Page 3 of 6 FirstFirst 12345 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 45 of 85

Thread: Scritti Politti

  1. #31
    nomadologist Guest

    Default

    Tate, it's perfectly possible to watch/read all those things and disagree.

    Swears, I'm using "MOR" here to mean the things that were originally dubbed MOR. I don't believe in "alternative" at all. I hate most alternative rock. I don't like production values as horrible as I've heard on SP on anything, let alone melodic "pop" songs with very deliberately embedded references to Lacanian psychoanalysis (whats that song about "be my lack"? you don't want to hear what I'd tell someone who asked me to be his "lack". it would involve his physical birthright to the phallic in the symbolic order and a swift kicking motion on my part). Gag.

    MOR refers to a general sonics of washed out, watery, superbubblegum production values, anyway.
    Last edited by nomadologist; 25-01-2007 at 08:07 PM.

  2. #32
    nomadologist Guest

    Default

    I'm surprised you like them, Swears, because they seem to fit squarely into that category of yours entitled music by indie rock wankers that is not entirely accessible but gets heralded by college radio fans who'd never listen to real AM gold or soul or funk as 'pop'

    oh yeah, and lou reed and iggy pop may have been aggressive, but they were both considered "fairies" at the time and had gay sex, so i don't know about "macho"

  3. #33
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Merseyside
    Posts
    3,546

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by nomadologist View Post
    I'm surprised you like them, Swears, because they seem to fit squarely into that category of yours entitled music by indie rock wankers that is not entirely accessible but gets heralded by college radio fans who'd never listen to real AM gold or soul or funk as 'pop'
    "Indie Rock" didn't exist in 1982. A good part of Green Gartside's decision to go pop was based on what he thought was a futile, retro and unimaginative tendency he saw in British guitar music creeping in after post punk, which eventually, by the mid-80s would be known as indie. I'm not too keen on their pre-Songs to Remember work, but I respect it because they were genuinely interested in doing something new, fucking around with the form of a song.
    I see Cupid and Phsyche and Provision as great hi-tech pop albums in the vein of Kraftwerk, Giorgio Moroder, Jam and Lewis, Timbaland, et al. I'm not really fussed about his academic pretentions (I've never studied any continental philosophy, so a lot of the allusions in the lyrics are probably lost in me.), but I think the idea of trying to bring some of these ideas into the mainstream is admirable, in a way. I'd rather listen to someone pretentious than someone playing dumb.
    I think a lot of the appeal for me is the slightly prissy, uptight englishness rubbing up against their black, american electro-funk and soul influences. There's a nice little contrast there. All I can suggest really is listening to Absolute from C&P85, try and revel in the glossiness rather than being turned off by it.

  4. #34
    nomadologist Guest

    Default

    Indie rock DID exist in 1982. It started in Britain and bands like Echo and the Bunnymen were the major players.

    I feel bad for American black people for being cited as influences. The "rapping" is so bad it like hurts my skull in the crevices.

    and I don't know that I'd call Kraftwerk "pop." Moroder was disco, definitely not pop.

  5. #35
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Merseyside
    Posts
    3,546

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by nomadologist View Post
    I feel bad for American black people for being cited as influences. The "rapping" is so bad it like hurts my skull in the crevices.
    Well, I'm sure Chaka Khan, Miles Davis (whom Green was a friend of) Shabba Ranks and Roger Troutman and Mos Def are grateful for your concern, all having worked with Scritti at one time or another. I don't think it purely for the money either, those artists were already pretty well-established by then. I will concede that Green's rapping is crap, but he doesn't do it that often anyway.

  6. #36
    nomadologist Guest

    Default

    must've been one of Miles' darker hours. his agent probably told him to do it for the cash so he could keep doing speedballs

    ps just looked it up and i'd hardly call playing one trumpet solo on one track some sort of wholesale endorsement. thems the biz. jazzists were always doing session work, big deal. miles davis would have done session work for stalin if it paid off his drug debts. mos def seems like the kind of guy who would collab with them
    Last edited by nomadologist; 25-01-2007 at 08:39 PM.

  7. #37

    Default

    I like it
    I don't like it
    I like it
    I don't like it

    oh is that the time?

    nomadologist doesn't like it and swears does but most of the attacks being made are nonsense

    nonsense to say echo & the bunnymen were indie, they were on warner brothers and were often in the pop charts.
    kraftwerk were number 1 in 1981 in the POP charts.
    giorgio moroder made plenty of pop records, and disco was pop anyway in the wake of saturday night fever etc etc.
    you can argue the details but the spirit of what swears said is right.

    scritti's intellectual pretensions are annoying and most of their music is poor IMO but what's the point of this slanging match?
    *****minor 80s pop band not all that good shocker.....***** so?

    i quite like wood beez and the one with roger from zapp.
    so what?

    why not just say you don't like it and keep the hate to yourself?

    how about a thread telling us all about something you think is great that we might not know about instead of sniping at easy target?

