bruno

est malade
a better video of the event:


dctvbot: i believe in open discussion..
antifa: i don't care what you believe!
 

droid

Well-known member
Astounding in this day and age that people still believe you can debate Nazis and fascists. Destructive, thick headed liberalism at its worst.
 

bruno

est malade
the far left has never believed in debate, hence the nazi/fascist tags to shut down the possibility. in any case you need not worry as there was no attempt to debate.
 

droid

Well-known member
Laughably wrong. Antifa are anarchists, and the achilles heel of anarchism is the willingness to debate and the emphasis on consensus.

But you dont debate with fascism. It's a poisonous anti-human ideology that deserves only to be crushed.
 

bruno

est malade
Laughably wrong. Antifa are anarchists, and the achilles heel of anarchism is the willingness to debate and the emphasis on consensus.

But you dont debate with fascism. It's a poisonous anti-human ideology that deserves only to be crushed.

whatever, they are indistinguishable from the revolutionary left in language and action. the fascism card is old as the hills and used to lethal effect in places where the state has been dismantled/overtaken. it's quite simply an unwillingness to engage ideas outside a very narrow ideologically pure spectrum. i have nothing but contempt for this.
 

bruno

est malade
it is called dissensus. presumably in the spirit of dissent. but you can keep deflecting or address the above.
 

vimothy

yurp
Maybe you should debate us rather than calling for our eradication and comparing us to rabid dogs? ❌

"You don't debate with antifa, it's a poisonous ideology that deserves to be eradicated" is obviously isomorphic to the equivalent claim about fascism. Such claims have a tactical utility that strictly dominate any kind of principled position. As long as you can paint your ideological opponents as fascists / antifa / the evil other, then doing the hard work of debating their ideas becomes superfluous and you can instead enjoy exercising arbitrary power over them.
 

luka

Well-known member
i mean leaving aside the rights and wrongs of it theyre all a bunch of fucking sadcases.
 

bruno

est malade
Maybe you should debate us rather than calling for our eradication and comparing us to rabid dogs? ❌

i apologise, it was said in jest to contrast with my call to civility. i do hate violence, especially as i was on the receiving end last year (assaulted and stabbed).
 

john eden

male pale and stale
i apologise, it was said in jest to contrast with my call to civility. i do hate violence, especially as i was on the receiving end last year (assaulted and stabbed).

Well I am sorry to hear that.

Presumably you would also agree that standing outside a gallery and being on the receiving end of some harsh words and having a cardboard placard taken off you isn't really a comparable level of violence to getting stabbed though?
 

bruno

est malade
Presumably you would also agree that standing outside a gallery and being on the receiving end of some harsh words and having a cardboard placard taken off you isn't really a comparable level of violence to getting stabbed though?
no, but dehumanising your opponent is tacit permission to excercise violence. in a way it's the desired end as in the video – to push the other once too often so as to generate a response. luckily mr josef k was cool and steadfast.
 

john eden

male pale and stale
no, but dehumanising your opponent is tacit permission to excercise violence. in a way it's the desired end as in the video – to push the other once too often so as to generate a response. luckily mr josef k was cool and steadfast.

Well it was certainly a heated environment, which I think is both predictable and understandable.

thumb_IMG_3907_1024.jpg
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
If it's true that Lucia Diego had rocks thrown through her windows, as Josef K reports, I expect she was probably left wondering whether some fairly serious violence was about to be visited upon her person. And threats of murder or other personal violence (e.g. rape) over social media have become absolutely standard tactics for the more unhinged sorts of activists, whatever their professed ideology.

josef k said:
They came as a group, some with usernames, to the event page, informing the owners of the bookshop that the man giving the talk, your correspondent, was a fascist sympathizer who had defended the Nazi gallery in London. A guy called Justin Katko wrote: “Fascists should have their tongues cut out before they are allowed to speak.”

It's hard to avoid the irony when professed anti-fascists talk about how they'd prefer to deal with their enemies in precisely the sort of terms that fascists have historically dealt with theirs. That's not to say "they're as bad as each other" - of course it isn't - but does suggest some fairly similar emotional processes on each side.

And as following on from luka's comments on the previous page, reading about this stuff does nothing to dispel the notion that the art world is packed to the rafters with self-important bellends, regardless of their politics.
 

luka

Well-known member
I am fond of Anders Breivik for reasons other than what they surmised. Most Right-wingers who turn to violence and are aware of the white genocide issue tend to go out and shoot some of the Other; I praised Breivik because instead, he shot the members of Us who had turned to Leftism, and so raised the cost of being a Leftist and drove people away from participating in that pathological cultlike gang of civilization-wreckers. Breivik (read his manifesto including one of my writings) showed us humane anti-internationalist terrorism: he shot the people responsible — white liberals — rather than the symptoms and tools of their perfidy, the non-whites brought in by the white Leftists.
This is part of a pattern on Amerika. It will never make me friends, but I attack the tendency of some on the Right to scapegoat when the actual enemy is within: we did this to ourselves, through an individualism which became collectivized, creating a solipsistic society, which has then engendered a number of symptoms of its failure, including Leftism, consumerism, mob rule, diversity and a rather disgusting attention whoring egoism. Black people, The Jew,™ African-Americans, Muslims, The Rich,™ and Freemasons did not “do this to us.” We did it to us. We have met the enemy, and he is us. We have to change ourselves, and stop being individualistic so that we can (instead) focus on eternal and transcendental truths, and use those to understand how to restore the fallen Western Civilization.
 
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