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viktorvaughn
22-07-2009, 06:54 PM
Couldn't see any other threads so though some general stuff on politics / culture etc would be interesting.

Recently read this wonderful book by Misha Glenny.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Fall-Yugoslavia-Third-Balkan-War/dp/014026101X/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1248285060&sr=1-2

The manipulation and goading of the peasants into ethnic violence by Milosovic et al is heart breaking. Playing on generation old prejudice and the atrocities of WWII.

This is also good on Sarajevo.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Love-Thy-Neighbor-Story-War/dp/0333669835

Any more books? I'm off to that part of the world in a few weeks so if anyone has tips for Serbia and Montenegro please share!

hucks
22-07-2009, 07:26 PM
I read that Glennie book a while ago and found it pretty heartbreaking, too. The edition I read was written maybe 93/94, so before the real horrors of eg Srebrenica had been established. Also, the epilogue was all about how Macedonia was next, total powderkeg, and he made no mention of Kosovo as a possible flashpoint. Not a criticism (at all!) but interesting to note that even someone as clued up and close to the ground as Glennie didn't know how it was going to pan out, so that whole "oh it was inevtiable, they hated each other for centuries" guff was just that.

Other books - this one (http://www.amazon.co.uk/This-Serbia-Calling-Underground-Resistance/dp/1852426829)on a Serbian pirate radio station. Can't think of many others.

A mate of mine worked for aid agencies in the Balkans. I went to see him in Sarajevo which is an utterly beautiful place, and had 4 UN vehicles to every 1 other type when I visited , even in 2002. And I went to see him in Belgrade, too, which I wasn't so hot on but I'd timed it wrong and everything was shut for summer holidays or something

mistersloane
22-07-2009, 08:03 PM
Other books - this one (http://www.amazon.co.uk/This-Serbia-Calling-Underground-Resistance/dp/1852426829)on a Serbian pirate radio station. Can' think of many others.


Matthew Collin wrote another one called 'Time Of The Rebels' which is excellent as well.

craner
22-07-2009, 11:54 PM
This is total flame war material. HMLT to thread!

viktorvaughn
23-07-2009, 01:40 PM
I read that Glennie book a while ago and found it pretty heartbreaking, too. The edition I read was written maybe 93/94, so before the real horrors of eg Srebrenica had been established. Also, the epilogue was all about how Macedonia was next, total powderkeg, and he made no mention of Kosovo as a possible flashpoint. Not a criticism (at all!) but interesting to note that even someone as clued up and close to the ground as Glennie didn't know how it was going to pan out, so that whole "oh it was inevtiable, they hated each other for centuries" guff was just that.

A mate of mine worked for aid agencies in the Balkans. I went to see him in Sarajevo which is an utterly beautiful place, and had 4 UN vehicles to every 1 other type when I visited , even in 2002. And I went to see him in Belgrade, too, which I wasn't so hot on but I'd timed it wrong and everything was shut for summer holidays or something

Yep I too thought it was very interesting how keen he was on the idea of Macedonia being a huge powder-key. He does acknowledge the problems of Kosovo a few times though as far as I remember?

The book brought home to me that though there are 2 or 3 guys (some) people have heard of (Milsovic, Radko Mladic and Radovan Karadic) there are probably another few 100 out there who have been responsible for equally appalling acts just perhaps on a slightly smaller scale. The vast majority must have escaped prosecution I guess.

Good to see this chap get locked up.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jul/20/milan-lukic-life-sentence

Sarajevo is one of the most wonderful cities anywhere - I've been to the annual film festival there five or so times and It has changed since I first went there 7 years ago quite a bit. Visible UN presence, tons of buildings still ripped apart bu shells and shrapnel, loads of walls with great trials of machine gun fire up them. It seems a more patched up and more cosmopolitan now. My mum was telling me that there has been Saudi money coming in to beef up the mosques and try and radicalise the muslims there a bti unfortunately, don't know how true that all is. They are ethnically indistinguishable from the other people there.

Thinking of trying to read Black Lamb and Grey Falcon when I'm there this year. Looks like a bit of a classic but 1000 pages!
http://www.amazon.com/Black-Lamb-Grey-Falcon-Twentieth-Century/dp/0140188479

craner
23-07-2009, 02:46 PM
Black Lamb and Grey Falcon is a wonderful book, a masterpiece in fact.

viktorvaughn
23-07-2009, 02:58 PM
Black Lamb and Grey Falcon is a wonderful book, a masterpiece in fact.

Good. How quick is it to read once you get into it? I'll have about 16 days abroad so should be OK and would be great to read when actually in the region.

craner
23-07-2009, 03:36 PM
Considering the size of the fucker, very quick, because the writing is so vivid.

craner
23-07-2009, 03:39 PM
I should imagine 16 days will be enough time, as long as you read nothing else.

viktorvaughn
23-07-2009, 10:59 PM
I should imagine 16 days will be enough time, as long as you read nothing else.

Right, I'm gonna do it.

viktorvaughn
31-08-2009, 12:37 PM
I should imagine 16 days will be enough time, as long as you read nothing else.

Got back and I'm only up to page 250! Oh well... Pretty hilarious at times and v interesting, tho i find some of the stuff on old archetecture pretty boring.

PS Montenegro is amazing! The scenery there is nuts, the Balkans are so interesting, need to read more.

scottdisco
11-10-2009, 04:55 PM
'Bosnia: Weighing the Options' (http://greatersurbiton.wordpress.com/2009/10/11/bosnia-weighing-the-options/)

craner
11-10-2009, 07:25 PM
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/oct/11/russia-ukraine-control-election

Ukraine, being raped by the Bear. And sadly, my girl is party to it. My heart is as heavy as it ever was.

scottdisco
26-10-2009, 08:43 AM
from the BBC


Former Bosnian Serb leader Radovan Karadzic has failed to appear at his trial on 11 charges including genocide, war crimes and crimes against humanity.
Mr Karadzic denies the charges, which relate to the Bosnian war of the 1990s.
The judge adjourned the court for one day, with the prosecution opening statement due on Tuesday.
He requested Mr Karadzic, who had warned that he needed more time to prepare his own defence, to attend so that proceedings would not be delayed.
Mr Karadzic, 64, was taken to the International Criminal Tribunal for the former Yugoslavia (ICTY) in The Hague last year, after 13 years in hiding.
The start date has already been put back twice, and his threat not to attend came after a request for a further 10-month delay was rejected.
:mad: