-up shlock, with all of the signifiers that certain bloggers love so much. But "uneasy hesitation"? Um, no.

If anything, the one service that this spread provides, is to ensnare the frauds, such as yourself, by luring you into its defense. And in that the spread succeeded very well! I now know that no matter how many provocative and worthwhile critiques of capitalism, racism, the war, postmodernism, relativism, ironism, and the like that hundredmillionlifetimes presents, he nevertheless looks at this spread and others by Meisal and thinks, "hmmm, yes, just look at the attraction/revulsion that I feel, notice how there is an uneasy hesitation within myself created by this ...." That says it all, or enough, for this particular viewer, about the quality and value of your aesthetic judgment.

What amazes me about a certain group of dissensians in particular, is how they have chosen "postmodernism" and the relativism/ironism supposedly produced by it, as their primary philosophical opponent, yet at the same time, they are the ones who exemplify this position better than anyone else. Badiou's maths may be questionable, but hey 'no problem, it's the result of a decision.' Hmm, nice argument there. (Nevermind that the problem/question/matrix of 'decision' is a very old one that has been discussed and analyzed at great length in recent times, cf Nancy and those whom he writes about). Meisal's laaaaame-assed, obvious, predictable, utterly cookie-cutter 'make love not war' themed photographs are -- wait for it -- actually "pure surreal appearance"according to hmlt and therefore are somehow philosophically or aesethetically important. Well hmlt , the fact that you see in these photographs "pure surreal appearance" tells me all I need to know about your critical faculties. If there's a better example of groundless postmodernism in this neck of the internet, I don't know what it would be. Oh yeah, come to think of it, K-Punk endorsing a comparison between Sunn 0))) and traditional qawwali, that might come close actually ...

zhao
26-09-2007, 09:15 AM
For crassness, might it not be more appropriate to try instead Brian De Palma's latest 'fratboy party gangbang scenario" - but masquerading as outraged sanctimonious piety - here:


"Redacted" stuns Venice, Fri Aug 31, 2007, By Silvia Aloisi

VENICE (Reuters) - A new film about the real-life rape and killing of a 14-year-old Iraqi girl by U.S. soldiers who also murdered her family stunned the Venice festival, with shocking images that left some viewers in tears ... (http://today.reuters.com/news/articlenews.aspx?type=entertainmentnews&storyid=2007-08-31t150344z_01_l31903844_rtrukoc_0_us-venice-iraq.xml&src=rss&rpc=22&sp=true)

obviously haven't seen this film but after reading the review I'm having serious difficulties imagining that it is masquerading as anything other than what it is. how many will see it as a celebration of abject violence, rape, and murder? even in the heart of the beast, in the depths of moral depravity, i seriously doubt anyone will.

gek-opel
26-09-2007, 11:40 AM
But for many others -- or maybe it's just me, I don't know, and frankly I don't care -- there is no "attraction/revulsion" created by these photographs, as they are about as obvious, cliched, easy, and predictable as one can imagine. It is not at all "too easy" to dismiss them but in fact very easy, as they are fucking boring, unimaginative, and practically paint-by-numbers, with all of the predictable ingredients.

What amazes me about a certain group of dissensians in particular, is how they have chosen "postmodernism" and the relativism/ironism supposedly produced by it, as their primary philosophical opponent, yet at the same time, they are the ones who exemplify this position better than anyone else. Badiou's maths may be questionable, but hey 'no problem, it's the result of a decision.' Hmm, nice argument there. (Nevermind that the problem/question/matrix of 'decision' is a very old one that has been discussed and analyzed at great length in recent times, cf Nancy and those whom he writes about). Meisal's laaaaame-assed, obvious, predictable, utterly cookie-cutter 'make love not war' themed photographs are -- wait for it -- actually "pure surreal appearance"according to hmlt and therefore are somehow philosophically or aesethetically important. Well hmlt , the fact that you see in these photographs "pure surreal appearance" tells me all I need to know about your critical faculties. If there's a better example of groundless postmodernism in this neck of the internet, I don't know what it would be. Oh yeah, come to think of it, K-Punk endorsing a comparison between Sunn 0))) and traditional qawwali, that might come close actually ...

