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Thread: Why Do Millenials Hate Genre?

  1. #31
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    barty;

    I personally feel, as a reflection of how the industry compartmentalizes itself, that class affects how we view music. Streaming has become the current ecology of 'modernity' of music, and likewise artists are encouraged to not only make records that suit streaming (there's a big conspiracy that albums have over 22+ tracks these days to ensure the profits made from streaming to bolster the reputations of albums that will not be purchased) whereas records who sell a lot of units get very little to no recognition. In the US, Kevin Gates sold well in the 6 figure range in rap, and is one of the most popular artists in radio and occasionally in streaming... but in the deep rural south among mostly black listeners, who are not considered a desirable audience. Eminem is likewise as much in the rural west away from urban areas. And those are two rap artists who are mostly looked at with derision by 'young, hip, net savvy' kids on the internet.

    I don't think it's entirely unfair that, because of circumstances of their environment that makes them less self-conscious... A lot of those persons don't fall into the expectations of the millenial you outlined. Not to say that it's because they're from parts of america that makes them less of anything than those who do. But these artists have no media power. They exist within the music industry and do significantly well, but have nothing that makes them feel aesthetic value. The active process of that traditional source of income within music, sales, is getting moved past so aggressively thanks to technology that the music industry is literally cutting itself away from turning back. And I don't think it's entirely coincidental that those artists are such codified genre artists as well.

    I should actually clarify... I think that rather than establish a financial class, the internet has been establishing classes of technological familiarity that almost work along social class lines. You can be from any educational, social, racial, etc. backgrounds and the connection to yourself and your identity along these 'networked' lines makes it hard to unplug once you've had access to this sense of connectivity. To the point now artists have separate careers outside of traditional media based solely around internet fame where if you're not the person who's plugged in, none of it makes any sense because they don't have that 'real world' fame.

    The thing is, for almost a full decade, Road Rap existed outside of the internet's eye. It was there, it racked up huge numbers, it was big but the internet didn't touch it primarily. That changes at a certain point over the last few years with Drill which is in itself a hijacking of a Real World rap culture from America. The reality of the road rap identity dissolves with acts like 67 or Section Boyz, talking about trapping, drillers, stolen catchphrases from Chief Keef and Drake. That isn't an American identity per se, its an internet identity an identity formed by the homogenity. And like that, we're seeing much much more of the media acknowledging and liking Road Rap, especially now that grime's nostalgia value was oversaturated in the wake of grime in the 2010s being less about people mixing mutual genre baggage into conforming into an acceptable identity of an MC.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by m99188868 View Post
    I think you could quite easily argue that every technological invention relevant to music, from notation to reproduction media, has in a certain sense had the double outcome of both facilitating the growing omnipresence of music and, by a consequence, feedings its devaluation. To a point we'd now probably rather pay for silence than for music.
    Funny thing that touches on everything you say: https://www.jacobinmag.com/2014/07/a...the-pack-rats/

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrowleyHead View Post
    Funny thing that touches on everything you say: https://www.jacobinmag.com/2014/07/a...the-pack-rats/
    Seems an interesting read, thank you.

  4. #34
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    obv if youre poor, spotify, and whatever other streaming services arent going to mean anything to you. thats the internet in general. the problem of everything going online assumes everyone has easy access to the internet, and that they know how to use it. but most genres today are on the net, on youtube, whether youre in the favelas or on a peckham housing estate. its the cheapest way to get heard and distribute your music. i would say yeah theres prob plenty kids in south london who arent really that interested in much outside rap (i cant imagine there are many only into road rap however.... though who knows), but the idea of it being like the 90s where youd get people ferociously defending their genre, or attacking other genres, is pretty much moot. even today with grime, as its become something more mainstream, no one is really getting into any genre wars. its more 'grime is good' rather than 'grime is good... your genre is shit'. that defensive posture isnt there. or needed maybe. cos if youre into grime, youre prob seeking it out and theres enough outlets all on the web for you to feel youre being catered to. the attitude is more about 'i want my place' rather than 'fuck your place.. im taking your place'.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CrowleyHead View Post
    barty;

    I personally feel, as a reflection of how the industry compartmentalizes itself, that class affects how we view music. Streaming has become the current ecology of 'modernity' of music, and likewise artists are encouraged to not only make records that suit streaming (there's a big conspiracy that albums have over 22+ tracks these days to ensure the profits made from streaming to bolster the reputations of albums that will not be purchased) whereas records who sell a lot of units get very little to no recognition. In the US, Kevin Gates sold well in the 6 figure range in rap, and is one of the most popular artists in radio and occasionally in streaming... but in the deep rural south among mostly black listeners, who are not considered a desirable audience. Eminem is likewise as much in the rural west away from urban areas. And those are two rap artists who are mostly looked at with derision by 'young, hip, net savvy' kids on the internet.

