Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
I'd say it's more a case that that's what the Daily Mail brigade wanted us all to believe, BLAIR'S BINGE-DRINKING BRTAIN!!! and all that.
New York vs. London
- Thread starter Canada J Soup
- Start date
I'd say it's more a case that that's what the Daily Mail brigade wanted us all to believe, BLAIR'S BINGE-DRINKING BRTAIN!!! and all that.
Freakaholic
not just an addiction
Can you get decent pizza anywhere in Europe? for cheap?
never been to london or NYC, but what I love about chicago is that i can get chicago style pizza, new york style pizza, or my new favorite, $5 whole pizzas from mexican restaurants. why get one slice for $2.50 when you can get a whole pizza for $5?
never been to london or NYC, but what I love about chicago is that i can get chicago style pizza, new york style pizza, or my new favorite, $5 whole pizzas from mexican restaurants. why get one slice for $2.50 when you can get a whole pizza for $5?
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
I'm very suspicious of this whole 'Chicago-style' pizza malarky. I've seen adverts on TV and they look like a circular loaf of bread with processed cheese injected into them.
There's a pizza place in central London - about 10 minutes from where I'm sitting now, in fact - that does very decent (whole) pizzas for about £3.50.
There's a pizza place in central London - about 10 minutes from where I'm sitting now, in fact - that does very decent (whole) pizzas for about £3.50.
Freakaholic
not just an addiction
Huh?
The problem is, theres actually a controversy over what is actually Chicago style pizza.
The standard understanding is this:
Which is stuffed pizza, basically 2 pizzas sandwiched together: dough-cheese-dough-cheese-sauce. Toppings go between the dough, and on top.
But in reality, purists consider the real Chicago-style pizza to be a a super thin crust pizza with a cornmeal based crust that is sligthly crunchy, and a very thin and simple tomato sauce. Almost always cut in squares (which irritates the hell out of me, i now have to ask pizzarias for a "pie cut," successful only 10% of the time).
sorry, i cant find a pic.
oh, and i love them all.
what you seemed to describe above is a calzone:
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
I know what a calzone is (and I love them, too - the bastard offspring of a pizza and a Cornish pasty, who wouldn't love that?).
I was talking about the stuffed-crust phenomenon, which just seems like complete overkill. The pizza in that first picture looks a bit gruesome, I have to say - more like a doughy cheese pie than a pizza.
I like them in a more traditional Italian style, with a thin-ish crust, then sauce and cheese, with topping items on top of the cheese. NYOM!
I was talking about the stuffed-crust phenomenon, which just seems like complete overkill. The pizza in that first picture looks a bit gruesome, I have to say - more like a doughy cheese pie than a pizza.
I like them in a more traditional Italian style, with a thin-ish crust, then sauce and cheese, with topping items on top of the cheese. NYOM!
yes, there is a place off of Tottenham Court road, about 5 minutes from the British museum, um, around the corner from the scientology place, near the national film archives, that does a margarita pizza for under 4 pounds and it's quite good... and after 5, all sandwhiches are half off! i used to stock up if i was around there...
MATT MAson
BROADSIDE
There is a great article in this month's Vanity Fair about Brits living in NYC. I hate to be so unpatriotic, but its funny cos its true:
http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/features/2007/04/brits200704
I also agree about with what was said about food. London has some incredible restaurants, (Also, I do occasionally miss Sainsburys), but NYC wins hands down for good cheap food (shout out to the Park Slope Co-op massive! Stay crunchy!), available at all times of day and night, and a far better selection of dishes.
London, however, shits on NYC from a great height when it comes to clubs. This place is such a disappointment in that respect, but that's about the only thing NYC isn't better at than London.
http://www.vanityfair.com/culture/features/2007/04/brits200704
I also agree about with what was said about food. London has some incredible restaurants, (Also, I do occasionally miss Sainsburys), but NYC wins hands down for good cheap food (shout out to the Park Slope Co-op massive! Stay crunchy!), available at all times of day and night, and a far better selection of dishes.
London, however, shits on NYC from a great height when it comes to clubs. This place is such a disappointment in that respect, but that's about the only thing NYC isn't better at than London.
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
i work in a hotel in nyc and every single person working here cringes when they hear a british accent.
it usually means; "snotty, demanding person who will talk down to you and not tip"
the old stereotype (savagely depicted in Tom Wolfe's "Bonfire of the Vanities", that's where the joke "book a table for 9 and watch all the brits run away when the check comes and have the Designated Americam Sucker pay for it" comes from. actually that article is close to plageurism!) of the british charming their way thru nyc w/ their delightful accents still has its adherents...
tho, i met Terror Danjah's sister the other day in the Lower East Side and she was pleasant...
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
For better or for worse, that's probably a result of the British culture in which you're not expected to pay twice for every service you use.
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
Heh heh.
I just hate the idea that you're expected to tip by default - and that you express dissatisfaction with a service by not tipping, or even by only leaving a small tip.
