dj + "real" instruments

always a pleasure to watch competent musicians (i like your players) and was glad to hear mr souleyman amongst lots of tracks i didn't know and should hear more of.

good to see people vibing, gets my thumbs up.

Percussion kinda works ok in this style of bumpy house context but the muted trumpet over the top slows down the momentum for me which is ok for eg here . . .

There probably better egs but that the first one to come to mind.

Maybe open it up and let it blow some.

Out of interest what time was this set ?

Off-topic, but are you the same Zhao who used to post on the Designers Republic forum?

As for DJing with 'real instruments', my general inclination is that I don't like a conflation of music playback with music performance.

Then again, most electronic [ableton] live shows are essentially playback. Playing stuff off a sampler is playback, etc. etc.

There's a bit about this idea in Haunted Weather but I can't quite muster the energy to go pick it up and check which page.

Larry Levan used to do it so you're in good company. It's essentially what we do in Patricide - create mixes of our own beats though, and then play over them, which was something that evolved from me and Chaotropic and others on Horse Hospital Radio, though that was using other people's beats.

I find it very freeing, it gives rise to improvisation in a way that improvisation doesn't do.

zhao said:

thanks nochexx! yeah those guys are great musicians. i feel a bit of a fraud in their presence TBH.



interesting about slowing down momentum... i actually want to explore that more, the tension between fast beats and very slow reed arcs...

oh yes the kondo / krush combo... for sure one of the most successful projects in this vein.. never encrountered the word "example" abbreviated as "egs" before.

i've got that Derek Bailey meets Jungle recording somewhere... need to dig it out, don't remember what it sounds like at all...



do you mean let the tracks breath? giving the reed more space to fly? for sure. this video is a condensed edit of a 2.5 hour performance... there was plenty of free form improvisation in the actual set.

time was 1 - 2:30 PM. most people were just waking up i think. and due to the time and the mood, Congo played pretty straight, and sunny (maybe a bit overcast), and did not get into his crazy effects boxes too much... we need to record an evil-dead night time set soon

Click to expand...

I was thinking about playing the trumpet without the mute and giving it some. But having found out it was an early set while people where waking I guess you made the right call.

Effect-box-nighttime set would be good to hear where you can let it rip so to speak.

As I think about this, I've realized that I make a distinction between a DJ set with additional live instrumentation and a live performance that includes a DJ. And I'm generally more positive about the latter, I think...

Will have a look at the video when I'm at home.

I once saw the Martinez Brothers perform with a bongo player who singlehandedly ruined the whole show. I don't even think he realized that he was supporting the Martinez Brothers. He was just in a big room, with some music, playing the bongos.

It's good to see forum members playing music.
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value=""></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Looks like fun - nice and loose and jammy. That kind of thing works really well at the right time/setting. Lots of fun to wiggle around with and I enjoy the contrast between jammy stuff during the day and precision set mix/structure during the night.

The thing for me with Kondo and Krush was how well the beats suited the timbre of the trumpet. Krush doing his kinda tonal texture atmos thing I guess.

I think it works well, especially at that time of day and for a festival. Most of the times i've seen 'djing' with instruments (as opposed to a scratch style DJ with a band) has normally been a one man thing.I did see some balkan DJ set with two brass players doing balkan licks (Mahala Rai Banda tunes) etc at a festival but that was pretty tragic really.

Bass Clef does it really well with a trombone, thermin cowbell CDJs and sampling did a wicked set a couple of years ago I saw in Bristol. Ed cox did his whole accordian "clowncore" thing which got old really quickly and aswell the fact everytime he seems to play now hes too off his face on K to even hold the thing the right way up. And theres people like Squarepusher on bass and AFX did a tour with his own orchestra for sit down venues which was pretty mind blowing.

I think it can add alot of value to a performance defintiley if its done right and not just for the sake of it, I would of thought the main reason you dont see it so much is because of lack of space and good PA in clubs.

Solution Sound plus The Crispy Horns = magic

generic house/techno dj + shit bongo player = tragic

zhao said:

is that you on the wheels of steel then?

Click to expand...

Yes. I like the video you posted Zhao. The eclectic electronic beats and sounds you play on the laptop sound good with the percussionists.

Ye should check out the Disconauts.

The've been doing a four deck, sax and live percussion thing for years.
Their very good.

Most of the clips on youtube are shit quality unfortunately.

mistersloane said:

Larry Levan used to do it so you're in good company. It's essentially what we do in Patricide - create mixes of our own beats though, and then play over them, which was something that evolved from me and Chaotropic and others on Horse Hospital Radio, though that was using other people's beats.

I find it very freeing, it gives rise to improvisation in a way that improvisation doesn't do.

Click to expand...

Briefly ,
One: great for getting out and trying it Zhao.
Think you guys sound pretty fine, and really seemed to serve the crowd that was there to catch something to listen to -or to get dance on to -
hey gig that early is not such an easy mode.
Playing music that early at all is not an easy mode imo ...

Re: Kondo and Krush .Well, there are two vets, and isn't it a studio recording ?
sorry if mistaken.
Fyi Zhao you can guess what Haitian cybervoudou unit caught T Kondo's interest when it first appeared in '89 /'90 Tokyo FM ?

Tempos. Yeah, play with them and mix it up a bit (tho' you prolly did , just didn't hear so much in the clip ) and mixing speeds of what's on the deck and what players are doing could be interesting experiments to explore ... players prolly want a constant tempo ,understandable.

Playing bts and live instruments.
Sometimes it's great.
Like what Mr. Sloane said about his group -playing on someone's elses bt's one thing, playing on top of your own bts can get into another mode.
Playing bts to your first bt, another player making a bt and you following it, etc.
In Death Comet Crew we were - and still are blessed with have our Dj High Priest,
who became our 'drummer' once we heard him cutting and scratching.
WIth two drummers in group, things open up even more ...

Also - got to hear the night live evil style ,
then we speak more !