padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
I know it's just a message board for whatever little it's worth my sincere best wishes to all yall + your people to come thru it in one piece

unreal
 

padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
a question or two - I know there's a specific Rees-Mogg thread but

why is Parliament/your country seemingly so beholden to him and his relatively small cabal of Hard Brexiters? am I overstating that?

what is their envisioned end-game?

Trump's administration I get - they're kleptocrats, plus some insane ideologues like Bannon/Miller, etc - but I really do not get this Hard Brexit thing
 

padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
if you leave aside the likely vast human cost I guess you could also see it the end of England's long slow retreat to its place as an island at the edge of Europe

not to be callous or whatever, just also find it a bit fascinating, that historical arc of the last 450 years or so I guess

no that the U.S.'s day isn't also looming at the some future point, perhaps a near future point
 

padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
looking pretty likely that this century basically belongs to Chinese wealth and Russian intelligence
maybe, maybe not

not to get sidetracked but it's easy to forget that very recently Russia looked like a complete fucking mess, and probably still does by a lot of underlying metrics

idk enough Kremlinology to speculate on how much of it is just a shell game for siloviki/oligarchs and what happens when the Putin/Lavrov etc generation ages out

if anything that Russian intelligence, indirect warfare approach was emphasized specifically because they're operating from a position of weakness

use your opponents strengths' against them, very jiujistu (or in keeping w/Putin, judo)

China, yeah that's on much more solid ground
 

padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
tho kinda back o/t, I imagine it's been said upthread but I'm sure Putin et al are gleefully rubbing their hands over prospect of disastrous Brexit

more disunited Western Europe, easier to bargain with/run roughshod over

fuck it's grim rn huh. embattled weight of years Merkl, Macron papering cracks with enthusiasm (World Cup!), obv worst U.S. prez on Europe possibly literally ever.
 

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
I know it's just a message board for whatever little it's worth my sincere best wishes to all yall + your people to come thru it in one piece

unreal

Much appreciated, seriously.

And similar thoughts to you guys for the next 2.5 (praying to any god that'll listen it's not 6.5) years.
 

john eden

male pale and stale
What are the anti-neoliberal currents in the EU? And what is their leverage?

For all the things wrong with Corbyn, there is a remote chance that we’ll have an elected govt in the UK which opposes this sort of thing.
 

john eden

male pale and stale
privatisation of healthcare in Europe https://corporateeurope.org/power-lobbies/2017/06/creeping-privatisation-healthcare it's a year out of date but looks interesting nonetheless. I know nothing about this before reading fully, but on a quick view seems that the US may not have to do much bullying there on points of privatisation

Macron has been waging a war on unionised labour in France since he was elected. It's not like they need any encouragement.

As usual the people being bullied are the working class rather than the "good" EU being bullied by the "bad" US (ties in with thirdform's thread about conservative history).
 

baboon2004

Darned cockwombles.
yep, always the story.

And Macron is pushing reforms through despite chronically low approval ratings a la Thatcher (plus his staff beating up protestors) - probably about time for him to find a diversion...
 

version

Well-known member
I didn't say the EU was "good" or the US was "bad". I said that it's more difficult to bully the EU than it is the UK and it is, it's much more difficult to push around a trading bloc that size than one small nation, particularly when said nation is in dire need of a trade deal.

I agree re: Corbyn and hope he gets in for that reason. My biggest fear concerning Brexit was that we'd end up being asset stripped by the US and possibly China and the Tories seem only too willing to oblige. The thought of following the Republican party down the black hole of increasingly lower taxes and deregulation is worrying to say the least.
 

john eden

male pale and stale
My point is that it's not bullying if there is a shared agenda. It is actually a conspiracy of bullies, colluding.

There is a progressive EU and a neoliberal EU and the latter is in the ascendant...
 

version

Well-known member
My point is that it's not bullying if there is a shared agenda. It is actually a conspiracy of bullies, colluding.

There is a progressive EU and a neoliberal EU and the latter is in the ascendant...

Point taken, but you also have to take into account who's currently in charge of the US. The Trump administration doesn't share the EU's agenda and he doesn't appear to understand anything other than a zero-sum game where he wins via brute force. The EU are in a much better position to push back against that than a post-Brexit UK.
 
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