padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
France's defense is way tighter tho. Belgium had a real lack of good opportunities. This expected goals chart was basically what I expected after watching the game.
World Cup 2018
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padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
France is almost definitely better than England (or Croatia) but it's close enough that combined with the very high variance of soccer, an upset wouldn't be that surprising
Could see England nabbing a goal or two on set-pieces and then hanging on
Gotta be honest tho kinda rooting for France to crush the lads, 100 Years War style
Joan of Arc subs on at halftime and history repeats itself as she wins it on a true Hand of God goal
if it's Croatia I'm definitely rooting for Croatia over France because how could you not
Could see England nabbing a goal or two on set-pieces and then hanging on
Gotta be honest tho kinda rooting for France to crush the lads, 100 Years War style
Joan of Arc subs on at halftime and history repeats itself as she wins it on a true Hand of God goal
if it's Croatia I'm definitely rooting for Croatia over France because how could you not
baboon2004
Darned cockwombles.
let's not get carried away with jingoism, they'll probably get a consolation goal. 7-1.
baboon2004
Darned cockwombles.
reason 1 : compare the flag of the Ustashe https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ustashe to the Croatian football shirt.
baboon2004
Darned cockwombles.
That's fine, we root for anyone who plays America at any sport/military conflict.
padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
no worries bro, I definitely would too if I wasn't a yanqui. I wouldn't underestimate British global unpopularity tho. you guys are our only rivals in the gross tourist stereotype
also, red/white chequy has been the Croatian coat of arms for over 500 years, and it's on their current national flag, so I'll need a better reason not to root for Croatia
(I don't don't there are Croatian ultras or whatever with unsavory views and/or some modern far right party namechecking the Ustase but what Euro country doesn't have that?)
baboon2004
Darned cockwombles.
Very, very true - I try to emphasise my Celtic roots when abroad. Except in Mexico where I had to be adamant that I was English but not American, because no-one had heard of Wales.
Yeah the chequerboard has a long history, but it is v weird that the Croatian flag has not been changed to symbolise progression from arguably the most appalling period in the country's history, no?
Don't like to link to the Telegraph but: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-c...world-cup-cover-up-fifa-admit-secret-let-off/
Related, those Albanian eagle celebrations from Shaqiri and Xhaka in Switzerland vs Serbia have been the most iconic image of the whole WC for me.
Yeah the chequerboard has a long history, but it is v weird that the Croatian flag has not been changed to symbolise progression from arguably the most appalling period in the country's history, no?
Don't like to link to the Telegraph but: https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-c...world-cup-cover-up-fifa-admit-secret-let-off/
Related, those Albanian eagle celebrations from Shaqiri and Xhaka in Switzerland vs Serbia have been the most iconic image of the whole WC for me.
baboon2004
Darned cockwombles.
this is no time for facts or reason.
Corpsey
bandz ahoy
The only time I feel remotely 'patriotic' is when some johnny foreigner has a pop at us. Then I seem to hear Elgar's 'Nimrod' soaring, in tandem with my righteous fury and the brick I've hurled towards their patisserie window.
Actually I've been thinking about this over the last few weeks because you've got genuine patriotism from football fans and then you've got extremely qualified ironic patriotism from fairweather football fans like me who can't shout 'Come on England!' without injecting a dose of self-sneering into it.towards
Actually I've been thinking about this over the last few weeks because you've got genuine patriotism from football fans and then you've got extremely qualified ironic patriotism from fairweather football fans like me who can't shout 'Come on England!' without injecting a dose of self-sneering into it.towards
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baboon2004
Darned cockwombles.
I get annoyed when French people criticise London. Brings forth all kinds of rather awkward extreme civicism.
Patriotism is incoherent temporary community anyways. Always exclusionary too.
Patriotism is incoherent temporary community anyways. Always exclusionary too.
Corpsey
bandz ahoy
It's interesting, isn't it - a tribalistic instinct that I, at least, can't suppress, only attempt to reason with.
