Page 1 of 21 12311 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 311

Thread: Culture As Advertising.

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    22,424

    Default Culture As Advertising.

    I've been meaning to start a thread on commodified London, a glossy repackaged version of London street culture with the poverty and desperation airbrushed out. A Shoreditch box park vision of creatives in box fresh Nike Airs, smiling, multiracial, good looking and cool exemplified in my mind by an addidas advert that was inescapable on youtube a few months back and soundtracked by Ms Banks-Chat to Mi Gyal.

    This is that thread but with a broader remit, inspired by corpsey saying in the Marvel movies thread

    "“Today what we are experiencing is the absorption of all virtual modes of expression into that of advertising. Advertising effaces any support and any depth, signifying a reabsorption of everything into the surface and plunges us into this stupified, hyperreal euphoria that we could not exchange for anything else.”

    This process was what Barti was getting at in the Jamaica is Dun Out Here thread. The conversion of the island into a Lilt advert.

    One reason I like YouTube is that unlike spotify you can still find things which are not a corporate product and lifestyle advertisement. Street music which is not an audition for radio one xtra. Etc etc.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    22,424

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    8,607

    Default

    Sidenote post: Not denying your claims but you can find a lot of music on Spotify which isn't going to be played on mainstream radio. There's loads of drill on Spotify, for example. But I do take your point re: Youtube. There almost certainly aren't the weird depths on Spotify that you get on Youtube.

    I was wondering last night if there has been a YouTube style service for audio rather than video. One which can get around copyright claims by making the content user-platformed.

    YouTube strikes quite a good balance atm between user-uploaded stuff and 'official' corporately mandated stuff.

    I don't support artists are making money off Spotify OR Youtube, so perhaps the only difference is a question of what is 'allowed' on there.

    While obviously there was a lot of radical rap music back in its early days (and not relegated to the fringes, as it is now), there seems to me to have been something inherently capitalistic about rap music from the start ('the hustle') which made it easy to co-opt and exploit in this way. Rappers can be pseudo-drug-dealing, pseudo-sociopathic, gun-toting, tattooed, philandering and police-hating - and still not be remotely scary to the mainstream, because they love flash cars, designer clothes, all sorts of commodities, capitalism itself.
    Last edited by Corpsey; 25-04-2019 at 10:21 AM.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    22,424

    Default

    A lot of our threads have been about music's collapse into the postmodernist paradigm having been, right up until very recently, the last real bastion of modernism proper. One of the fascinating things about postmodernism is that it seems to describe perfectly the effects of the Internet despite preceding it by quite some time.

    Rinse fm pop. Pastiche pop in general. These are eminently post modern phenomena.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    8,886

    Default

    And the advertisers are getting even more savvy, with red bull music academy being take seriously rather than just as a corporate tie-in, Nike and Colin Kapernick, that Adidas Peckham thing in the ad. Establishing themselves as just another organic part of the environment that has always been there, rather than an invasive virus. Living inside the mind of Diplo.

  6. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to baboon2004 For This Useful Post:


  7. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    22,424

    Default

    The last time I tried to discuss this I got shot down by Padraig who said culture has never been anything but advertising and the underground has never existed. It's a serious argument and I appreciate that it may be impossible to make a clear demarcation here.

    Corpse makes the same point when he says uk drill is on spotify (and has corporate sponsorship and, I presume, record company dark money in some cases)

    I'm sticking to my guns however.

  8. #7
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    8,886

    Default



    surely there used to be a lag period between culture emerging and being coopted. obviously it was always the case that when marketeers find out about something, they coopt the shit out of it, but there's now no breathing space. i'm curious about the argument that grime, say, was merely advertising in 2002/3
    Last edited by baboon2004; 25-04-2019 at 10:47 AM.

  9. The Following User Says Thank You to baboon2004 For This Useful Post:


  10. #8
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    8,607

    Default

    I don't think music has to be advertising, by any means. I think the sort of 'street' culture you're talking about tends to be (even if only modestly) capitalistic, in the sense that people want to make music and be paid for it (if only in order to be able to make more music).

    I was reading Ballard's introduction to 'The Doors of Experience' the other day and he talks about how the entertainment/media has 'engirdled' the earth, so that the only way to escape fiction is to pursue/plumb the inner depths. I only bring that up because I think people growing up today are more completely engirdled and enveloped by advertising, due to the internet and smartphones in particular. More and more of our lifestyles are 'owed' to capitalism. Even as it drives us mad (the depression spike since smartphones, e.g.) we feel increasingly dependent on and defensive of it. And also capitalism has evolved to appear 'value-driven' - if a corporation is publically liberal that's enough for it to escape censure. What I'm getting at here is that kids who are raised today are less likely than even I was to think Nike is bad.

    Anyway I'm gonna stop musing half-bakedly cos I really understand fuck all about capitalism compared to a lot of people on here.

  11. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Corpsey For This Useful Post:


  12. #9
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    22,424

    Default

    I don't think street music is the only outside (to the extent to which an outside is possible) Two other habitual moves are to look 'outside the western box" as Charles Olson put it (and as Patty was advocating recently) or towards the experimental and academic.

  13. #10
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    22,424

    Default

    Also corpse there's no one here, least of all me, with the slightest inkling of what capitalism is. We are all utterly in the dark. It's just a name we give to our historical situation.

  14. #11
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    London
    Posts
    5,079

    Default

    this came up as one of those 10 second adverts before youtube videos the other day and i really thought it was an advert for coke.



    watching it now, it does look an awful lot like product placement.
    Quote Originally Posted by vimothy View Post
    I respect islamists

  15. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to sadmanbarty For This Useful Post:


  16. #12
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Location
    London
    Posts
    5,079

    Default

    this thread relates to two of brilliant, yet neglected threads:

    http://www.dissensus.com/showthread.php?t=14405

    http://www.dissensus.com/showthread.php?t=14403
    Quote Originally Posted by vimothy View Post
    I respect islamists

  17. #13
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    8,886

    Default

    presidency as product placement

    Rosner-Fast-Food-Trump.jpg

  18. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to baboon2004 For This Useful Post:


  19. #14
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Posts
    22,424

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by baboon2004 View Post


    surely there used to be a lag period between culture emerging and being coopted. obviously it was always the case that when marketeers find out about something, they coopt the shit out of it, but there's now no breathing space. i'm curious about the argument that grime, say, was merely advertising in 2002/3
    Padraig makes this argument more than once, most recently on the 'New Stuff' thread... around page three I think. ...

  20. #15
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    8,607

    Default

    What are things that advertising cannot be -

    for example, in the "PC" era, if a song is offensive to a minority group, it can't be used to advertising, other than for a fringe ideology perhaps?

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •