Culture As Advertising.

[luka]

I know this is going to sound like an utterly stupid question:

But...

Does anyone actually still listen to 1xtra?

Back in the day you could hear j da flex on there or whatever. now? isn't it identical to a youtube playlist?

I honestly don't know. My neighbour listens to capital xtra. I do think that these digital 'black music' stations have altered the ecology of London music in some fundamental way although I wouldn't suggest they were the only factors at work. There's a bigger picture in which they play a part.

 

[sadmanbarty]

vim's fucked off!

he's not on 'who's online'

 

[thirdform]

It is interesting to dwell on because radio was quite literally magic before internet 2.0.

 

[luka]

vim's fucked off!

he's not on 'who's online'

It's cos you pointed out that he was out of his depth and he would have to pick his game up if he wanted to play with the big boys. I think he could learn. I have faith in him. In fact I think I quoted him early on in the thread. He just needs to get up to speed. Update his software.

 

[sadmanbarty]

like accelerationism, you don't need to fully buy into baudrillard/hyperreality to get something out of these ideas, they're clearly looming in the background of this discussion

as far as i can tell this thread is entirely about failed attempts at hyperreality. it's about how cringe-inducing it is when you see it unsuccessfully attempted.

 

[thirdform]

Does anyone notice with the UK afroswing stuff that it doesn't really illicit any emotional reaction, positive or negative? Like, it's nice and all, I can write to it, i can even have it on whilst im reading a book, but I never feel an urge to buy or download it and save it offline.

I like repeat listening. i like to get lost in a groove for days.

 

[vimothy]

soz back again - got all nervous and had to nip outside for quick pep talk with myself

 

[thirdform]

soz back again - got all nervous and had to nip outside for quick pep talk with myself

one spliff a day...

 

[sadmanbarty]

Does anyone notice with the UK afroswing stuff that it doesn't really illicit any emotional reaction, positive or negative? Like, it's nice and all, I can write to it, i can even have it on whilst im reading a book, but I never feel an urge to buy or download it and save it offline.

in my experience afrobeats has always been a meta, self-aware phenomenon in the uk. it was always about asserting yourself in relation to the jamaican kids. it's not a real culture, at least in the uk. suppose that's the same as uk hip hop or uk dancehall. it's pastiche.

 

[vimothy]

another angle which is worth considering relates to the influence of search, recommendation engines and AI on culture

 

[thirdform]

in my experience afrobeats has always been a meta, self-aware phenomenon in the uk. it was always about asserting yourself in relation to the jamaican kids. it's not a real culture, at least in the uk. suppose that's the same as uk hip hop or uk dancehall. it's pastiche.

Yeah that is most probably the case but we've discussed this in the past.

 

[luka]

soz back again - got all nervous and had to nip outside for quick pep talk with myself

So long as you know that we support you. We are demanding but only in service of getting the best from you.

 

[sadmanbarty]

vim you've bought up 2 topics; hyperreality and algorhythms.

they're great topics. what would be good is if you have a stab at them. remember this is just the four of us fucking around on an obscure forum at midnight, so what you say doesn't have to empirically verifiable or provable at all. just a gut feeling or a throwaway idea.

 

[vimothy]

which would be an extension of the current trajectory - an extension already built and effective (to a degree), but becoming ever more significant. it's not just that culture is coopted and then abstracted into this zone of advertising-hyperreality, in the future those initial steps might no longer be necessary.

 

[thirdform]

That's like saying capitalism is capable of unlimited growth and will be able to reabsorb labour relative to the level it expells for ever and ever. a comforting thought especially as the alternative is total collapse, but i don't buy it.

 

[sadmanbarty]

which would be an extension of the current trajectory - an extension already built and effective (to a degree), but becoming ever more significant. it's not just that culture is coopted and then abstracted into this zone of advertising-hyperreality, in the future those initial steps might no longer be necessary.

this rather neatly fits into carly rae jepsen.

employing all these 80's signifiers that have been so pastiched already that they no longer conjure or evoke the 80's anymore. gated snares where a conscious harking back 10 years ago. now they're just there. neither relevant nor nostalgic.

 

[vimothy]

I don't know if you saw this article from a couple of years back that was being passed around worried parents on FB:
It describes this weird corner of youtube where ppl are automatically generating kids tv shows in order to take advantage of YT recommendation engine algorithms. many of the videos are impressively nightmarish and alien. they are cultural products and artefacts that lack intentionality, which is truly an uncanny valley imo

 

[luka]

which would be an extension of the current trajectory - an extension already built and effective (to a degree), but becoming ever more significant. it's not just that culture is coopted and then abstracted into this zone of advertising-hyperreality, in the future those initial steps might no longer be necessary.

In the sense of the raw material, the stripmined subculture will no longer be necessary? necessary to whom/what? Capital?

 

[sadmanbarty]

which would be an extension of the current trajectory - an extension already built and effective (to a degree), but becoming ever more significant. it's not just that culture is coopted and then abstracted into this zone of advertising-hyperreality, in the future those initial steps might no longer be necessary.

it also relates to the non-realness of music you were referring to earlier.

we tend to think of music as metaphor and synesthesia; the music is symbolic of a something external to it. you hear a song and it sounds like the colour blue or it reminds you of meeting your wife, etc.

but actually there are whole swathes of music that evoke (in me at least) only themselves. make me feel emotions that solely pertain to that piece of music. that i have never nor will ever encounter outside of it.

 

[luka]

I don't know if you saw this article from a couple of years back that was being passed around worried parents on FB:
It describes this weird corner of youtube where ppl are automatically generating kids tv shows in order to take advantage of YT recommendation engine algorithms. many of the videos are impressively nightmarish and alien. they are cultural products and artefacts that lack intentionality, which is truly an uncanny valley imo

Yes, this was preceded by a vigilant citizen article I read. They set the agenda. You can't think about the entertainment industry without reading vc.