It's a window into the mindset of ultra nationalists, in that they presumably feel that their tribe is under constant and extreme threat (from e.g. immigrants, foreigners, muslims, etc.).
I was going to observe that the England team doesn't on the face of it represent that very white, monocultural nationalism, at least. They're all young, multiracial, do dances from 'Fortnite', etc.
For people like me, supporting England has to be ironised because we're so aware of how horrible England fans have been over the years, hurling chairs and pissing on monuments, etc.
It's a window into the mindset of ultra nationalists, in that they presumably feel that their tribe is under constant and extreme threat (from e.g. immigrants, foreigners, muslims, etc.).
I was going to observe that the England team doesn't on the face of it represent that very white, monocultural nationalism, at least. They're all young, multiracial, do dances from 'Fortnite', etc.
For people like me, supporting England has to be ironised because we're so aware of how horrible England fans have been over the years, hurling chairs and pissing on monuments, etc.
baboon2004
Darned cockwombles.
I have felt unreasonably emotional during the recent England run, but I think that's because of the confusion of one's own personal history with the national trajectory, simplified and utterly misrepresented through sport (whereas England's real trajectory is obviously towards total disaster). Memories of 1990 and being a kid, sporting-emotional bonds forged between fathers and sons, the sense that even temporary community is better than none....instantly disabused when confronted with the ugly reality of patriotism. I think it's worse when it's the US, UK or Germany - the preening and strutting of nations that have been the world's top dog but are no more, is somehow worse than the patriotism of the Frances and Spains. I felt physically repulsed by German triumphalism after the 2014 World Cup final, in a way I hadn't expected.
Multiculturalism of English team - means something important symbolically, but unfortunately look at france's trajectory after the symbolic 1998 multicultural triumph.
Multiculturalism of English team - means something important symbolically, but unfortunately look at france's trajectory after the symbolic 1998 multicultural triumph.
baboon2004
Darned cockwombles.
Since England's only won anything at all about three times and Brexit has changed the rules, I'm not sure. For example, very easy for people to overrate Kane and underrate Sterling, which happened in the QF again. People will twist the narrative however they want.
padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
oh yeah that's not great. can't say I'm surprised, given the long sordid history of Eastern European ultras, especially in the Balkans (Arkan's Tigers, for one).
thought the Albanian eagle thing was a response to Serbian fans chanting abuse and wearing Ratko Mladic (yup) shirts.
WC is kinda fascinating as this huge touchstone for nationalism with so many highly diverse European teams, so many children + grandchildren of immigrants.
anyway you've convinced me Croatia isn't a great look - their fans seem pretty terrible, even by soccer standards - but I'm still gonna take France to crush the lads
padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
btw I never admit to being American when I'm in Mexico if I can help it, unless I'm with friends.
speaking good Spanish helps. if you're very white (as I am) people often assume you're Argentinean or Spanish even if you don't really have the accent.
also, once many years ago I was hitching from the south to DF with an Australian guy and literally the first word out of every person's mouth was "kangaroo".
actually come to think of it that was during the 2002 World Cup. the U.S. beat Mexico 2-0 in the 1st knockout round. Definitely not the time to tell people you're American.
speaking good Spanish helps. if you're very white (as I am) people often assume you're Argentinean or Spanish even if you don't really have the accent.
also, once many years ago I was hitching from the south to DF with an Australian guy and literally the first word out of every person's mouth was "kangaroo".
actually come to think of it that was during the 2002 World Cup. the U.S. beat Mexico 2-0 in the 1st knockout round. Definitely not the time to tell people you're American.
padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
I've read that the Mexican national team is possibly more popular in the U.S than our own team, which I have no trouble believing
we've mostly gotten past the point where Americans make fun of soccer but it definitely still comes after the big 4, and college sports
we've mostly gotten past the point where Americans make fun of soccer but it definitely still comes after the big 4, and college sports