My take on it as follows: if service was exceptional, then tip. If it was OK, then just pay the bill. If it was awful, then you complain. Most restaurants these days include a 'discretionary' service charge, which is fair enough, but should be instead of the tip, unless the waitress delivered your food by leaping through a burning hoop on a motorcycle and then sucked you off while you drank your coffee.
Perhaps you wouldn't need to tip if staff in American restaurants/cafes were paid a decent living wage - but then, how would down-market eateries provide their famously cheap food if they did that?
I just hate the idea that you're expected to tip by default - and that you express dissatisfaction with a service by not tipping, or even by only leaving a small tip.
My take on it as follows: if service was exceptional, then tip. If it was OK, then just pay the bill. If it was awful, then you complain. Most restaurants these days include a 'discretionary' service charge, which is fair enough, but should be instead of the tip, unless the waitress delivered your food by leaping through a burning hoop on a motorcycle and then sucked you off while you drank your coffee.
Perhaps you wouldn't need to tip if staff in American restaurants/cafes were paid a decent living wage - but then, how would down-market eateries provide their famously cheap food if they did that?
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MATT MAson
BROADSIDE
Ergo - tipping works.
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
My point being, surely it destroys the point of having cheap places to eat if you have to cough up extra cash on top of what the food actually costs?
I'd far rather have a fixed, agreed price that I can pay and then walk out, than play this stupid game of have-I-paid-too-much-have-I-paid-too-little. It's ridiculous.
I'd far rather have a fixed, agreed price that I can pay and then walk out, than play this stupid game of have-I-paid-too-much-have-I-paid-too-little. It's ridiculous.
it's not that complicated.
at restaurants, 15% if service was adequate, above if better, less if worse...
at bars, 1 dollar a drink
at hotels, 2 dollars a bag for bellman, or 2 dollars per service rendered (i.e. the doorman gets you a cab, slip him 2 dollars)
lastly, alot of cheap eateries are counter service, so you don't have to tip...
the "caberet license" thing in NYC has been completely over for a while now, right? a few years ago i experienced perfectly behaved concerts being shut down because "more than 3 audience members were moving to music". people shouted at the police but there was really nothing anyone could do. entirely Orwellian dark episodes.
nothing as oppressive as this ever happened in London, has it?
but i did hear about the card-board cops being installed in the distance visible from major intersections... pretty funny/creepy. oh and the vid camera on every street corner thing.
how is the smoking indoor policy? is it like every pub is filled with smoke? think i heard something about a new ban...
nothing as oppressive as this ever happened in London, has it?
but i did hear about the card-board cops being installed in the distance visible from major intersections... pretty funny/creepy. oh and the vid camera on every street corner thing.
how is the smoking indoor policy? is it like every pub is filled with smoke? think i heard something about a new ban...
Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
But this is just what I mean - why not increase the price of the drink by $1? Rather than have staff standing there glaring at "fucking retarded foreigners who are to stupid to realise that a drink advertised as costing $5 actually costs $6, I mean DUH!".
Canada J Soup
Monkey Man
Once you get used to it, tipping in a bar starts to seem more normal than not tipping. Whenever I go back to Dublin, I get quizzical looks from barmen after leaving a few extra Euros out from the change from my round. It’s true that it complicates matters slightly, but the benefits can outweigh the complications: The best example is that, if you tip properly, and you go to decent bars, you get buy-backs (free drinks!) every third or fourth round. This creates an environment where the customer and the bartender more quickly establish a relationship/rapport than generally happens in a traditional British or Irish pub. It also gives the bartender a greater deal of control over the crowd at the bar (not to mention a greatly increased income: take-home on a busy Saturday night can be $800 or more), which means that you often get better and more dedicated bartenders.
It's funny that this has come up in this thread 'cause my girlfriend (who currently bartends in a nice little neighbourhood spot in Brooklyn) and I were talking about how we should try to open a Brooklyn style bar in London. Somewhere where the person serving you your drinks isn't just some guy in a white shirt and black tie putting in his shift for six quid an hour and hoping to get home soon.
Of course, there's also the fact that the tipping culture goes some way to disguising the fact that US could really do with a livable minimum wage. There's also something that I can't quite articulate about certain other tipping situations that make me feel like I'm forcing someone to sing for their supper. I'll still always be disappointed when I discover that someone I like is a shitty tipper though.
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Canada J Soup
Monkey Man
It's still in place, but I haven't heard of anywhere getting fined or shut down (or people even being told to stop dancing, although that could just be 'cause most crowds don't dance too much here) since Plant bar back in 2003 or so.
Most bars in Manhattan adhere to the smoking ban, but I've found that a lot of Brooklyn bars start to put out paper cups with water in them after midnight. Manhattan clubs on the other hand (the smaller ones anyway) don't seem to pay any attention to what anyone is doing as long as drinks are being ordered.