Is a counterculture still possible?
- Thread starter padraig (u.s.)
- Start date
entertainment
Well-known member
Counterculture is defined by what it stands in opposition to. Last time there was a veritable counterculture movement, the culture that it countered was much more unified. When now, pop culture is so heterodox, so fragmented, it's difficult to consolidate such a thing now. The word and its definition is increasingly incompatible with today's reality.
padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
yes/no
counterculture, and culture proper, aren't necessarily synonymous with nor subsumed by popular culture
if you've ever read The Republic, you'll have comes across the part where Plato has Socrates go on at exhaustive length about the education of the city's guardians
he's obsessed with their indoctrination from the earliest possible age - the kind of stories they'll be allowed to hear, type of training they'll receive in "music + poetry"
he's talking about the creation, transmission, and control of culture, to him the most important foundational building block in constructing an imaginary ideal state
the power of culture, culture as power, culture is power (something something Foucault something)
padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
if you're thinking only in terms of popular culture, yes, it's vastly more heterodox and any remaining monoculture correspondingly diminished
but even the canonical 60s counterculture wasn't merely about music, psychedelic posters, whatever
politics, drugs, life
tune in turn on drop out, whatever one may think of its efficacy (or Leary) isn't about popular culture
it's imagining an alternative way of existing (again, leaving aside any judgments about practicality etc)
but even the canonical 60s counterculture wasn't merely about music, psychedelic posters, whatever
politics, drugs, life
tune in turn on drop out, whatever one may think of its efficacy (or Leary) isn't about popular culture
it's imagining an alternative way of existing (again, leaving aside any judgments about practicality etc)
padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
as long as humans exist there will be culture of some kind, and necessarily something in opposition to it, I guess
my original post was really more about imagination than anything else
it's a pretty common theme of mine that we've talked about in a few threads (dematerialization etc)
a counterculture exists in the breathing space between that which it opposes and repression and/or recuperation
we live in a time in which the efficiency of both is so staggering that it makes it difficult (at least for me, tho seemingly many) to conceive of something that would escape them
facial recognition software + (ever more) viral marketing
my original post was really more about imagination than anything else
it's a pretty common theme of mine that we've talked about in a few threads (dematerialization etc)
a counterculture exists in the breathing space between that which it opposes and repression and/or recuperation
we live in a time in which the efficiency of both is so staggering that it makes it difficult (at least for me, tho seemingly many) to conceive of something that would escape them
facial recognition software + (ever more) viral marketing
padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
a world in which all is known (even when it isn't) has no space for anything else
tbf, I am hugely pessimistic about the future even if we somehow don't get done in by climate change
a nightmare society of proles on UBI ruled over by tech-bro philosopher kings
and/or marketing become synonymous with dreams, complete inescapable
tbf, I am hugely pessimistic about the future even if we somehow don't get done in by climate change
a nightmare society of proles on UBI ruled over by tech-bro philosopher kings
and/or marketing become synonymous with dreams, complete inescapable
padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
so you can say, it's probably more productive to put your energy into making the best of what is
which, alrite
but it's also like: imagine you're on a bus that drives over a cliff, and everyone's solution is to mash the gas pedal down harder
I've felt like that since I was in my teens and was first exposed to things like green anarchism, Ishmael, and so on
(their solutions are terrible/completely unworkable, but the critique was good: they were way ahead of most people on the existential severity of climate change, albeit possibly for the wrong reasons)
so trying to imagine an alternative is also an attempt not to retreat - further, at least - into existential cynicism
it's my own thought experiment
which, alrite
but it's also like: imagine you're on a bus that drives over a cliff, and everyone's solution is to mash the gas pedal down harder
I've felt like that since I was in my teens and was first exposed to things like green anarchism, Ishmael, and so on
(their solutions are terrible/completely unworkable, but the critique was good: they were way ahead of most people on the existential severity of climate change, albeit possibly for the wrong reasons)
so trying to imagine an alternative is also an attempt not to retreat - further, at least - into existential cynicism
it's my own thought experiment
padraig (u.s.)
a monkey that will go ape
tbh idk what this really has to do with dissensus, likely fuck all
these days I mostly just pop up here once in a while to talk about things I don't get to discuss in the course of my actual life
oh btw anyone interested, on the topic of apocalyptic prophets droid emailed me recently, he's just been real busy with actual life too sounds like
these days I mostly just pop up here once in a while to talk about things I don't get to discuss in the course of my actual life
oh btw anyone interested, on the topic of apocalyptic prophets droid emailed me recently, he's just been real busy with actual life too sounds like
luka
Well-known member
Good to hear. Actual life is best avoided but we all succumb from time to time.
chava
Well-known member
There's something there, that's for sure. Hard to get a grip on it. MGTOW, Proud Boys, Traditionalists, Reactionary thought are popping up several places. It's a mess, but some of this has momentum and is definitely anti mainstream culture. When this eventually starts embracing eco/environtalism I honestly don't know what's going to happen.
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
Seems pretty unlikely to me. Of course eco-fascism has been around forever and still exists, but from my understanding, it intersects much more with anti-civ thought and general academic misanthropy (Unabomber etc.) than with the alt-right per se. The modern far right ('alt' or otherwise) is overwhelmingly anti-green, as much because it's another way to oppose progressives, vegetarians/vegans, "hippies" etc. as for any other reason.
(and to pre-empt luka: no, that does not it make it the 'fault' of the green movement, obviously)