Hmm well its obviously not entirely unproblematic to advance on the basis of "a decision", but that is very much Badiou's own position is it not? This metaphor appears at various levels in his work, clearly inspired as much by the decisions of political militancy as by the decisions made possible by post-Cantorian set theory (ie- what version of set theory, what vision of possible ontologies, to operate under).

I totally agree however that these photographs (especially with added horrific flash animation) are just cheesecake pseudo-soft porn aren't they, neither conceptually nor aesthetically of value, rote and lame... not even well lit really... and yeah they could be seen as interesting in a "lol so bad they're good" PoMo manner, but really...

Tate, (as grumpily fastidious as ever) you are correct, there is a certain sense that people want to have their postmodern cake and eat it too, and that although they wish to oppose certain effects of postmodernity, they are unwilling to give up on all its possible fruits. There are distinctions (though fuzzy and weak perhaps) which may be drawn between "good" postmodernism and "bad" PoMo, between the aspects which follow logically on from high modernism (and are of value and interest) and those which revel in tired and "empty" PoMo game-playing... but I'm not sure how well these can be elucidated or what they imply about the supposedly principled political/aesthetic position of total opposition.

Also... what is yr own position on this, you are clearly massively riled up by what you perhaps accurately diagnose as an incoherent intellectually hypocritical position (which as you say certainly explicates the paradoxes of postmodernity extremely clearly)...?

hundredmillionlifetimes
26-09-2007, 11:47 AM
Tate, your emotive, hysterical response is beneath contempt. It is clear that you know so little about art that you can't even distinguish between modernism and post-modernism. Steve Meisel's work is unflinchingly modernist (whereas for instance De Palma's films are famously post-modernist, with his latest, Redacted, an exercise in predictable war porn, as well as yet another replication of his similar Casualties of War from over a decade ago). Just because Meisal's photos appear in a disposable fashion mag, as opposed to the Tate Modern, allows you to cluelessly dismiss them as thrash, blinded by traditional bourgeois modes, systems and media of art discourse, while simultaneously engaging in a raving personalised character assassination, the latter the true purpose of your unhinged tirade.

I'll not bother saying any more, because you've no interest in any serious engagement with the subject; instead I'll repost K-punk's incisive analysis of Meisel's previous Vogue spread from last year. Spit away, then, in further self-righteous buffoonery.


Fantasy Kits: Steven Meisel’s State of Emergency (http://www.ballardian.com/fantasy-kits-steven-meisels-state-of-emergency/)

A few weeks ago (http://k-punk.abstractdynamics.org/archives/008304.html), I asked whether it would be possible ‘for there to be a pornography, sponsored by Dior or Chanel, scripted by a latter-day Masoch or Ballard, whose fantasies were as artfully staged as the most glamorous fashion photo shoot?’ Steven Meisel’s Vogue photo-shoot, much more than Mike Figgis’s drearily vanilla (http://www.agentprovocateur.com/miss_x/shadows.php)promotional films for Agent Provocateur, suggests that such a pornography is conceivable.

‘State of Emergency’ shows, once again, that it is left to high fashion to take up the role that fine art has all but abandoned. While much of fine art has succumbed to the ‘passion for the real’, high fashion remains the last redoubt of Appearance and Fantasy.

The used tampons and pickled animals of Reality Art offer, at best, tracings of the empirical. Their quaint biographism reveals nothing of the unconscious. Meisel’s elegantly-staged photographs, meanwhile, drip with an ambivalence worthy of the best Surrealist paintings. They are uncomfortable and arousing in equal measure because they reflect back to us our conflicted attitudes and unacknowledged libidinal complicities. (In this respect, they form a sharp contrast with the infinitely more exploitative image being used to front the American Express Red campaign (http://www.any-body.org/), whose meaning is easily anchored to the co-ordinates of the currently dominant ideological constellation.)



