rubberdingyrapids
Well-known member
i dont think theres been 'deep' political engagement in popular music since the 60s/70s but what about hip hop in the 80s/90s? (mostly racial politics there, but still)
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Won't Somebody Please Think of the Children?
- Thread starter Corpsey
- Start date
sadmanbarty
Well-known member
A couple of thoughts re music's role in society and politics:
Subcultures don't seem to congregate around music anymore; whereas that was the case for most youth subcultures before (mods, rockers, skinheads, hippies, punks, goths, b boys, etc.).
Come to think of it I can't really recall any subcultures from the last 10 years. I suppose hipsters, which is telling because they would define themselves by musical eclecticism.
The closest I've come to music as social group was people in South East london using Giggs to signify that they were in the Peckham Boys.
Slacktivism has possibly taken away the need to signify your political affiliations by identifying with a subculture.
Though racial politics is a big theme in music recently.
Subcultures don't seem to congregate around music anymore; whereas that was the case for most youth subcultures before (mods, rockers, skinheads, hippies, punks, goths, b boys, etc.).
Come to think of it I can't really recall any subcultures from the last 10 years. I suppose hipsters, which is telling because they would define themselves by musical eclecticism.
The closest I've come to music as social group was people in South East london using Giggs to signify that they were in the Peckham Boys.
Slacktivism has possibly taken away the need to signify your political affiliations by identifying with a subculture.
Though racial politics is a big theme in music recently.
Corpsey
bandz ahoy
There have also been bit cuts to the arts in recent years, haven't there?
The Guardian again http://www.theguardian.com/music/2015/apr/21/david-pountney-arts-funding-bad-for-our-cultural-health
The Guardian again http://www.theguardian.com/music/2015/apr/21/david-pountney-arts-funding-bad-for-our-cultural-health
rubberdingyrapids
Well-known member
isnt the newer trend in political music/films etc for it to be wholly ambiguous and then wait for cultural critics/commentators to do the work for you? im trying to think of an example but i do seem to see a lot of pieces like that. then again, thats prob something cultural critics have always done.
luka
Well-known member
All arts council funding does is create a class of people who specialise in applying for arts council grants. A particularly wretched breed of scum. Losing youth centres etc would have more concrete effects though
sadmanbarty
Well-known member
rubberdingyrapids
Well-known member
see, youre in touch with the younger generation after all, watching rae sremmurd videos and all that.
face it, most of these old sub cultural groups werent really all about The Music Maaaaan, the music was just the pivot for people to form and bond around (and wear similar trousers together). but i suppose the music was still a glue back then, whereas now its maybe been relegated to being more of a nice, sometimes interesting background hum
face it, most of these old sub cultural groups werent really all about The Music Maaaaan, the music was just the pivot for people to form and bond around (and wear similar trousers together). but i suppose the music was still a glue back then, whereas now its maybe been relegated to being more of a nice, sometimes interesting background hum
Leo
Well-known member
perhaps recent music-related subcultures are just smaller than they were in the past. what about something like odd future and all its offshoots (tyler, earl sweatshirt, the internet, etc.). to an old man like me, they seemed to come out of nowhere but in reality tyler had been a thing for a while and it all spread below my radar via social media to create a sizable following of disaffected black and white teens. no political angle, though.
rubberdingyrapids
Well-known member
yeah thats the biggest development i think
people like that famous vlogger KSI who makes average rap music but still manages to sell out venues in quick time cos of his video blogs
people like that famous vlogger KSI who makes average rap music but still manages to sell out venues in quick time cos of his video blogs
Corpsey
bandz ahoy
All the lads have got the short back and sides and floppy top hair now. They all look like disclosure. And that rinse FM pop music luka made a thread about - some of it is great, but a lot of it is really bland, tailor made for use in Wimbledon montages. But maybe that's just pop music.
Know what I mean though? Sam Smith. Rudimental. Inspirational choruses. Gym music.
WHY DONT THEY GET A BLOODY HAIRCUT?
Know what I mean though? Sam Smith. Rudimental. Inspirational choruses. Gym music.
WHY DONT THEY GET A BLOODY HAIRCUT?
Woebot
Well-known member
followed the link through to that article corpsey. it's pretty confused - trying to wedge together two separate arguments - one about drinking - the other about shrinking horizons for young people. i suppose there is some common ground but she seems to think everyone spent the nineties was drunk (tho perhaps is that just code/shorthand for off their tits - in which case fair enough)
i reckon my first thought is that certainly in the UK since the sixties to some extent we've profited by not giving a toss. that devil-may-care attitude - sure it has had negative consequences for a few - but some people have made their way through life riding on that wave of confidence. it doesn't necessarily help being too serious and button-down. i mean, using her own examples, a lot of "work" actually gets done in social situations meeting people when one goes out for a drink who inadvertently turn out to be good contacts.
i do worry about ver kids though still. especially having two of my own (one a teenager!) it's globalisations dark hours isn't it.
music's place in the whole thing is, at least to me, pretty clear. simply not "important" any more. that's not to say it's necessarily not as good, but with less at stake (money, influence etc) the energy isn't there. music being only a conduit for those energies in the first place. but i'm not sure if im that bothered
i reckon my first thought is that certainly in the UK since the sixties to some extent we've profited by not giving a toss. that devil-may-care attitude - sure it has had negative consequences for a few - but some people have made their way through life riding on that wave of confidence. it doesn't necessarily help being too serious and button-down. i mean, using her own examples, a lot of "work" actually gets done in social situations meeting people when one goes out for a drink who inadvertently turn out to be good contacts.
i do worry about ver kids though still. especially having two of my own (one a teenager!) it's globalisations dark hours isn't it.
music's place in the whole thing is, at least to me, pretty clear. simply not "important" any more. that's not to say it's necessarily not as good, but with less at stake (money, influence etc) the energy isn't there. music being only a conduit for those energies in the first place. but i'm not sure if im that bothered
luka
Well-known member
provincial nightclub '90s. second half the '90s. Gazza, Danny Baker and Chris Evans with traffic cone hats. TFI Friday with a bar in the studio. Cigerettes and alcohol. Sarah Cox with a minging hangover. Johnny Vaughn invents banter. Teddy Sheringham in The Dentists Chair. Lager Lager Lager. James Brown editing Loaded magazine. Before craft beer existed. Tripping over the stairs on your way to pick up a Brit award, clutching a can of Stella. Jimmy Five Bellies. The invention of the alcopop. 6 cans for a fiver. Get it down ya.
rubberdingyrapids
Well-known member
luka you should write a guide to the 1990s
CrowleyHead
Well-known member
Its a little rude for as many of you to think music doesn't matter to young kids as much as it did to you lot. The methods of 'value' have changed a bit, sure, but... This is still pretty life defining stuff for certain people. Not Everyone, but was music of the same value for everyone when it was any other decade? Doubtful.
luka
Well-known member
Mistaken possibly but I'm not sure it's rude. It's not a question of whether individuals still engage meaningfully with music, that's a given its more a question of whether it occupies the same space in the culture. There are people who still read novels, perhaps even passionately, but the novel is culturally irrelevant.