Reunite Psychedelia and The Avant-Garde.

[padraig (u.s.)]

pursuing the societal change angle and continuing on earlier from when I was talking about the fundamental contradictions of modern industrialized society

(granted this risks sinking into a "politics culture economy technology" morass but let's just be cognizant)

taking the avant-garde - meaning the tradition, not just literal avant-garde art - as an attempt to grapple with those contradictions

and the psychedelic tradition as a human technique - for a long time, the main/only technique (shamanism, oracles, mysteries) - for resolving the tension of unknowable

to what extent have current conditions, on the one hand made those implicit contradictions (broadly - nothing really matters) explicit, and on the other hand eradicated the drive to pursue the unknowable?

the latter especially seems how you can arrive at a "psychedelia" made purely of empty signifiers

I only lightly familiar with accelerationism but it feels relevant here, especially as far as making contradictions overt

 

[luka]

good questions. im baking a potato but i will think about answers.

 

[thirdform]

just want to add that marx would be monocausal if his theory was a theory of economics, absolutely.

But Marxism is a theory of the production and reproduction of immediate life. and that implicitly contains and immenent critique of all economy and all time standardisation.

 

[thirdform]

the class struggle in political economy wasn't marx's invention after all, not at all. the class struggle is a very useful concept for the exploiting historical class in industrial society. because how is it able to resolve its crises of on one hand labour productivity and intensity rocketing, but on the other hand, a rise of machines, tools and dead labour (expressed in accumulation of commodities) relative to human labour power which engenders tendencial falls in the rate of business profit?

like, usually in leftism the contradiction is expressed as capitalism makes a few people rich and loads of us poor. That's no fucking contradiction at all! The real contradiction is between our historically accumulated potentialities and our alienation from our productive capabilities.

 

[thirdform]

I think Terence Mckenna was a CIA agent tbh.

 

[thirdform]

first three chapters of capital are pretty gothic tbh. german ideology, 18th b, all have great literary flourishes.

the problem is most english people are incapable of the sensuous and hence literature in their world is restricted to book collectors. luka is of course an exception. this is why most english marxists are humourless. no wonder hitler admired british empire in contradiction to lewd german proletarian women and decadent weimar homosexuals. england will still have to pay for its crimes.

 

[sadmanbarty]

i like Migos but i don't think they encode and transmit a peak DMT experience for instance.
.

promise, promise, promise this'll be my last post on this thread about migos.

luke i know you don't get strong visuals on drugs, so that may be why there's the divergence here. on dmt i get these- not quite grids, they're loser than that- but they're interlocking geometric things. to simplify them they're a bit like cogs but of course they'd be constructed from richer visual stimuli than that. they're also not just pretty pictures; they're manifestations of, as you said, the world being a system. of everything integrating and informing the other. a turn in one 'cog' shifting the whole machinery. i'm simplifying it, making it sound rather naff and blase, cos it's so hard to explain (hence why we need art).

anyway, that's how migos sound to me.

now that me, and a couple of others on here, have got our little bits of nonsense out the way, we can get on with this thread properly.

 

[sadmanbarty]

first things first, best map the psychedelic experience. dmt's the most concentrated and the most useful in this context.

 

[thirdform]

dunno about dmt.

 

[luka]

promise, promise, promise this'll be my last post on this thread about migos.

luke i know you don't get strong visuals on drugs, so that may be why there's the divergence here. on dmt i get these- not quite grids, they're loser than that- but they're interlocking geometric things. to simplify them they're a bit like cogs but of course they'd be constructed from richer visual stimuli than that. they're also not just pretty pictures; they're manifestations of, as you said, the world being a system. of everything integrating and informing the other. a turn in one 'cog' shifting the whole machinery. i'm simplifying it, making it sound rather naff and blase, cos it's so hard to explain (hence why we need art).

anyway, that's how migos sound to me.

now that me, and a couple of others on here, have got our little bits of nonsense out the way, we can get on with this thread properly.

at last! i know exactly what you mean and i can hear that in migos now without even needing to put the record on. i got a very vertiginous contact high from your explanation alone.

 

[thirdform]

because i get heavy tactile synaesthesia being being plunged straight into the peak of an acid trip (as one user described it) could mean i start exalting stuff like this. and there be the all consuming beast. it's worse than the melodic death metal show that just aired on Netil radio. london is dead. we must leave.

 

[thirdform]

would like to try snowballs tho.

 

[thirdform]

dmt just seems so fast. not in the fast rushing sense of speed+mdma combo, in the sense that you can't inhabit the world.

 

[luka]

it can be like that. the information there is transmitted in an impossibly condensed form. a super-language of synesthesia that allows a huge amount to be communicated in a very short space of time. often that means you don't take it all in at the point of transmission. it unpacks itself over a longer time period.

 

[thirdform]

whats the best music to listen to in the trip? do i need dirty hippy shit? or can i go full harsh noise and darkcore.

 

[thirdform]

do u feel like u are the cosmic expansion of incense vibrations because that is deeply concerning.

 

[sadmanbarty]

whats the best music to listen to in the trip? do i need dirty hippy shit? or can i go full harsh noise and darkcore.

the fundamental difference between our aesthetic sensibilities 3rdform is that my ideal transcendental bliss is floating on a cloud experiencing the visions of ezekiel while loads of mixed race girls tell me i'm brilliant, whereas yours is being brutally sodomised by robocop whilst listening to an obscure 70's darbuka compilation.

 

[luka]

the fundamental difference between our aesthetic sensibilities 3rdform is that my ideal transcendental bliss is floating on a cloud experiencing the visions of ezekiel while loads of mixed race girls tell me i'm brilliant, whereas yours is being brutally sodomised by robocop whilst listening to an obscure 70's darbuka compilation.

it's possible the twain will never meet.

 

[luka]

i dont know if there is a best music. i mostly don't listen to anything. i had great results with bernard parmigiani. i had great results with theatre of eternal music and a couple of other drone bits. the austere basically. but i dont think there's any hard and fast rules there. whatever you listen to, if you are actually conscious of it, will sound like you've just invested £50,000 in an audiophiles wet dream.

 

[thirdform]

it's possible the twain will never meet.

the dialectic demands that they do meet though. maybe sadi bahti can induct me into his imperial harem or maybe i can get him fucked at a gabba rave.

tbf i'd rather the former.