Reframed as Art, the Vogue photographs would no doubt be described — in the all-too familiar terms of art-critical muzak — as ‘negotiating with ideas of violence/ terror/ etc.’ As high fashion, they meet instead with a type of liberal denunciation that is no less familiar. In the Guardian, Joanna Bourke (http://arts.guardian.co.uk/features/story/0,,1871261,00.html)complained that, ‘It is no coincidence that the security forces are shown to be protecting us from a person who is neither male nor obviously Muslim’. Would Bourke have preferred it, then, if the images did feature a Muslim man?


Bourke continues:


Instead, the terrorist threat is an unreal woman. In contrast to the security personnel depicted, she is placed beyond the realm of the human. Her skin is as plastic as a mannequin’s; her body is too perfect, even when grimacing in pain. When the model is depicted as the aggressor, she remains nothing more than the phallic dominatrix of many adolescent boys’ wet dreams. In both instances, the beauty of the photographs transforms acts of violence and humiliation into erotic possibilities.

Again, what would Bourke have preferred: simulated snuff in which ‘real-looking’ women were roughed up by security staff? Bourke’s hostility to the fantasmatic is oddly doubled by the aggression of the security personnel towards the ‘unreal’ women. And what does it mean to substitute an ‘unreal woman’ for an all-too-real Muslim male, in any case? What does the confusion of ontological levels — agents of reality conjoined with the waxy artificiality of Bellmer-doll fashion models — tell us? The photographs are fascinating and unsettling because there are no straightforward answers to these questions.


Needless to say, Meisel’s photographs do find erotic possibilities in violence and humiliation, but this is not so much a ‘transformation’ as a rediscovery. Two hundred years after Sade, a century after Bataille and Masoch, it appears that anything which publicly acknowledges that eroticism is inseparable from violence and humiliation is more unacceptable than ever. The issue is not how ‘healthy’ sexuality can be purged of violence, but how the violence inherent to sexuality can be sublimated. Meisel’s photographs — which, we should remember, appear in a magazine the vast majority of whose readership is not ‘adolescent males’ but women — are ‘fantasy kits’ which offer just such sublimations, providing scenarios, role-play cues and potential fantasmatic identifications.

‘State of Emergency’ demonstrates that, rather than simply retaining its capacity to shock, The Atrocity Exhibition is more disturbing than ever. The overt sexualisation and compulsory carnality of postmodern image culture distracts us from the essential staidness of its rendition of the erotic. As Baudrillard argues in Seduction, biologised sex functions as the reality principle of contemporary culture: everything is reducible to sex, and sex is just a matter of meat mechanics. Ours is an age of cynicism and piety, which, as Simon suggested in his initial post (http://www.ballardian.com/jgbs-sinister-marriage/)on ‘State of Emergency’, primly and pruriently resists the equivalences between eroticism, violence and celebrity that Ballard explored.


Entering the exhibition, Travis sees the atrocities of Vietnam and the Congo mimetised in the ‘alternate’ death of Elizabeth Taylor; he tends the dying film star, eroticising her punctured bronchus in the over-ventilated verandas of the London Hilton; he dreams of Max Ernst, superior of the birds’.

———————————————-
JG Ballard, The Atrocity Exhibition
———————————————-


To imagine the atrocities of September 11th and Abu Ghraib mimetised in the alternate death of Paris Hilton feels far more unacceptable, because contemporary piety has sacralised its atrocities in a way that the 60s could not. In Atrocity, Dr Nathan’s reminder that, at the level of the unconscious, ‘the tragedies of Cape Kennedy and Vietnam…may in fact play very different parts from the ones we assign them’ is extremely timely. (As Burroughs tells us in his preface to The Atrocity Exhibition, ‘Surveys indicate that wet dreams in many cases have no overt sexual content, whereas dreams with an overt sexual content in many cases do not result in orgasm’.) It is clear that the appalling Abu Ghraib photographs were already intensely eroticised stagings whose scenarios were derived from cheap American pornography. Love and Napalm: Export USA, indeed*. Part of the reason that the Abu Ghraib images were so traumatic for a deeply conflicted American culture which combines religious moralism with hyper-sexualised commerce, and which is united only by a taste for megaviolence, is that they exposed the equation between military intervention and sexual humiliation that the official culture both depends upon and must suppress.



It’s interesting to compare both The Atrocity Exhibition and ‘State of Emergency’ to Martha Rosler’s series of collages, Bringing the War Home. ‘Sixties iconography: the nasal prepuce of LBJ, crashed helicopters, the pudenda of Ralph Nader, Eichmann in drag, the climax of a New York happening: a dead child’: this typical section from The Atrocity Exhibition could almost be a gloss on Rosler’s images, with their irruptions of war and atrocity amidst domestic scenes. But in Rosler’s case, unlike in Ballard’s, surrealist juxtaposition has a clear polemical purpose. The Atrocity Exhibition, like ‘State of Emergency’, is devoid of any decipherable intent; the oneiric juxtapositions in Ballard’s and Meisel’s work seemed to be conceived of as neutral re-presentations of the substitutions and elisions made by the mediatised unconscious.


Meisel’s fantasy kits, their narratives left implicit and mysterious, suggest ways in which Ballard might be adapted in future. Part of the problem with Weiss’s film adaptation (http://www.ballardian.com/weiss-interview-1)of The Atrocity Exhibition is that it subordinated the fragmentary mode of the novel to the duree — the lived time — of the feature film. The most successful part of the film was perhaps the first few moments, where Ballard’s text was intoned over still images in a style reminiscent of Marker’s La Jetee (http://www.ballardian.com/la-jetee)(a film which Ballard adores, of course). That is partly because it is the profound stillness of the Surrealist paintings which The Atrocity Exhibition describes and appropriates — their beaches drained of time — which sets the rhythm of the novel. The most successful adaptation of The Atrocity Exhibition would, precisely, be an exhibition — not only of photographs, but also of newsreel footage, mandalas, diagrams, paintings and notebooks. It would be left for the viewer-participant to assemble their own narratives from these fantasy kits.

gek-opel
26-09-2007, 11:57 AM
Hmm, but HMLT I'm not really sure that this latest photoshoot is really along the same lines as the previous one referred to by K-Punk ("State of Emergency" which certainly had some more interesting things going on conceptually and was really quite beautiful in a glassy Ballardian fashion).

"Make Love Not War" (or whatever its called) is cheesy and schlocky, rather than a "Fantasmic fantasy kit"-- its fantasy is strictly cliche, it doesn't open new territory or engender discomfort... rather than creating uneasy hyper-art-terrorism-porn it is softcore and banal... like an FHM or Maxim shoot with a larger than average budget.

IdleRich
26-09-2007, 12:18 PM
"A few weeks ago, I asked whether it would be possible ‘for there to be a pornography, sponsored by Dior or Chanel, scripted by a latter-day Masoch or Ballard, whose fantasies were as artfully staged as the most glamorous fashion photo shoot?’"
Why would someone want Dior or Chanel to sponsor rape?

hundredmillionlifetimes
26-09-2007, 12:24 PM
Hmm, but HMLT I'm not really sure that this latest photoshoot is really along the same lines as the previous one referred to by K-Punk ("State of Emergency" which certainly had some more interesting things going on conceptually and was really quite beautiful in a glassy Ballardian fashion).

A moment ago you were very sure, Gek. Which is it? They don't measure up to State of Emergency, yes, but not for those reasons; they essentially replicate that previous spread, which - incidentally - received the very same knee-jerk response as now evident hereabouts. Vogue is a women's mag, not some macho-jerk-off's Penthouse.

The 'philosophical fraudsters' are those who wallow in the entrails of BritArt ...

gek-opel
26-09-2007, 01:07 PM
"State of Emergency" had an icy cruelty to it, in the poses of models, the angles, the setting, the cold lighting. To argue as K-Punk did that it realises a kind of Ballardian pornography of arousal and discomfort is entirely fair and in no way projection...

"Make Love Not War" from title down is buff, sweaty, obvious... the only interest is created by overlaying a "popist"/perverse/PoMo misreading. Its bad porn, even if it is in a woman's magazine rather than a sticky lads-jazz-mag.