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Posts
    26

    Default

    K-Punk and Marcello on the early Scritti. Also an n in depth interview with Green going into his background.

  9. #39
    nomadologist Guest

    Default

    ever heard of British Indie? Rough Trade records anyone? echo and the bunnymen fit in sonically maybe not literally as released on an "indie" label
    Last edited by nomadologist; 25-01-2007 at 09:05 PM.

  10. #40
    nomadologist Guest

    Default

    and I didn't start any threads about Scritti Politti. why not just tell me about something you hate and keep the love to yourself? i don't particularly care for gushing. uncritical praise is boring, completely bashing is boring. i like to hear reasons why people hate something as much as i do why they love it. and the interstices are the best part. (mostly i'm just bored at work. but it's 5PM so i'm done)

    when i'm talking about "pop" i'm talking about songcraft
    Last edited by nomadologist; 25-01-2007 at 09:07 PM.

  11. #41

    Default

    Nomad, i wasn't bashing you for starting the thread, I know you didn't.

    Your definitions of pop and indie are fine. Mine are "pop=popular" and "indie=non mainstream independent rock." If Bunnymen were indie then so were U2......
    I just got into that because I felt you were contradicting Swears willy nilly just cos you disagree with him about SP.

    anyway work'll be over soon, have a nice evening :-)
    I am only writing this cos I am trying not to worry about my mum who is not very well.......

    about love/hate:
    I come here in the hope that I will hear about something good that I didn't know about, this thread is just a bit depressing. I suppose it was meant to start a discussion or something.

    But why don't you do a thread telling me about something great? You don't have to gush, you can be balanced in your praise.

  12. #42
    Join Date
    Jul 2006
    Location
    Merseyside
    Posts
    3,546

    Default

    I don't think this is a slanging match, in a way I suppose I'm trying to convince Nomadologist rather than show her up to be an idiot or something. (Which would be hard because she's clearly better educated than me)

    Anyway on the subject of indie, you had independent labels obviously. Chess was an independent, but you wouldn't call the music released on it "indie music" it was RnB. I don't think the term indie to describe a genre of music was around until '85-'86.
    You might have had predecessors to that style like Orange Juice, in the same way Kraftwerk were predecessors of techno, but my main arguement is that Scritti were a post-punk band when they started out and that the idea of indie as we've known it since the mid-eighties wouldn't have entered their heads.

  13. #43
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    THE YABBA
    Posts
    5,704

    Default

    My bad. I was aware that my original post and subsequent ones yesterday may have been a bit vociferous, you'll excuse me for that I hope, I had at that time been up for 56 hours non-stop watching my sister die of oesophageal cancer, ( true ) and my disgust at life probably came out at Scritti Politti.

    Which, I would hasten to add, is Reason One for them to exist.

    I would, however Edward, refer you to my original statement in the post, which was 'that anyone in possession of their records should be shot', which you will note is a reference to their fans and not the artists themselves. I have been slyly aware of some bloggers / journalists of some worthy note bending over backwards to incorporate Green's work into an alternative cannon, and merely sought to enquire why this should be so as I hold their work to be dishonest. ( thanks for the links alexsy )

    I find this dishonesty in Green's desire to be taken seriously - the big fish in a little pond syndrome - within the pop music cannon; his neoist drive to work with anyone fashionable at the given time - as swears has duly pointed out; and within his current propagators. I've never seen Green as interesting - although I do wish his work had won the Mercury Prize - and can find many, many more examples of work that is interesting, as you'll find in my numerous posts on this forum especially during the past six weeks when it's been one of my sole points of solace as I watched my sister die, for which I am grateful to you all.

    But you can solipsistically read theories into anything, and I've always found the hyperbole around Green's work to be lazy in the extreme. I would refer anyone to the musical works of Leroy Hutson and The Natural Four, Willie Hutch and Discharge for works that I would prefer theorists to read into rather than falling upon the rather insipid whoring that I find within the collected works of Scritti Politti.

    Having said all that, and I refer to one of my early posts, 'Confidence' is a truly great pop moment, and I occasionally hum it while murdering other such populist sacred cows.

  14. #44
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Location
    Toronto
    Posts
    532

    Default

    very sorry to hear about your sister. My condolences.

  15. #45
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    THE YABBA
    Posts
    5,704

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by shudder View Post
    very sorry to hear about your sister. My condolences.
    Thanks! I'm aware of the weirdness of mentioning it, but also aware that I bummed people out so thought I should explain a little. I hope it doesn't come across as liberal apologies though, I stand by what I said

    Oh, and Scritti Politti also begat Tricky I guess, so maybe Green shouldn't be erased completely when I get my time machine(s).

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •