Beyond Soul.

pattycakes_ said:

Sometimes I think all third needs is a hug

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luka said:

I don't think there's ever any going back. The rennasaince looked to clasical pagan civilization but it didn't replicate it. You can only ever move forward into time. Beyond soul. It's over.

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thirdform said:

Fuck off.

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pattycakes_ said:

You're comparing the work of one man to scriptures and thought which took millenia to develop. But yes, when listening to him, especially live, my heart opened a bit more and compassion for my fellow man expanded. Do you not also feel that when listening to the creator has a masterplan?

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thirdform said:

No. I'm not white.

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luka said:

Musicians training for 50 years under a guru in a cave before they're allowed to play a single note on their chosen instrument. Deep devotion and self sacrifice. It's not coming back.

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thirdform said:

on the corner and black beauty > thembi and black unity. tthat's incontrovertible fact.

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pattycakes_ said:

This still happens. Just way outside of our western hubble. Unfortunately, the products of which usually get snapped up to play for royal families and such. But there is still that level of dedication. Also in the gospel church you can find a less formal but no less dedicated approach to finding of hitting the same spot through music.

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thirdform said:

you're havin a right laugh mate.

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In the mid 19th century, starting with Ârif and Şevki Bey and continuing to the composers to follow, the taste in lyrics slowly began to decline. Although Zekâi Dede, Tanbûri Ali Efendi, Rahmi Bey and S. Ziya Bey tried to maintain it at some cultural level, they were unable to prevent the singing of pathological emotions that began with Selâhaddin Pınar, appealed to the customers of the alcohol-serving nightclubs. On the subject of the public’s education, TRT which, with the exception of one branch director, never worried about this, worked with all their might to destroy taste in language before that of music. Here then, for you, is a song, music and lyrics by Sait Ergenç, and broadcast constantly sung by M. Milli, that should serve as a lesson: “Nikâhsız Aşk” (Unmarried Love).
Ne nikâh bağlar bizi, ne mahkeme ayırır,
Düşmanların şerrinden bizi Mevlâm kayırır.
Nikâhsız diyorlar, desinler,
Günahtır diyorlar, desinler,
Adam sen de, ne derlerse desinler.
Günah bizim, sevap bizim,
Varsın çatlasın eller!
No wedding ties us, and no court separates us,
God protects from the evil of our enemies
“Unmarried,” they say; let them say it
“It’s a sin,” they say; let them say it
Forget them, let them say what they will
The sin is ours, and the good deed as well
And to hell with the rest of them!
And of course it led onto today’s disgusting picture: from Lord İbrahim (Tatlıses), who said “Kul oldum bir cefâkâre, cihan bağında gülfemdir” (I fell slave to a tormentor, she’s my rose in the garden of the world,) the fall to “Kıl oldum abi” (I’ve gone nuts, bro).
Is this hideous loss of culture an issue only in the music on the radio and TV, cassettes and nightclubs? Don’t you hear the degeneration in the mouths of the muezzins, those who, five times a day chant the ezan [call to prayer] in a tastelessly affected Arabic accent? As this people loses its security and consciousness (that is, its identity), just as secular music imitates the West, religious music is becoming an imitation of the Arabs. However if Arabic music had something to offer us, would they have sent for teachers from us every in every country in which they opened a conservatory? As in the case of honest musicians like M. Kâmil el-Hulâyî, the writer of the book “Kitâbu Mûsikî eş-Şarkî,” would they refer to us in their books as “esâtizetune’l-etrâk” (Our maestros the Turks)? But after the West, learning nothing from Jesus, used the wisdom of the east and enriched itself by colonizing others, became accomplished at selling those of other religions and debasing them in the name of God. This loathsome game has been well-documented in the works of 5. Ayverdi, as well as C. Meriç, T. Süreyya Sırma and M. Doğan.
Let us move onto another subject. The Turks have been praised throughout history for the beauty they have produced (illumination, calligraphy, ornamentation, ebru, engraving, carpet weaving). Architecture is created in stone, but who was it that nourished, protected and elevated their music, built with sound?
First was the Mehterhâne: since the time of the Huns, the military music school and band, whose objective was to use the booming sound of their foreign and terrifying music, audible three days’ journey distant, to attack the morale of the enemy, destroy his will to fight and thus avoid the spilling of blood by war.
Next was the Enderûn: the musical department of the Palace university which, regardless of language, religion, or race, took talented youths coming from all parts of the empire and trained them.
After this was the Mevlevîhâne: a network of music and fine arts academies, spread to the remotest corners of the empire, which with the Koran and Mathnawi, and with the ney, kudüm, sema, calligraphy, illumination and ebru, taught the beauty that makes us human; and trained our greatest composers.
Next in line were the guilds of the musical profession, and finally, the private meşkhanes, where which opened in the homes of well-known composers or in public locales, and gave music lessons free of charge to those interested.
The training in the Mehterhâne and the Enderûn of the French spy Aimée de Rivery, cousin of Napoleon’s wife Joséphine, who took the name Nakşidil Sultan in the palace, was covered by Sultan Mahmud II. The Mevlevihânes, along with the other Sufi lodges, were locked in 1923. In the first official school of theatre and music, founded in 1914, education in Turkish music was abolished in 1926 by a dispatch from Musa Süreyya, son of composer Giriftzen Âsım Bey. Later, in 1934, broadcast of Turkish music on the Radio was abolished by order of Minister of Domestic Affairs Şükrü Kaya. In this way, as we cut all the arteries feeding it with our own hand, our music inevitably headed towards its demise. Unable to listen to their own music on their own radio station, the Turkish people, pleading when going to buy a radio, “Give me a radio but please let it not play Necip Celâl!, turned in desperation to “Sawti’l-Arab mine’l Qahire (Voice of Arabia from Cairo); learned what wavelength Tehran and New Delhi radio was on. And so with Raj Kapoor’s tune “Âvârâmu, nâ-naranam...” the musical which launched, if not the first “Arabesk,” then the first “Hindesk,” became famous. After the mid-50s, as you well know, oudist Suat Sayın and other performers of Arabesk began their journey to the present day, and now make your hair stand on end with their “Kıl Oldum Abi.”
It is a well known fact that nature does not destroy its own: It does not pollute its water, it does not burn its forests, it does not kill its animals, it doesn’t up and uproot a centuries-old plane tree. But mankind? Hostage to endless greed, hate and selfishness, man uses fire and weapons to destroy, burn and kill. A grand plane tree, the work of centuries; his music, a monument to enlightenment, breeding, light, and — under the pretext of opening a road — demolishes it with the bulldozer of Western apery. A road? To where? Where will it lead, to unenlightenment, darkness and ill-breeding... To what end? To make a monkey of men, who for thousands of years has lived, not only as men, but as “gentlemen.” A monkey, who has sold his consciousness to a West he desires to imitate. That West which was actually an admirer, even imitator of his civilization before it was destroyed. When the great composer Beethovan proudly wrote at the head of some of his pieces, alla turca, that is, “in the style of Turkish military music,” was he not experiencing the hope and trepidation that he might, in some small measure, approach the magnificence of our Mehter bands?

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