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Thread: Structural conservatism in post-ardkore dance music

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by luka View Post
    1999 There was a moron pavlovian aspect in d&b completely absent from house& garage
    Ironically of course 2step was the injection of the house back into the post-96 dnb beat. like i used to dismiss you slating dark garage but i can kind of see your point now, it is basically dnb for grown ups. Of course I'm not disowning it I just acknowledge that as a fair criticism. the real rhythmic ingenuity is in the little synth/organ licks, the vocal science and crucially the MC. But ultimately that is why dubstep failed for the most part around 2010, people said it became too dnb, but it didn't. it was far too faithful to UK garage but increasingly expunged the garage house.

    Thinking about how I always said ukg owes far more to house than it does garage and there was a tim finny post i stumbled on a couple of minutes ago on here and it was making a similar point to me. Like, el b, if he made stone cold at 170 bpm, it would sound like a 2step dnb track, it wouldn't sound like a multiple layered breakbeat thing from 94. this always seems to get missed in these sorts of discussions.

    On that same thread blackdown was talking about how dubstep was more sonically diverse than dnb for a while and i tend to agree but the central driver of keeping interest in dance music is the rhythmic aspect. of course UKG had many aditional elements to intersect with the beat.
    Last edited by thirdform; 03-05-2019 at 05:43 AM.

  2. #32
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    Listen at 1.25 speed and you'll see what i mean. it even sounds like jazz n bass, much to the consternation of bliss I'm sure...


  3. #33
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    whereas if you listen to this at 0.7 speed you can see that there are far more rhythmic disjunctures. it's gangsta bebop.

    Garage was roy ayers whereas jungle was art blakey.


  4. #34
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    in jungle there is not the jittery tension of gak or whizz. it's much more militant. people say you couldn't do garys at garage rave but that's tosh, it's way easier to do garys at garage rave whereas at jungle rave it's much better to drink and maybe get zooted. totally different type of kinesthetic responses are engendered in the body. with garage it's like this wanker is gonna do me in because i ruined his shoes.

    With jungle it's like this is one man you don't wanna fuck with even outside the rave. probably why i gravitate to jungle more. I'm irrascibly bad tempered. again listen to this beat at 0.75 speed. you'll see what I mean. there was definitely something non-dance in the air back then. whereas UKG for all its amazingness had regressed back to a pretty standard grinding sexy aesthetic. again not a value judgment, give me UKG any time over most post-98 dnb.

    Last edited by thirdform; 03-05-2019 at 06:32 AM.

  5. #35
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    Like listen to this at 1.25 speed, when people are like nah nah nah dubstep isn't slowed down dnb, play this in a half time leaning set and you won't know the difference.


  6. #36
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    like the discontinuity for a junglist here isn't rhythmic simplicity, it's just that what is being done is alternating a loop per bar with the accompanying 170 bpm speed. so it just rushes by. but slow it down and it actually sounds a lot more varied than a lot of the dubstep techno hybrids or whatever. but yeah cracking tune.



    Whereas if you listen to a paradox tune he's chopping the break within the bar, how a real drummer would drum it. so the antihuman discourse is a lot more complicated than a lot of people frame it. it's more like, militarising discipline through the machine.
    Last edited by thirdform; 03-05-2019 at 06:31 AM.

  7. #37

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    pretty standard grinding sexy aesthetic.
    What's wrong with being sexy?

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by craner View Post
    What's wrong with being sexy?
    nothing's wrong with at all. one might even say it was needed after 97 dnb.

    The best jungle however was more gangstadelic than sexy proper.


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