The TIME Barrier.

luka

luka

Well-known member
where are the big baritone voices of '90s dancehall now? shabba, buju, bounty.
this is just a way of asking what is time. what is change. metamorphosis. most interesting thing there is.
 
Corpsey

Corpsey

bandz ahoy
luka said:
yeah like i said earlier in the thread for those of you who were taking notes and not sitting at the back chewing gum and sexting like corpsey obviously has been
paid in full (1987) sounds far more modern than dont sweat the technique (1992, and may actually have 'walking bass' on it)
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Yes sir but I said mass appeal sir
 
luka

luka

Well-known member
Corpsey said:
Yes sir but I said mass appeal sir
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mass appeal was one of the first rap songs that blew my mind. that loop had some magic thing to it. it could have had it go round and round forever.
let's put it on now!
does it sound very dated? it means too much to me to tell.
 
Corpsey

Corpsey

bandz ahoy
You know what I see what you mean

But that's the thing with this time barrier of yours it obscures previous metals with dust
 
luka

luka

Well-known member

mad to think these people laboured to make this terrible piece of schmaltz just for the sake of a 3 second loop. the only justification for this terrible record.
 
Corpsey

Corpsey

bandz ahoy
Haha that's my heathenish attitude towards jazz or at least used to be

Jazz existed so that rap producers could come along and cut all the fat off it

I hasten to add this isn't necessarily my position anymore even though I struggle with jazz
 
luka

luka

Well-known member
Corpsey said:
Haha that's my heathenish attitude towards jazz or at least used to be

Jazz existed so that rap producers could come along and cut all the fat off it

I hasten to add this isn't necessarily my position anymore even though I struggle with jazz
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yeah but this is in that special bob james category
 
Corpsey

Corpsey

bandz ahoy
80s music generally sounds less dated now than it did do in the 90s. Because it's the thing now, the thing to channel.

Will 90s music, with its breakbeats and jangling guitars and baggy trousers and string sections, sound not dated in some far flung future? Not arf
 
padraig (u.s.)

padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
Corpsey said:
Jazz existed so that rap producers could come along and cut all the fat off it
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I think is a more correct attitude for jazz-rock, fusion + (possibly to a lesser extent) jazz-funk, than jazz proper.

I always think of A-Plus magically flipping Billy Cobham into "'93 Til Infinity". I'm sure there are many other Premier, Pete Rock, etc examples as well.

tbh I think jazz proper rap is usually pretty bad, too reverential maybe. plus most (to me) interesting jazz is less sample-friendly I think, all the free stuff.
 
padraig (u.s.)

padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
luka said:
obviously the wrong/least interesting answer is 'its just fashion'
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the more complex, possibly less wrong/uninteresting way is to say that music reflects its contemporary situation

actually I was thinking about this + I have a notion that is the ultimate reason why later remakes, especially of highly revered scenes/sounds - jungle, 80s hardcore, golden age rap - can never capture the original spirit. you can very studiously recreate the various sonic ingredients but you can't capture the essence which was of its time, also the original wasn't studied in the same way. like now when anyone makes a rap or hardcore record there is a huge dead weight of history behind it, whether they know it or not. that's also what I was trying to say about The Chronic and the moment rap becomes truly self-referential. idk I'm not saying this very well. also it's an idea that people have brought up before, blissblogger kpunk etc, I'm p sure in relation to nuum things.
 
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luka

luka

Well-known member
padraig (u.s.) said:
the more complex, possibly less wrong/uninteresting way is to say that music reflects its contemporary situation

actually I was thinking about this + I have a notion that is the ultimate reason why later remakes, especially of highly revered scenes/sounds - jungle, 80s hardcore, golden age rap - can never capture the original spirit. you can very studiously recreate the various sonic ingredients but you can't capture the essence which was of its time. minimal boom bap, global hardcore punk diaspora, these things reflect not just available technologies, musical evolutions, but an 80s zeitgeist. I'm not saying this very well. also it's an idea that people have brought up before, blissblogger kpunk etc, I'm p sure in relation to nuum things.
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well yeah exactly. everything is interconnected and moves as part of the same time-current. and tracing that wave (and its countercurrents, eddies and stagnations) is a huge part of being a music fan. using music as a lens to view time and its metamorphoses.
 
Corpsey

Corpsey

bandz ahoy
I'd like to play someone who didn't know anything about music a jungle track from 94 and a rebore jungle track from 2018 and see how they drew the distinction. Surely there would be one? Perhaps as simple (and boring) as the difference in engineering. But would they perceive this lack of spirit that we perceive, knowing the track in 2018 is nothing more than a Frankenstein's monster of living things from the 90s?
 
Corpsey

Corpsey

bandz ahoy
And if they didn't notice and didn't know wouldn't it be somehow unethical to not tell them which was the more original? You can't take that away from the pioneers.

Like according the same respect to a fake Picasso as an original.

Here I think I'm moving off topic, but maybe there's something to be said for only being able to use certain creative ideas once in history without mannerism infecting your attempt
 
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