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Thread: Trump

  1. #1606
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew View Post
    society definitely should eat less meat though innit. or as now the reviled lsd-maniac michael pollan said "eat food, not so much, mainly plants"
    Meat eating on a mass-basis is a relatively young development. The vast majority of people in the past didn't have that luxury anyways. The ultimate crux, at least imo, in this question isn't so much meat or vegetarian/vegan. It's basically the fact industrialized agriculture definitley hasd more negative than positive effects. They have a very effective lobby though.

  2. #1607
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    Quote Originally Posted by luka View Post
    and youre saying it's perverse to try to swim against that current. those are the positions. and that's why youre not on the team.
    What team would that be? Your team? Team Good?

    I'm reminded of all your rants that end "kill them all"...
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  3. #1608
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    Quote Originally Posted by Matthew View Post
    @Tea. actually this is very interesting. i wonder, in some respects if it is more ethical to kill and eat meat than keep livestock in permanent captivity to produce dairy and eggs. more and more that's the opinion i'm coming round to.
    This has occurred to me too. I mean, I eat meat and dairy foods anyway, but I think from the POV of reducing animal suffering it's probably better to eat meat and shun eggs/dairy than vice-versa.
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  4. #1609
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    Is anyone able to shed some light on why being indifferent to or enjoying hurting animals as a child is considered to be a sign of mental illness, but doing the same as an adult isn't?

  5. #1610
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    Its not indifference, its sadistic pleasure in cruelty to animals. One of the three early signs of psychopathy in serial killers.

  6. #1611
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    I'm sure indifference is also part of it as one sign is a lack of empathy. If a child just blankly pulls apart and kills animals with no emotional response then that's also a warning sign.

    My main point is that if a child enjoys say chasing down an animal and killing it, that's considered to be a problem. If an adult spends their weekends hunting for sport, that isn't considered to be a problem despite the adult being mature enough to grasp the full extent of what they're doing.
    Last edited by version; 12-07-2018 at 08:43 PM.

  7. #1612
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    it's a trump thread, talk about trump please not plants and cows thank you.

  8. #1613
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    Quote Originally Posted by version View Post
    Is anyone able to shed some light on why being indifferent to or enjoying hurting animals as a child is considered to be a sign of mental illness, but doing the same as an adult isn't?
    Are you sure about that? I reckon MH professionals would probably consider it significant if an adult they were interested in made a habit of torturing cats or whatever.

    Edit: depends on what you mean by 'hunting for sport'. I have no problem with hunting (meaning shooting) for food - ethically speaking it's surely far preferable to (most) farming practices. If you mean foxhunting with dogs, yeah, that's pretty indefensible, but I guess the people who do that (or used to) would say it's about the thrill of the chase rather than the gore of the kill, as such. The logical endpoint of this sort of 'sport' is something like badger baiting, where there is no 'chase' at all and it's just about the gore and suffering.

    Edit: sorry Leo, good point, lol. Maybe sufi will transplant all these posts into the existing veganism thread. Or maybe he won't, who knows.
    Last edited by Mr. Tea; 12-07-2018 at 09:39 PM.
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  9. #1614
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    its a 108 page thread. i think theres room for digressions.

  10. #1615
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mr. Tea View Post
    Are you sure about that? I reckon MH professionals would probably consider it significant if an adult they were interested in made a habit of torturing cats or whatever.

    Edit: depends on what you mean by 'hunting for sport'. I have no problem with hunting (meaning shooting) for food - ethically speaking it's surely far preferable to (most) farming practices. If you mean foxhunting with dogs, yeah, that's pretty indefensible, but I guess the people who do that (or used to) would say it's about the thrill of the chase rather than the gore of the kill, as such. The logical endpoint of this sort of 'sport' is something like badger baiting, where there is no 'chase' at all and it's just about the gore and suffering.

    Edit: sorry Leo, good point, lol. Maybe sufi will transplant all these posts into the existing veganism thread. Or maybe he won't, who knows.
    I just mean killing things for recreation, big game hunting and that sort of thing. The adults doing it understand the implications, they understand that it can inflict pain and cause distress and there's no real purpose to it other than personal enjoyment. It's just killing for the sake of killing. Obviously there are the arguments about the money from hunts going into conservation efforts and so on, but that's not the motivation for the hunt itself. These people aren't killing things to give money to conservation efforts, they're giving money so that they can kill things.

    With regard to the "thrill of the chase", I don't think you can separate the two. The only reason there's a chase at all is because of the intention to kill whatever's being chased.

  11. #1616
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leo View Post
    it's a trump thread, talk about trump please not plants and cows thank you.
    There is at least a connection between soy farmers of the mid-west who voted for Trump and are now being fucked over by Trump's trade-war with China.
    So talking about plants and farming makes some sense also in a Trump thread.

  12. #1617
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    didnt we get here becuase of the correlation between glorifying meat eating, and especially red meat eating, and supporting trump. it's part of the same complex of rejection. of, to add a tiny bit of sophistication to teas naive formulation, giving in to a set of impulses and gorging them.

    i think tea is right in that it is the return of the repressed and that deciding you can eat steak every day of the week is just another facet of the whole. it goes right along with climate change denial and points to the fact that it is reality denying. psychologically real without being reality congruent.

    sorry thats a bit of a mess but i think you get what i mean

  13. #1618
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    Quote Originally Posted by luka View Post
    didnt we get here becuase of the correlation between glorifying meat eating, and especially red meat eating, and supporting trump.
    So is that actually really a thing? I mean are there people, wearing a MAGA hat, eating a bloody steak and while doing so posting pix on their instagram saying: "there, take that, u cultural vegan marxist, I am stuffing myself with a dead cow just to stick it to you"

  14. #1619
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    it's a movement. a movement of 8 year old boys in mens bodies, i will illustrate if you bear with me. i can flesh out this thesis!

  15. #1620
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    Quote Originally Posted by luka View Post
    it's a movement. a movement of 8 year old boys in mens bodies, i will illustrate if you bear with me. i can flesh out this thesis!
    well, go ahead. Why not add another bizarre aspect to this Trump farce?

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