    I don't think it's entirely unfair that, because of circumstances of their environment that makes them less self-conscious... A lot of those persons don't fall into the expectations of the millenial you outlined. Not to say that it's because they're from parts of america that makes them less of anything than those who do. But these artists have no media power. They exist within the music industry and do significantly well, but have nothing that makes them feel aesthetic value. The active process of that traditional source of income within music, sales, is getting moved past so aggressively thanks to technology that the music industry is literally cutting itself away from turning back. And I don't think it's entirely coincidental that those artists are such codified genre artists as well.

    I should actually clarify... I think that rather than establish a financial class, the internet has been establishing classes of technological familiarity that almost work along social class lines. You can be from any educational, social, racial, etc. backgrounds and the connection to yourself and your identity along these 'networked' lines makes it hard to unplug once you've had access to this sense of connectivity. To the point now artists have separate careers outside of traditional media based solely around internet fame where if you're not the person who's plugged in, none of it makes any sense because they don't have that 'real world' fame.

    The thing is, for almost a full decade, Road Rap existed outside of the internet's eye. It was there, it racked up huge numbers, it was big but the internet didn't touch it primarily. That changes at a certain point over the last few years with Drill which is in itself a hijacking of a Real World rap culture from America. The reality of the road rap identity dissolves with acts like 67 or Section Boyz, talking about trapping, drillers, stolen catchphrases from Chief Keef and Drake. That isn't an American identity per se, its an internet identity an identity formed by the homogenity. And like that, we're seeing much much more of the media acknowledging and liking Road Rap, especially now that grime's nostalgia value was oversaturated in the wake of grime in the 2010s being less about people mixing mutual genre baggage into conforming into an acceptable identity of an MC.
    Hahaha (Frankie Boyle voice) you actually wrote that crap

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    Quote Originally Posted by mistersloane View Post
    Hahaha (Frankie Boyle voice) you actually wrote that crap
    Fuckin hell man

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    Quote Originally Posted by mistersloane View Post
    I don't think it's entirely unfair that, because of circumstances of their environment that makes them less self-conscious... A lot of those persons don't fall into the expectations of the millenial you outlined.

    Explain your cock fucking explanations you cock
    No, really. Go on.
    Last edited by mistersloane; 19-06-2017 at 04:04 PM.

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    I probably wrote myself into a hole at least twice tbf so if you think there's an argument you'd like to make against me I'll hear it. More than likely I fucked up whatever I meant to say.

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    @genre wars .... I was a teenager through the 1990s and frankly, can't even remember much genre warfare going on back then. There was the indie-rock crowd though who would be somewhat hostile towards dance and Hip Hop, mostly motivated by the very conservative notion of those two genres being sample based/done with synths and computers it wasn't "honest" music bc they didn't play "real instruments".

  14. #43

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    Think people are mixing up 'genres' with 'subcultures', though. The fashion element was also important. You could have a zillion Trojan and Blue Beat records but if you turned up to a skinhead bash with the wrong size turn-ups, or a pair of winkle-pickers, you'd be exposed as a dilletante or - even worse - a POSER (and probably given a kick up the arse).

    Similarly, one of the most strikingly goth-looking people I've ever met was far more interested in stuff like Michelle Shocked, 10,000 Maniacs, etc, than anything that'd make a Quietus 'Top 20 Goth Records Ever' list. And I doubt townies hated emos purely on musical grounds.

    It did all fizzle out by the 1990s, though. Or at least became more simple. Where I lived, it was kids in flattop cuts, fluorescent ski jackets, Mr Byrite jeans or shellsuits vs. anyone who looked remotely different (or dressed in black).


    Quote Originally Posted by firefinga View Post
    here was the indie-rock crowd though who would be somewhat hostile towards dance and Hip Hop
    Agree about dance though, in my personal experience, almost everyone I knew in the early '90s, even the indie crowd, were pretty familiar with PE and NWA at least, if only for the notoriety. 'Black Sunday' seemed as much a staple platter as 'Nevermind'.
    Last edited by martin; 21-06-2017 at 11:16 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by john eden View Post
    skateboarder who supports Arsenal
    Can't think of anything that screams out 'wanker' more

  16. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by firefinga View Post
    There was the indie-rock crowd though who would be somewhat hostile towards dance and Hip Hop, mostly motivated by the very conservative notion of those two genres being sample based/done with synths and computers it wasn't "honest" music bc they didn't play "real instruments".
    thats a genre war
    i remember my 6th form in the 90s and indie kids would not touch r&b or rap or garage.
    unless it was a gorillaz remix.
    doesnt mean they wanted to fight you. but genre wars can include derision, dismissal, rather than outright aggression.

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