Culture As Advertising.

[vimothy]

yes, in that raw material will no longer be necessary in order to generate "content" (i.e., cultural product / currency)

 

[vimothy]

r scott bakker's semantic apocalyse - culture without meaning

 

[luka]

yes, in that raw material will no longer be necessary in order to generate "content" (i.e., cultural product / currency)

You mean, not even artists will be necessary? Just code? Algorithm?

 

[vimothy]

which is kind of implicit in accelerationism and deleuzian vitalism if you think about it, its all just flows crashing together randomly and coalescing into various equilibria,even culture, even art

 

[thirdform]

Someone's still going to have to write the code though. it can't be totally automated. the marxist question once again haunts the Deleuzians. who automates the automators?

 

[thirdform]

even in the most utopic of utopias there will be no full automation.

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

Excellent thread

Will do my best to marshal energy for remarks when I got home later

 

[luka]

which is kind of implicit in accelerationism and deleuzian vitalism if you think about it, its all just flows crashing together randomly and coalescing into various equilibria,even culture, even art

Sort of I guess. I mean, in one sense it's implicit to any thoroughgoing materialism in which consciousness is just a sort of illusion. But surely then whether it's algorithm or not is immaterial? You've already done away with any creator. It's just impersonal physical process.

 

[luka]

Excellent thread

Will do my best to marshal energy for remarks when I got home later

Buy a laptop!

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

I got shot down by Padraig who said culture has never been anything but advertising and the underground has never existed

I did say that but my position was more complicated, nuanced and/or ambiguous than those bare facts

Anyone interested go reread the relevant pages (3-5 I think) in New Stuff

I'll elaborate later, but for now the key statement there is there is no art which is not also a commodity, regardless of the degree to which it is (actually or potentially) commodified

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

Buy a laptop!

I have a laptop my dude

Can't use it @ work

 

[luka]

Ok fair enough. Just remember you saying you could only use dissensus on your phone. Which is virtually impossible. I've tried.

 

[luka]

I did say that but my position was more complicated, nuanced and/or ambiguous than those bare facts

Anyone interested go reread the relevant pages (3-5 I think) in New Stuff

I'll elaborate later, but for now the key statement there is there is no art which is not also a commodity, regardless of the degree to which it is (actually or potentially) commodified

Where I get antsy is where this is taken too far and we lose the ability to make distinctions which we all easily, habitually, without hesitation, make in real life. We rob ourselves of the power of discrimination.of drawing lines.

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

A few years ago I ran across the idea, in relation to anthropology, that culture is synonymous with power. Which seems simple and possibly obvious but is anything but.

What does a conqueror/colonizer immediately seek to eradicate, in every facet? The indigenous culture.

What is culture? Advertisement for a culture. Its myths, a people's idea of itself.

Admittedly I've never/don't know if i could work out how thus applies to post-Internet humanity, esp w algorithms, intentionless content, etc.

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

Where I get antsy is where this is taken too far and we lose the ability to make distinctions which we all easily, habitually, without hesitation, make in real life. We rob ourselves of the power of discrimination.of drawing lines.

Everything IRL is applied theorizing, for sure

But, that underlying fact remains

 

[padraig (u.s.)]

One could look @ algorithmic playlists as advertisements for a post-human culture

 

[vimothy]

the marxist question once again haunts the Deleuzians. who automates the automators?

I don't think it does haunt the deleuzians, actually. its automation all the way down as far as they're concerned

 

[thirdform]

I don't think it does haunt the deleuzians, actually. its automation all the way down as far as they're concerned

I know that. I was being figurative, not literal. there's a reason why I got out of academia when i could. full automation is like Daniel Bell on acid. it's basically like Asimov retooled for the 2010s. total fucking waste of time.

 

[vimothy]

Sort of I guess. I mean, in one sense it's implicit to any thoroughgoing materialism in which consciousness is just a sort of illusion. But surely then whether it's algorithm or not is immaterial? You've already done away with any creator. It's just impersonal physical process.

from an uber materialist perspective, I don't think it does hugely matter, at least in some sense - it's just a different way of organising impersonal flows of energy. but this perspective is limited and I think for most people it matters quite a lot if culture has meaning or if capitalism is on a trajectory that eliminates that

 

[thirdform]

Oh it matters to your mates. It doesn't matter to me. It never has. We create the meanings when we reclaim it. if we don't (which i can't stress enough is the most most likely option) then noone gives a fuck.