josef k

droid

droid

Well-known member
It's a good format for a short story.

Fascinating to see the tawdry details of awful online interactions examined like this. Like forensic scientists scraping dried vomit from the kitchen tiles the morning after a party.
 
IdleRich

IdleRich

IdleRich
This part seems important

I have no evidence for that. It is not more inherently probable that all of this material and
these outcomes can be attributed to someone reading Mr Turner’s tweets and being
influenced by them than that, for example, they read someone else’s opinions, or Mr
Miller’s and Ms Power’s own opinions, or that they formed their views independently by
judging the Claimants on the basis of their real-world activities in controversial contexts.
Mr Turner’s tweets drew attention to, and were comments on, Mr Miller’s and Ms Power’s
own comments, actions and associations, and all of those had public lives of their own.
Click to expand...

I read that as saying something like; people may indeed have formed the derogatory opinions of NP & DCM that they complain about, and it could be cos of what LT said, but it could equally be cos of what other people said, or in fact cos of what they said themselves and how they acted.
 
IdleRich

IdleRich

IdleRich
yyaldrin said:
such a big waste of time money and energy for everybody involved
Click to expand...

I've just come out of a meeting with a lawyer... but reading this kind of stuff really reinforces how the last thing you wanna do is go to court. Only the lawyers benefit.

Can anyone breakdown what happened here? If LT won does he gain anything? Who pays his fees? And the other party, if they lost I guess they gotta pay their fees minimum, but what else?
 
IdleRich

IdleRich

IdleRich
Actually what I said above wasn't quite right, in fact they sued him for defamation and he counter-sued for harassment and both claims were dismissed... so, in a very real sense, they all lost.

I thought that someone said earlier that he won and they lost but I guess I completely imagined that for some reason. Apologies to anyone that I misinformed.

Edit: it was cos of this I guess

john eden said:
And indeed https://luketurner.com/victory-in-high-court-libel-case-against-nina-power-and-daniel-dc-miller
Click to expand...

I think that I naively assumed that a headline saying "Luke Turner victory in high court libel case against Nina Power and Daniel Miller" meant that Luke Turner had just had a victory in a libel case over Nina Power and Daniel Miller. Possibly in the high court.

I suppose it's talking about how he won the libel one and simply doesn't mention the one he lost, but it tricked me into thinking he'd had a dominant total victory when in fact it looks more like a one all draw.
 
Sectionfive

Sectionfive

bandwagon house
Power was years, years!, writing about law and order, state violence, public order etc, etc ..and then sets the courts on her political enemies.

A true hack.
 
droid

droid

Well-known member
IdleRich said:
Actually what I said above wasn't quite right, in fact they sued him for defamation and he counter-sued for harassment and both claims were dismissed... so, in a very real sense, they all lost.

I thought that someone said earlier that he won and they lost but I guess I completely imagined that for some reason. Apologies to anyone that I misinformed.

Edit: it was cos of this I guess



I think that I naively assumed that a headline saying "Luke Turner victory in high court libel case against Nina Power and Daniel Miller" meant that Luke Turner had just had a victory in a libel case over Nina Power and Daniel Miller. Possibly in the high court.

I suppose it's talking about how he won the libel one and simply doesn't mention the one he lost, but it tricked me into thinking he'd had a dominant total victory when in fact it looks more like a one all draw.
Click to expand...

Oh, I think it's fair to say that he was vindicated. It was DM and NP that initiated proceedings and he counter sued.
 
IdleRich

IdleRich

IdleRich
Yeah I've read it now. So looks like they instigated it all, made a twitter spat into a legal one, wasted everyone's time and money - and achieved nothing as their main point was rejected utterly. So they totally failed.

But I feel like the headline was still misleading, to the extent that it makes it look as though he's trying to deceive.

Maybe you know though, what happens in the end? Will he have to pay a huge legal fee for defending himself? Will the other two be punished or censured in any way for bringing what looks like a pretty spurious suit?
 
droid

droid

Well-known member
I didnt see anything about fees in the judgement, so I assume no award was made and they each have to pay their own fees, although sometimes the decision is made after the ruling.
 
IdleRich

IdleRich

IdleRich
droid said:
Well. Id say they're glad now they brought this to court.
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I'm sure that they must have regretted it about ten seconds after they grasped that they were unable to get off the nightmarish roller-coaster they had set in motion.

I think that it was an obvious mistake cos

a) Taking someone to court is almost always a mistake
b) Escalating any twitter argument into a legal one seems extraordinarily petty and crazy looked at in the cold light of day. In other words an even worse mistake
c) Worst of all when you read all the tweets THEY look like the aggressors and like bullies. It seems mad that they are the ones bringing the action.

Of course all that is very easy to say with hindsight and from a distance.

Have the plaintiffs responded at all to the ruling? No appeal I'm guessing.
 
IdleRich

IdleRich

IdleRich
droid said:
I didnt see anything about fees in the judgement, so I assume no award was made and they each have to pay their own fees, although sometimes the decision is made after the ruling.
Click to expand...
I've no dog in the fight but... someone sues you and you win and are innocent of the charge - and your prize is paying four years of legal fees... to Mishcon de Reya(!) in this instance which I guess was his choice, but whoever it was the principle would be the same.

What would have been the penalty for losing? Ok he saved his reputation but I can't imagine that financially he'd have fared much worse if he'd just caved.

The whole story is fucking mad
 
droid

droid

Well-known member
Yep. It's very difficult to fight a court case unless you are rich, and conversely its very easy to destroy someone's life with the law if you're wealthy.

"Written laws are like spiders' webs; they will catch, it is true, the weak and poor, but would be torn in pieces by the rich and powerful."
 
IdleRich

IdleRich

IdleRich
droid said:
Yep. It's very difficult to fight a court case unless you are rich, and conversely its very easy to destroy someone's life with the law if you're wealthy.

"Written laws are like spiders' webs; they will catch, it is true, the weak and poor, but would be torn in pieces by the rich and powerful."
Click to expand...
It's another one of those things which I know full well in my head, with my brain, but it takes something like this to make me understand it with my gut. Basically there is no upside to defending yourself in this situation.
 
IdleRich

IdleRich

IdleRich
It's amazing that after court cases both sides always declare victory. Here it took them several weeks to try and glean some tiny crumb that they could spin as mildly positive in an avalanche of negatives. Embarrassing really, they should have just admitted that it was a colossal waste of time and money.
 
Mr. Tea

Mr. Tea

Let's Talk About Ceps
Because we failed in our libel claim, we have been ordered to pay a percentage of more than one million pounds that Turner’s father spent on his legal fees. We argued that each party should pay their own costs, but Turner rejected this and the court ruled in his favour. We will now declare bankruptcy.
Click to expand...

I haven't followed this case, since I don't know anyone involved (beyond the fact that one of them is the original 'goblin nonce'), but am I correct in thinking that this is basically a Twitter spat that got out of hand and ended up costing some idiots a million quid in legal fees?

I'm starting to feel like studying physics was a total waste of time. I should have studied law and made bank off people like this.
 
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