They also use models in a totally different way. One substitutes in female models in the place of (presumably Muslim) terrorist suspects... the sexuality is s/m... The other is seemingly (most of the time) more along the lines of an "entertaining the troops", its really confused and the sexuality is utterly conventional.

hundredmillionlifetimes
26-09-2007, 02:01 PM
"State of Emergency" had an icy cruelty to it, in the poses of models, the angles, the setting, the cold lighting. To argue as K-Punk did that it realises a kind of Ballardian pornography of arousal and discomfort is entirely fair and in no way projection...

"Make Love Not War" from title down is buff, sweaty, obvious... the only interest is created by overlaying a "popist"/perverse/PoMo misreading. Its bad porn, even if it is in a woman's magazine rather than a sticky lads-jazz-mag.

They also use models in a totally different way. One substitutes in female models in the place of (presumably Muslim) terrorist suspects... the sexuality is s/m... The other is seemingly (most of the time) more along the lines of an "entertaining the troops", its really confused and the sexuality is utterly conventional.

Gek, prostitution is rife in Iraq (and Afghanistan), and cheap, age-no-barrier: Iraqi and Afghan girls and women. Perhaps that's the problem here, soft-focus pin-up lighting aside: everyone knows about the torture of Muslims (so the substitutions in State of Emergency were immediate), but reports about the military-driven sex industries in Iraq and Afghanistan are rare.

adruu
26-09-2007, 02:26 PM
Actually most of the military sex-trade stuff is in dubai isn't it? that's what i've heard.

There is also MST to consider.

"Over 1100 cases of sexual assault and rape reported in the military last year, - but many more go unreported. It's known as MST—Military Sexual Trauma."
http://www.pbs.org/now/transcript/336.html

gek-opel
26-09-2007, 02:47 PM
You CAN totally read that into it... it still seems a bit of a stretch to me at least...

Rape does accompany war (all war) as soon as day follows night of course tho.

hundredmillionlifetimes
26-09-2007, 03:19 PM
obviously haven't seen this film but after reading the review I'm having serious difficulties imagining that it is masquerading as anything other than what it is. how many will see it as a celebration of abject violence, rape, and murder? even in the heart of the beast, in the depths of moral depravity, i seriously doubt anyone will.

It does so by disavowing it as war porn, as so many war movies routinely do, from Saving Private Ryan to BlackHawk Down, justifying all the imagery with cynical piety and indignation. As if the brutal mass-murder of Iraqi's is still some Big Secret that will only be finally revealed in 'make it real' big screen technicolour (when such images are long since all over the internet).

Shifting gear, everyone still imagines that Nick Ut's (http://acephalous.typepad.com/acephalous/2007/06/that_nick_ut.html)'iconic' (branded and mass-produced) 1972 photo of 9-year-old Phan Thị Kim Phúc somehow changed the course of the Vietnam War (it did no such thing), whereas such an image, if it were of a Western girl, would be instantly condemned as paedophiliac:

http://acephalous.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/2007/06/08/ut3.jpg


Hardly surprising, then, that precisely thirty-five years later, the very same Pulitzer prize-winning photographer should now be an active part of the emotional pornography of the Paparazzi, having snapped this:

http://acephalous.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/2007/06/08/ut2.jpg

So maybe Meisel, in his supposed descent into 'cheap soft porn,' might re-create the Vietnam photo, but substituting a pouting Paris Hilton for the nine-year-old Vietnamese girl. Forrest Gump will be delighted ...

Grievous Angel
26-09-2007, 04:06 PM
i have this drop-waisted minidress that is in desert storm camo print that i used to wear. it stopped being funny about 3 years ago, though...

That sounds wicked!

My wife has a lovely A-line knee length skirt in camo print with a rose motif appliqued over the top, looks ace.

swears
26-09-2007, 04:55 PM
I was shocked and appalled by the soldiers' tribal tattoos. When will the horror end?

hundredmillionlifetimes
27-09-2007, 02:57 AM
You CAN totally read that into it... it still seems a bit of a stretch to me at least...

Rape does accompany war (all war) as soon as day follows night of course tho.

Well, we'll agree to differ, then. [God knows how supposedly knowledgeable people about music can gush forth about the appallingly cynical cashing-in pomo Restoration of reactionary rock dinosaurs, Led Weight, while rubbishing Meisel's work; anyway, I avoid those threads like the fucking plague].

Mr. Tea
27-09-2007, 02:23 PM
Well, we'll agree to differ, then. [God knows how supposedly knowledgeable people about music can gush forth about the appallingly cynical cashing-in pomo Restoration of reactionary rock dinosaurs, Led Weight, while rubbishing Meisel's work;

Haha, yeah, stupid old rock dinosaurs! I mean, it's not as if they were immensely sonically innovative, fused together a diverse range of musical influences and themselves influenced the evolution of entire genres for decades to come. The big twats.

There's this new band around at the moment I think you might like, they're called the Sex Pistols and they have really short songs and they swear and spit on the audience and everything!!!



anyway, I avoid those threads like the fucking plague].

Aww, shame. :(:(:(

Benny B
27-09-2007, 03:19 PM
Haha, yeah, stupid old rock dinosaurs! I mean, it's not as if they were immensely sonically innovative, fused together a diverse range of musical influences and themselves influenced the evolution of entire genres for decades to come. The big twats/

There's this new band around at the moment I think you might like, they're called the Sex Pistols and they have really short songs and they swear and spit on the audience and everything!!!



Aww, shame. :(:(:(

:D

noel emits
01-10-2007, 12:16 PM
Meanwhile, en Francé:

http://jezebel.com/assets/resources/2007/09/parisvoguesix.jpg

Mr. Tea
01-10-2007, 12:26 PM
I, for one, welcome our brass-titted neo-pagan cyber-totty overlords.

(Overladies. Whaveter.)

IdleRich
04-09-2008, 10:16 AM
More of the same.


"the August issue of Vogue India, in which a woman missing teeth holds a child wearing a $100 Fendi bib. In another shot, a toothless, barefoot man holds a $200 Burberry umbrella. Another photograph shows family of three riding a motorbike, with the mother holding a Hermès Birkin bag retailing for $10,000 or more. Since much of India is incredibly poor, critics are upset that the "real people" were used as models to feature things they probably will never afford."

http://jezebel.com/5044233/vogue-india-puts-fendi-bib-on-impoverished-child-critics-freak

Why change a wining formula I guess.

Mr. Tea
04-09-2008, 12:32 PM
Being controversial for the sake of being controversial (or even for the sake of flogging stuff) is the last refuge of the terminally unimaginative and hard-of-thinking. I'm reminded of Sugar Ape's 'Pissing Celebrities' issue.

It's a fashion magazine. It's written by pointless parasites for pointless parasites. What more needs to be said?

IdleRich
04-09-2008, 12:37 PM
"It's a fashion magazine. It's written by pointless parasites for pointless parasites. What more needs to be said?"
My girlfriend reads Vogue.

Mr. Tea
04-09-2008, 12:44 PM
My girlfriend reads Vogue.

What, really? That surprises me (a bit).

mixed_biscuits
04-09-2008, 12:51 PM
Defend your original assertion at all costs, Tea!

Mr. Tea
04-09-2008, 12:54 PM
Defend your original assertion at all costs, Tea!

Some of my best friends are parasites.

mixed_biscuits
04-09-2008, 12:54 PM
Some of my best friends are parasites.

So it would seem!

swears
04-09-2008, 02:33 PM
Think I'd rather hang out with someone that read Vogue, rather than Now or Heat or any other celeb mag. At least there's some creative input with fashion (sometimes).

crackerjack
04-09-2008, 02:40 PM
Think I'd rather hang out with someone that read Vogue, rather than Now or Heat or any other celeb mag. At least there's some creative input with fashion (sometimes).

Better looking readers too, I reckon. Not that i'm looking at rich's bird.