Campaign For Real DJ's

alex

Do not read this.
Not saying that there isnt enough 'real' dj's, its just more & more now I seem to see mix cd's being handed out all over the place where the whole thing is clearly mixed on ableton/whatever those mixing programmes are, and it just sounds un-naturally tight..which I suppose would be good live, if, it were your own tunes, but handing out a mix cd, with released shit, none of your own, all mixed down on ableton, isnt the best look.

Yet these "dj's"seem to get given residency at clubs all in & around my area & beyond. not saying that there promotional tactic isnt working for them, as the flyer design & shit are spot on & the nights are obv well organised, but how long will it take before they are exposed and left to face a pair of 1210's & a mixer, with no lappy??..

i spose that they arent in it for the music, just 2 earn some quick p whilst at uni, but go work in primani if you want to do that..
 
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droid

Guest
Dunno about that. To be honest I think the problem with most DJs has been the same for years, unimaginative selections, limited scope, inability to construct a set the flows well.

In theory, Ableton and traktor etc... should have freed DJs from the shackles of the constant practise of beatmatching and allowed them to concentrate more on constructing a set and being adventurous with selections, but from my experience of using software to mix, you seem to get stuck in a much more rigid mindset when watching your tunes laid out in a grid on screen.

I wouldn't say software mixing is inherently bad though, there are good Djs and mixes out there, but it seems to lend itself more to showcase type mash ups and interminable techno sets than anything else.
 

martin

----
how long will it take before they are exposed and left to face a pair of 1210's & a mixer, with no lappy??..

This made me laugh, I'm not sure why. It just made me think of undercover reporters setting some sort of honey trap 'party booking', then running down the road chasing a 'false DJ' who's trying to hide his face from the camera.
 
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alex

Do not read this.
flylo's recent set at fwd was done on ableton (i think) and it was mega

it can be done

yea thats what im saying though, flylo i bet played most of his own stuff, or, previously unreleased joints..not whats in the current juno d/L chart
 

john eden

male pale and stale
15 years ago there were still shit dj's.

Having said that I still prefer to see people fiddling with bits of vinyl. But what Droid said is the most important thing.
 

alex

Do not read this.
15 years ago there were still shit dj's.

intriging, cause ableton & such wasnt about then, what did they do? where they just really shit & made up for it cause there tunes were banging, or just really shit & knew the promoter
 

john eden

male pale and stale
intriging, cause ableton & such wasnt about then, what did they do? where they just really shit & made up for it cause there tunes were banging, or just really shit & knew the promoter

Well there were a lot of what I guess you would call "bedroom DJs" who could beatmatch hours and hours of "deep" tracky shit which nobody danced to. Or people who just threw on a load of obvious "old skool hip hop" or who played in a tiny bar and boshed out "anthems" like they were in the main room of ministry of sound.

And yes, it was often about who you knew and how much energy you were prepared to put in to hanging out at the right places and being a sychophant. Which is one of the many reasons I couldn't really be arsed with being a "serious" DJ.
 

zhao

there are no accidents
like droid said it don't matter what you use.

how long will it take before Electric Guitarists are exposed and left to face a 12 string acoustic with no ampy??????????

i used to use turntables, now on ableton. the tools haven't changed, in essential ways at least, how shitty or unshitty i am.
 
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zhao

there are no accidents
do you not agree that electric guitar feedback just sounds un-natural, or is that just me? (probably just me)

that Bobby Dylan, who the fuck do he think he is? selling out to the Man with that amplifier shit, and forgetting his roots... man FUCK that guy.
 
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Alfons

Way of the future
Half guilty confession here, Ive been seperated from my turntables by 3000 km of the atlantic ocean for about a year now and have been doing mixes in ableton instead. At first I loved it, piecing together tracks, doing subtle edits, fx, multiple tracks, stuff that either cant be done or is really hard to do on 2 turntables.

But lately Ive felt that the mixes come out really sterile, even if you try to make them feel and sound more improvised and intuitive (i.e. recording the automation live and so on). Dunno if anyone besides myself really notices tho...

