Pregnant US man hails 'miracle'

Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
Have we done this story yet?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/americas/7330196.stm

I've put it in this thread because it's surely a technological achievement, rather than a 'natural' one (not that I believe in any kind of natural/unnatural dichotomy, but it's clearly man-made, if you excuse the pun).

Oh, and before you get too excited, the guy used to be a woman and had the op ten years ago, but must have been left with all the functional apparatus for this to be necessary. The phrase "having your cake and eating it" springs to mind. ;)
 
N

noel emits

a wonderful wooden reason
I imagine it will still be considered a wonderful miracle by the kid's school mates.

Sorry, I mean it's marvelous victory over social and gender norms and the fascism of the inherited animal body. No, really.
 
Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
His line about "It's my right to have children!" is straight out of Monty Python's Life Of Brian, if I'm not mistaken. Also, he's from 'Bend, Oregon' - guess that makes him a Bend-er, hur hur hur.
 
N

noel emits

a wonderful wooden reason
I suppose why not. It really shouldn't be an issue. It's hard not to think there must be some complex psychological business going on for someone who wants to do all that - and go on bloody TV with it, but then women / women must have children for all kinds of reasons every day and no-one really questions that. The other partner must be kind of understanding, she doesn't get to contribute genetic material - is that not possible?
 
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Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
I suppose theoretically they could have taken one of her eggs and done an in-vitro thing which 'he' would then bring to term - but I think they've actually just used some guy's sperm to impregnate Thomas.

Wow, that sentence sounds ODD.
 
P

Pestario

tell your friends
Haha, my work colleagues where just talking about this and I was expecting it to get the dissensus treatment. It's all a bit sensationalist isn't it. He's just a woman with a beard. Google 'Buck Angel' to explore the issue further (NSFW):p.

They could have both gotten pregnant and had a race.
 
subvert47

subvert47

I don't fight, I run away
Mr. Tea said:
The phrase "having your cake and eating it" springs to mind. ;)
Click to expand...

that's a good way of putting it :)

it works like this: a transman (female-to-male transsexual) does the usual stuff — takes testosterone, has a bilateral mastectomy — but doesn't have all the rest done (i.e. there wasn't the op). The hormones render everything inactive anyway, so a lot of transmen don't feel the need to undergo extreme surgery and have it all chopped out. Or have genital reconstruction (phalloplasty) either, since this isn't very effective anyway (though surgeons are getting better at it).

what is unusual is for a transman to stop taking hormones, allow everything to restart, and then make use of the revitalized organs — unusual, but it's not completely unheard of.

as long as you accept that a transman is a man then, yes, a man is pregnant.
 
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D

droid

Guest
I wouldve thought that longterm use of male hormones would present an obstacle to this kind of thing, and possibly cause health problems for the baby and the mother/father?
 
B

bassnation

the abyss
noel emits said:
I imagine it will still be considered a wonderful miracle by the kid's school mates.
Click to expand...

"is that your mum?"
"no, my mums my dad" etc.

if my experiences of school were anything to go by, it will be a stick used by the conforming mainstream of kids to beat him/her with, just like any kind of difference. that doesn't mean that its wrong, or shouldn't be allowed but i'd expect them to get a hard time over it.
 
subvert47

subvert47

I don't fight, I run away
droid said:
I wouldve thought that longterm use of male hormones would present an obstacle to this kind of thing and possibly cause health problems for the baby and the mother/father?
Click to expand...

Male hormones present an obstacle in that they shut everything down, but it starts up again when the hormones are stopped. When Matt Rice (with Pat Califia) was doing the same thing, they took loads of advice, doctors said it was possible, and as far as I know their son is healthy.
 
M

mistersloane

heavy heavy monster sound
subvert47 said:
Male hormones present an obstacle in that they shut everything down, but it starts up again when the hormones are stopped. When Matt Rice (with Pat Califia) was doing the same thing, they took loads of advice, doctors said it was possible, and as far as I know their son is healthy.
Click to expand...

Yeah I don't really get why the press has picked up on this when Pat n Matt (and presumably loads of others) did this years back, it's not as if Pat. Califia is shy of the press. Maybe it was too difficult to describe as a mainstream story back then or something.
 
N

nomadologist

Guest
subvert47 said:
that's a good way of putting it :)

it works like this: a transman (female-to-male transsexual) does the usual stuff — takes testosterone, has a bilateral mastectomy — but doesn't have all the rest done (i.e. there wasn't the op). The hormones render everything inactive anyway, so a lot of transmen don't feel the need to undergo extreme surgery and have it all chopped out. Or have genital reconstruction (phalloplasty) either, since this isn't very effective anyway (though surgeons are getting better at it).

what is unusual is for a transman to stop taking hormones, allow everything to restart, and then make use of the revitalized organs — unusual, but it's not completely unheard of.

as long as you accept that a transman is a man then, yes, a man is pregnant.
Click to expand...

Yeah this is obvs what happened...seems odd, some people are politically starting to question the "healthiness" of transsexual operations, and not from an anti-gay or anti-transsexual position, but from a "pro-gay" position where they don't believe gender identity should be something considered so "fixed" that it requires a literal transformation for the transgendered or pre-op transsexuals.

There's some interesting discussion going on anyway.
 
subvert47

subvert47

I don't fight, I run away
nomadologist said:
some people are politically starting to question the "healthiness" of transsexual operations, and not from an anti-gay or anti-transsexual position, but from a "pro-gay" position where they don't believe gender identity should be something considered so "fixed" that it requires a literal transformation for the transgendered or pre-op transsexuals.

There's some interesting discussion going on anyway.
Click to expand...

Going on where? Please tell me it's not some rehash of the old feminist anti-trans bullshit — scapegoating transpeople for reinforcing gender stereotypes?

Yes, it's interesting to discuss the nature of gender, but in the end it's very much a personal thing. If someone doesn't believe their own gender identity is fixed, that's perfectly fine. I like that idea — and more, I like how someone might choose to express it in themselves, what they might wear, how they might behave, etc. :)

But it's not for anyone — individually or as a group; pro-gay, anti-gay, pro-jesus, whatever — to impose their own idea of gender on anyone else; to tell them what their gender should or shouldn't be, what they should or shouldn't do about it; basically to tell them who they are and how they should live their lives.

If they're trying to do that, they can go and !^%£!!£!*!(*&£!(!(!*£^$^$( :mad:
 
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