so what you're saying then, matt, is that you like to look at men
so what you're saying then, matt, is that you like to look at men
I think there may be something in this. This is probably why I never got into theorists - one look at pictures of Zizek, Trotsky, Foucault, Badiou etc and I can't contemplate reading a book by someone who looks so awful. Complete opposite to John Kennedy Toole though (who, funnily enough, almost looks like a proto-Jello Biafra).
I've always thought the same thing about Prince.Originally Posted by luka
OK here we go! (stifles laughter, rolls up shirt sleeves)Originally Posted by Dan I.
on the way home i got to thinking that the homophobia in dancehall is almost certainly some (stupid) attempt, or over-compensation, to handle the star's charisma in relation to their male audience.
along on the lines of "we're good-looking and charasmatic, but WE SURE AS HELL AINT GAY SO DONT EVEN THINK ABOUT IT"
notwithstanding jamaica's centrury-old social customs of course
Ian Brown was always fucking gorgeous - a big part of his appeal (aside from having my favourite singing voice ever). Adds something to the music, definitely, when the singer is attractive/unique/wonderful looking. Yeah, I really do respond well to male beauty, despite being totally hetero. No shame. What can I say? I read i-D inch-by-inch every month. I love looking at beautiful girls, and I love looking at gorgeous boys - Dior Homme/Hedi Slimane, step right up.
DMX looks like the master race or something
LL Cool J looked really good in the 80s, but his current flowerpot man hat and thin mustache look is putrid, esp in combo with all those pandering-to-the-women loverman lyrics. plus he's way too muscley now , definitely verging on that eeuggh-gross freak quality of musclebuilding mags (which i find horribly compelling, in the same way that looking at a medical textbook full of goitres and deformities is horribly compelling)
the even more sticky area is to then deal with the role of female pulchritude in music (from the male het viewpoint)
it's obviously just as important, yet doesn't always i think have to be on the 'phwooargh, i'd like to...' level
like grace slick is just witchy cool... or Siouxsie...
Trim is well fit. he has lovely smile.
see the aim high dvd for evidence.
flowdan is a shoom ting.
i definitely would.
Obviously, male looks have been a big part of my appreciation of Pop (much more so in my uh formative years than female looks, partly coz I was hardly interested in anything by women back then).... but I would want to see two things about that;
1. I have absolutely no problem with the idea that this is repressed homosexuality except that I don't think it is. It's taken as obvious that swooning for looks is 'sexual' but it doesn't strike me as self-evident. The relationship between swooning over beauty and sexual congress is actually quite obscure...why would that be the thing to do when confronting human beauty? (In fact, the appeal of Lad pin-ups like Jennifer Ellison and Abi Titmus is exactly that they are not TOO beautiful... because excessive beauty is too breathtaking to be reduced to wank fodder, too problematic , overpowering...)
2. The current dearth of radicality in Pop has surely a great deal to do with the rise of a certain model of the unadorned (as the) masculine (as the) 'real'. Hip hop fashion, still, TWENTY FUCKING YEARS ON, dominant to the point of uniform amongst teenage males is a way of saying, 'I don't really care about clothes except as economic status symbols...' (cos given that sportswear looks totally shit, the only appeal can be how much it cost). Tthis is complemented by that 'we're just wearing our ordinary clothes' conspicuous unpretentiousness of the likes of Elbow, Athlete (jeez their very NAMES bespeak a crushing quotidian depression) in the student-indie crowd. (I know this is fashion rather than 'beauty' strictly speaking).
Aw but you know SO MUCH CARE ges into into precisely what trainers and t-shirts. people like (fr'instance) d double and wiley, they're in sportswear yes, but they're immaculately groomed.Originally Posted by k-punk
but yes i do get your point as well. there IS a sense with sportswear that it appears no "choice" is being asserted by the wearer.
and YES, ordinary clothes in indie. the last really great dresser in music i can think of is Tricky. Always looked immaculately cool. and funnily enough he was the last person in recen memory to donna dress too wasnt he? perhaps some awareness of the "problematic" exhibited in that?
I know; it's not just thrown on, but it's a neurotic rather than a flamboyant caring about their appearance...Originally Posted by WOEBOT
was thinking about this in relation to 'blackness' in general and how it is taken to be a synonym for 'street' now... just think about Hendrix and Miles and p-funk... how OFFWORLD 'black' used to be...
in a sense, the reverse though.... too much choice, too much autonomy, is being flaunted.. because otherwise they would be literally fashion victims... there's a lot of that with teenage males, the sportswear uniform is easy because it stops them feeling in any danger of looking 'silly'...but yes i do get your point as well. there IS a sense with sportswear that it appears no "choice" is being asserted by the wearer.
For boys, yes, but Roisin Murphy is incredible for galz...and YES, ordinary clothes in indie. the last really great dresser in music i can think of is Tricky. Always looked immaculately cool. and funnily enough he was the last person in recen memory to donna dress too wasnt he? perhaps some awareness of the "problematic" exhibited in that?
I wonder about that generalization of hip-hop fashion.. seems like at least they can be in contrast - not a lot of functionality in jewel-studded grills.
which leads me to the different strains of hiphop and fashion, OutKast, for example.. and so-called "pimp style", for example Snoop with his long curls and fedoras, and, um, roller skates in the Snoop Dogg (DO double Gizzee) video..
Also seconding that sportswear can be immaculate, as well as gleaming, streamlined, futuristic.. seems more than just economic . There's also a lot of "science" referred to in the marketing of trainers, I don't know if that's how they function symbolically in hiphop. and there's also the collecter's attitude towards trainers - limited editions and that. Still, probably the case that it can be acceptable because sportswear resonates with "ordinary guy" clothing.
there's something just incredibly depressing about the dearth of real style in all areas of music now, though. Tricky was a one off, a true original in every aspect and maybe my last major musical crush (until justin timberlake but that's much more predictable). Roll Deep look pretty awful in that picture sean linked but no better or worse, to my mind, than the guys in the indie bands mark hates so much... but i tend to go for the guys in the converse all stars over the guys in nike air IRL too.
as little as i see of any of the cultural stuff i'm interested in on TV, BBC's Culture show still dragged out that old trainer fetish/collector thing for another sketch last week and, while i sighed at having to watch that one more time, i knew i'd still have to watch it countless times again. It seems to me to be completely manufactured in every sense.Originally Posted by ripley
k-punk and jd are spot on here, it's rather depressing.
mind you aren't the franz/libertines neo-britpop axis trying to revive this somewhat? neat hair, suits and whatnot. they can't really pull it off though, but the intention is there. going to vaguely 'indie' nights in my manor of late things are definitely improving, though there's still too much greasy hair and jeans for my liking (stands up straight, grips cane)
re- roll deep, scratchy is pretty magnetic live. plus girls hair, mad staring eyes etc....
martin's comment upthread about 'theorists' looking shit can be disproved thus-