I guess Im an ok dj technically speaking, not a perfect beatmatcher or anything. But I don't really feel I have anything to prove in that area and recorded mixes definitely aren't a medium for that anyway (multiple takes, planned tracklists etc).


yea thats what im saying though, flylo i bet played most of his own stuff, or, previously unreleased joints..not whats in the current juno d/L chart

think he plays stuff from all over, all tho he does mash stuff up

but it seems to lend itself more to showcase type mash ups and interminable techno sets than anything else.

That's my gripe with using ableton or traktor in a live environment, nobody really seems to be using it to its full potential, instead it seems to be a tool for people who cant be bothered to beatmatch
 

Alfons

Way of the future
haha,

do you not agree that the mixing on that programme just sounds un-natural, or is that just me? (probably just me)

I do agree, maybe its just biased and I don't know if Id notice on other peoples mixes, but I feel that my ableton mixes feel more stiff and sterile, maybe its just something in my head.
 
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droid

Guest
Alex said:
do you not agree that the mixing on that programme just sounds un-natural, or is that just me? (probably just me)

Well, ironically enough, Ive always aimed for that 'perfect' sound, no wobbles, no dropped beats, but there is maybe something else going on with software mixing that irks... a certain linearity and a tendency to favour longer mixes over dynamic changes - also, despite the potential for playing 'unmixable tunes' with software, its strange how few ableton (old skool) jungle sets there are out there... it just takes to long to mark the loops precisely enough compared to 4/4 dubstep type stuff where the rhythm is much more defined.

Heres an example - a mix I did for blogariddims, the first half is Ableton and the second half is turntables... the second half has waaay more energy and vibes.

http://www.weareie.com/2007/02/blogariddims-16raggamortis-1.html
 
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droid

Guest
I guess Im an ok dj technically speaking, not a perfect beatmatcher or anything. But I don't really feel I have anything to prove in that area and recorded mixes definitely aren't a medium for that anyway (multiple takes, planned tracklists etc).

Multiple takes are just practise, planned tracklistings - nothing necessarily wrong with that.

Strangely enough though, despite the opportunities available for studio/internet mixes to be technically perfect, I still hear tons of mixes that are technically awful.

Quality control is the key.
 

zhao

there are no accidents
and drum machines.

DRUM MACHIINES ARE UNNATURAL. THEY ARE RIGID AND STIFF AND STERILE AND INHUMAN.

drummachineshavenosoul.jpg


maybe you should make stickers that say " ABLETON HAS NO SOUL"?
 
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droid

Guest
Drum machines are used by fakers who cant play the real thing. Have you ever heard real drummers Zhao? They shit all over your poseur drum machines :D
 

Alfons

Way of the future
Well, ironically enough, Ive always aimed for that 'perfect' sound, no wobbles, no dropped beats, but there is maybe something else going on with software mixing that irks... a certain linearity and a tendency to favour longer mixes over dynamic changes - also, despite the potential for playing 'unmixable tunes' with software, its strange how few ableton (old skool) jungle sets there are out there... it just takes to long to mark the loops precisely enough compared to 4/4 dubstep type stuff where the rhythm is much more defined.

Ive never been one of those "the mistakes make the mix human" types, don't mind hearing small mistakes, wobbles, pitch adjustments etc, but I prefer not hearing them.

its not that sort of thing that I find lacking from the ableton mixes tho, they just feel colder and more clinical somehow, hard to describe. At least the ones I do myself (not sure if I could tell the difference with other peoples mixes tbh)

Multiple takes are just practise, planned tracklistings - nothing necessarily wrong with that.

Strangely enough though, despite the opportunities available for studio/internet mixes to be technically perfect, I still hear tons of mixes that are technically awful.

Quality control is the key.

yeah, not against planned and practiced mixes I like mixes that have been planned and thought out, but just saying that they aren't necessary a good yardstick on a dj's proficiency in a live environment,
 

vimothy

yurp
I downloaded Ableton a few months ago. I realise this is a slightly luddite question, but how the fuck do you actually dj with it? Am I missing some hardware? Is there a good site that explains all this?

THEY ARE RIGID AND STIFF AND STERILE AND INHUMAN AND THEY HAVE NO SOUL

Listen to "Black Vase" by Prurient. Also, 12 string guitars, can anyone honestly be arsed tuning those fuckers?
 
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