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Thread: UK EU Referendum Aftermath

  1. #1276
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    JRM is the latest in a line of Brexiteers to find out that it's easy to bray from the sidelines, quite another to actually try to realise one's fantasies in reality.

  2. #1277
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    Amber Rudd's just resigned and surrendered the whip.

  3. #1278
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    Quote Originally Posted by version View Post
    Amber Rudd's just resigned and surrendered the whip.
    I wonder how much difference all these resignations make, I guess they are symbolic and chip away at BJ's authority, but beyond that, when the next election comes (and it is coming) their seats will likely go back to Tory won't they?

  4. #1279
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    At the moment I want to see what Johnson is going to do. As I see it, he's painted himself into a corner by doubling-down on this "I will not ask for an extension" bollocks. As I see it, he has the following choices...

    1. Break the law (and risk sanctions up to actual jail time)
    2. Break his one and only promise that he has repeated again and again and which his entire credibility rests on
    3. Resign
    4. Something else, something sneaky and barely legal or constitutional that will cause massive protests but might just get him off the hook.

    The question is, does he have a number four? And if not, why the fuck would he keep repeating his unkeepable promise. Cos I'd say if he doesn't have some kind of special plan then he is in real serious trouble. And it's all his own fault, he should have just accepted the extension, then had an election and won it, but I'm actually not sure he'll be here to take us out of the EU even if we do finally leave.

  5. #1280
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    They are not really reporting it on the Guardian but it looks like the other papers are saying that Johnson WILL refuse to ask for an extension (as far as I can tell before I reach the paywall). I'd like to read about this in depth, does he think he can get away with that (and, if so, why?) or is it just bluster?

  6. #1281
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    from Andrew Sullivan http://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/...rt-brexit.html

    But what looks like a dreadful start for Johnson may not end that way. It could also lead to triumph. Here’s why: It seems inevitable now that a general election will happen this October or, at the very latest, November. If Brexit has not happened — and it’s pretty clear at this point that it will not have — then the election is effectively going to be a second referendum. This time, the choice will be starker than in 2016: a no-deal Brexit or staying in the E.U. And this week, by firing the dissenters, Johnson has succeeded in making the Tories the uncomplicated “Leave Now” party. By clearing up any confusion, Johnson will thereby stymie the threat to Tory seats by the Brexit Party, which stormed to victory in the recent European elections. He may even secure an election “nonaggression” pact with the Brexit party on a clearly “no deal” agenda. What Boris has effectively done is rerun the referendum as an election campaign.

    His argument is a simple and powerful one: In the referendum, a majority voted to leave the E.U., and this decision should be honored or democracy itself is undermined. The E.U. will not let Britain eat its cake and have it too, and has insisted that the U.K. remain largely under E.U. rules even as it leaves the E.U., offering a compromise that was rejected by the U.K. Parliament decisively three times. So a “no deal” exit is the only realistic version of Brexit left. It’s the people’s will against the elites’. The idea that voters did not know what they were doing in 2016 is delusional. They were told endlessly that leaving would mean catastrophe in economic terms, and they still voted to leave. The real question is: Why have we not left on time? What’s left to argue about? Get on with it.
    ...

    Johnson has a clear case: that he stands for respecting a democratic vote to leave the E.U., that his opponents are elitists trying to defeat the will of the people in favor of a foreign entity, the E.U., and that Jeremy Corbyn cannot be allowed into Number 10. It’s right-wing populism headed by someone with charisma and a record of winning elections. Labour? Its strongest issues are domestic: better health care, tax increases on the rich, more affordable housing — and in an election dominated by Brexit, those issues will be less salient. Its position on Brexit, moreover, has been hopelessly confused, never quite achieving a clear pro-E.U. stance.

    As for Corbyn, he is the Tories’ secret weapon. An unreconstructed Marxist and anti-Semite, his approval ratings are in the 20s — almost halved from 2017. A new snap poll this week revealed that only 18 percent of Brits think Corbyn would be the best prime minister compared with 40 percent for Johnson. In a new poll, 43 percent of Brits said the worst outcome of a general election would be Corbyn as prime minister, while only 35 percent cited a no-deal exit. Elections are a choice. If it’s Corbyn versus No Deal, No Deal could very well win.

  7. #1282
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    This is my problem.... how can an election be a straight referendum? How should someone vote who is a life-long Labour voter but also a Leaver?
    Last edited by IdleRich; 08-09-2019 at 01:34 PM.

  8. #1283
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  9. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to version For This Useful Post:


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  11. #1285
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    Well that settles it, I'm switching to Leave.

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  13. #1286
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  14. #1287
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    Quote Originally Posted by IdleRich View Post
    This is my problem.... how can an election be a straight referendum? How should someone vote who is a life-long Labour voter but also a Leaver?
    Len McCluskey's Real Labour Party (watch this space)
    Doin' the Lambeth Warp New: DISSENSUS - THE NOVEL - PM me your email address and I'll add you

  15. #1288
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    I've been seeing a lot of polls these last few days, they contradict and so on but overall I'm getting the impression that a Tory win isn't as certain as I thought. Is it just me or what?

  16. #1289
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    The Tories have been very good at sticking to this "Surrender Bill" bollocks. Considering that a) we know that they are not really negotiating properly and b) even if they were, threatening to just fuck everything up wouldn't be a good tactic - we know that the name is completely dishonest and doesn't make any sense but by sticking to it they've got their message out and I see it being used as the name everywhere. Now I don't know if this is by people who get it and are happy to repeat the lie for their own ends or just by the manipulated but either way it's gained far more currency than it deserved.

  17. #1290
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    Bercow stepping down now.... oh dear

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