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Thread: Retromania

  1. #16
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    Fucking hell - you're supposed to be setting an example to the kids you teach! Getting thrown out of clubs for taking gack, shoplifting - what's next, mugging old ladies?

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by IdleRich View Post
    Fucking hell - you're supposed to be setting an example to the kids you teach! Getting thrown out of clubs for taking gack, shoplifting - what's next, mugging old ladies?
    I'd like the record to show I never mug old ladies unless really desperate.

  3. #18
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  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by DannyL View Post
    I was possessed by the urge to shoplift a copy of Wire today in Smiths so I could read this. I failed though, because I am old.
    I've finished with my copy of that issue now. So I could send it to you...

    Or I dunno, burn it or something.

  5. #20
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    From what I can gather, the term exists in large part because it's a pun ("'auntology" = ontology) in French. Kind of how the term "metrosexual" exists because "metro" rhymes with "het(e)ro".

    Quote Originally Posted by IdleRich View Post
    I thought hauntology was more to do with imagined, alternative, might have been pasts and the futures (or possibly present) which didn't grow from that but could have done. Ghost pasts and presents basically.
    Although that's not quite what it says here

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hauntology

    Maybe what I'm describing has more to do with retrofuturism and parallel worlds. But I imagine hauntology as a kind of retrofuturist other world that somehow overlaps and bleeds into ours like a ghost.
    I like that last sentence.

    The thing about the mania for the revival of old styles is that it's been going on forever - imperial Rome's emulation of the art and architecture of classical Greece hundreds of years earlier, the Renaissance taking cues from the Classical civilisations, then neo-Classical architecture in the 18th century, neo-Gothic in the 19th...though I guess with today's pop music the difference is the sheer range of styles and periods that are being recycled or pastiched, be it trad folk, '60s pop-rock, post-punk, synthpop, trad metal, rave or big-band jazz.

    A few years ago I was at the Bethnal Green Working Men's Club and there were people there, most of them younger than me, dressed in the costumes of just about every decade of the last century from the '20s to the '80s.
    Last edited by Mr. Tea; 21-06-2011 at 07:26 PM.
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  6. #21
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    "though I guess with today's pop music the difference is the sheer range of styles and periods that are being recycled or pastiched, be it trad folk, '60s pop-rock, post-punk, synthpop, trad metal, rave or big-band jazz."
    Isn't that just because culture happens faster now though? There were probably more styles and fashions in the 20th century than there were in the previous five hundred years. More things happened so more things to recycle.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Tea View Post

    The thing about the mania for the revival of old styles is that it's been going on forever - the Roman's emulation of the art and architecture of classical Greece hundreds of years earlier, the Renaissance taking cues from the Classical civilisations, then neo-Classical architecture in the 18th century, neo-Gothic in the 19th...though I guess with today's pop music the difference is the sheer range of styles and periods that are being recycled or pastiched, be it trad folk, '60s pop-rock, post-punk, synthpop, trad metal, rave or big-band jazz.
    In the book Reynolds makes the distinction between these older revivals and 'retro', in arguing that todays revivals are increasingly drawing on the very recent past and often have an ironic edge to them. Whats more the retro revivals are becoming more like the fashion industry in that the reasons and motives behind them are becoming increasingly arbitrary...like, 'whats this season's look?'. So its really a very different thing than Classical Greece coming back or whatever.

    Anyway, its another great book. Certainly pretty pessimistic but I found very little to disagree with in it. The book has a very wide scope and the evidence and analysis he's put together is quite overwhelming. We have some fucking serious issues nowadays.

    Anyone else finished this yet?

  8. #23
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    Yeah, I guess the revival of recent decades that are within living memory for a lot of people - e.g. 20-year-olds in Ramones T-shirts obviously don't remember the '70s, but their parents do - is a bit different from reviving styles from centuries ago. And there's the whole 'irony' thing, but I find that's such a widely used and abused concept these days it's rapidly losing any real meaning.
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  9. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Tea View Post
    such a widely used and abused concept these days it's rapidly losing any real meaning.
    *sigh*

    like everything else in this godforsaken world

  10. #25
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    Haha, touche...but I think it's true, I mean irony is quite a specific and subtle concept but people use it lazily these days more or less as a synonym for "insincere" or "parodic". Or, if you're Alanis Morisette, "slightly unfortunate or annoying" (ironically).
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  11. #26

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    I thought irony is like metallic?

    Anyhow - I still have not got this book, really ought to from the sounds of it. I keep banging on about acceleration at the end of history, endless red-shift, and how we will be sampling yesterday before the end of next week - hyperculture ( cyberspheres ) speeds up retrofication.....

    I was sat down with a girl the other day and she asked me "You mean there is nothing new? Do you believe you (me) can make something new?" I replied soberly - "no."

    Retro feels like a syndrome, whereby unique contexts and juxtapositions are created out of established stuff - but nothing is new, things are created through collage and post-production - think about Relational Aesthetics, massive art movement, but it was essentially life in an art context, but when picasso was sketching his art was new art, nothing imported just executed totally totally differently to anything before.

    Rick Owens the designer really interests me with regard to this theme, he makes like neo-grunge meets goth fashion - and none of it is strictly new, and grunge and goth are both pretty recent - but he's seen as one of the most innovative big designers out there.... I guess there is an acceptance that there won't be any thing new, like the womens trouser suit, that what people are looking for is a good orchestration, a nice context collage of retro materials ( anything previous, or culturally entrenched )...

  12. #27
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    "Haha, touche...but I think it's true, I mean irony is quite a specific and subtle concept but people use it lazily these days more or less as a synonym for "insincere" or "parodic". Or, if you're Alanis Morisette, "slightly unfortunate or annoying" (ironically)."
    Well, it's subtle but I don't think it's specific - irony includes dramatic irony, romantic irony, sarcasm and lots of other types as well which are all quite different. I guess the main defining quality of irony is a difference in knowledge between two (groups of) people giving a different meaning to the same events or words or information.

  13. #28
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    Half way through - thought the chapter on collecting/collectors - Ch3 was spot on. Started to wish he'd move a bit faster when he went on to discuss Northern Soul but generally very persuasive piece and I am finding very little to disagree with - every time I think he could bring X in here, they turn up next page. Maybe it's from twenty plus years of reading his stuff? Also I think he has fine tuned his style somewhat and now it's a little less frenzied, a little less lapel grabbing.

  14. #29
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    So far so good as far as chapters on YouTube, file-sharing etc go - the irony: many of us use Now technology to explore Then - but retromania's really just another word for the kind of nostalgia that's gripped generations since they grew up after the Second World War - and the technology's enabled us to become captivated by Past glories we never knew existed, aswell as revisit those we experienced. Competing against a magnificent history, it seems that modern music can't 'win' (unless you're 14 and just found Wobbly Step, of course).

  15. #30
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    about a 100 pages through this so far. the stuff about file sharing habits is pretty spot on. oddly despite the books premise it is making me quite nostalgic.

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