luka

Well-known member
I mean, I'm not a materialist of any description. Serialist music is already algorithmic to a limited degree as third pointed out earlier in the thread, tbh i dont think that's the future we're advancing towards but who knows. First you have self-service registers in the supermarket, next thing you know a robot is singing you lullabies.
 

luka

Well-known member
I also think, with third, that meaning is not so much inherent in the artifact as imbued with it by us... Although it's not totally straightforward or clear cut. It's similar to the magical exercise, treat every event during your day as a message from beyond.
 

luka

Well-known member
Well this is what I've been trying to say all along. the cellular commodity and not the commodity i am typing on.

What is? I didn't understand padriags point. I thought he'd get wound up if I pressed him so I ignored it. What is your cellular commodity? What is going on here?
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
What is? I didn't understand padriags point. I thought he'd get wound up if I pressed him so I ignored it. What is your cellular commodity? What is going on here?

Capitalism is a society where the abstract logic of the commodity prevails. there is hardly production for self-subsistance. We aren't robbed like we are in feudalism or small scale peasant production. We are robbed and then we have to buy back a portion of the consumption product that whos value was already robbed from us. it's a double rip off. In feudalism you had to produce x amount for the lord and could retain x amount or x amount was available for your subsistance. under capitalism you own nothing. No matter how hard you work, you're never going to be able to own what you produce, unless you manage to become a capitalist, and even then you are only a personification of an economic category and most of the functions once carried out by the free marketeers are now designated to salaried professionals by the state.
 
Last edited:

luka

Well-known member
Capitalism is a society where the abstract logic of the commodity prevails. there is hardly production for self-subsistance. We aren't robbed like we are in feudalism or small scale peasant production. We are robbed and then we have to buy back a portion of the consumption product that whos value was already robbed from us. it's a double rip off. In feudalism you had to produce x amount for the lord and could retain x amount or x amount was available for your subsistance. under capitalism you own nothing.

What's this relate to? What's it in reference to?
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
that art is a commodity. We have to buy back the culture we create. which makes identity politics doubly funny. here's a quote from Gilroy's book.

Today's ubiquitous conflicts between warring constituencies that claim incompatible
and exclusive identities suggest that these large-scale theatrical
techniques for producing and stabilizing identity and soliciting national,
"racial," or ethnic identification have been widely taken up. The reduction
of identity to the uncomplicated, militarized, fraternal versions of pure
sameness pioneered by fascism and Nazism in the 1930s is now routine,
particularly where the forces of nationalism, "tribalism," and ethnic division
are at work. Identity is thus revealed as a critical element in the distinctive
vocabulary used to voice the geopolitical dilemmas of the late
modern age. Where the power of absolute identity is summoned up, it is
often to account for situations in which the actions of individuals and
groups are being reduced to little more than the functioning of some overarching
presocial mechanism. In the past, this machinery was often understood
as a historical or economic process that defined the special, manifest
destiny of the group in question. These days, it is more likely to be represented
as a prepolitical, sociobiological, or biocultural feature, something
mysterious and genetic that sanctions especially harsh varieties of deterministic
thinking.
 

luka

Well-known member
I must be getting tired cos this doesn't make any sense to me. Or rather doesn't seem to have any bearing on the conversation. I'll try again in the morning.
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
Am a bit wary of equating fascism with straight militarisation though which this book sometimes tend to do. Whatever you want to say about Marcus Garvey, calling him a fascist or fascist adjacent is a big stretch.

More rather I stick to the creedo: the fascists lost, but *fascism* as a specific form of corporatist strong state organisation was victorious.
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
been a bit distracted these last couple of days. tbf i don't really have much more to contribute at the moment.
 

luka

Well-known member
I don't think music is over. Interesting things keep happening. Cultures emerge, are coopted and neutered. New ones emerge in their place. It seems to be getting more difficult, more tenuous, in the same way that it is more and more difficult to survive as a sole trader on the high street say, but it's by no means over.

I was going to start a thread a while back called Miserabilism and the Mark Fisher problem because there has been a marked tendency for people to turn their depressive mentation into a politics and a philosophy. To project their own impotence outwards. I think this is a catastrophic mistake.
 

sadmanbarty

Well-known member
I was going to start a thread a while back called Miserabilism and the Mark Fisher problem because there has been a marked tendency for people to turn their depressive mentation into a politics and a philosophy. To project their own impotence outwards. I think this is a catastrophic mistake.

I’ve tried my best to be the antidote to this
 

luka

Well-known member
Appreciate it! Can't have everyone trying to pretend a technicolor world is grayscale.
 

sadmanbarty

Well-known member
Appreciate it! Can't have everyone trying to pretend a technicolor world is grayscale.

There’s a brilliant thread about how the 21st century has introduced a whole new paradigm of what the future is that is love for you to partake in
 
Top