the Meat Thread

i don't crave meat, but i find it very hard to picture not eating it. i like innards, especially. the non-alienated thing would be to kill the animal oneself and skin and eat it, and to take only what is needed, that would be ideal but it's not economically feasible, i'm not rich. i think if there is a mental link between a living thing and an abstract portion of it one values it more, but the whole idea of convenience and our domination of animals goes against making this link. which is stupid because something obtained with effort probably tastes better as well, there is potential commercial value there.

I took the membrane off a liver for the first time yesterday. The blood totally grossed out the Doc, especially when I handed him the knife covered in it, he had to go and wash his hands immediately. Poor little lamb. Tasted nice though, calves liver.

Foie gras is banned in Chicago, but a lot of restaurants, particularly high end ones, still serve it, speakeasy style. Had some a few weeks ago entirely because I appreciated the chutzpah of the establishment. Guess it's true what they say about bans....

Gavin said:

Foie gras is banned in Chicago, but a lot of restaurants, particularly high end ones, still serve it, speakeasy style. Had some a few weeks ago entirely because I appreciated the chutzpah of the establishment. Guess it's true what they say about bans....

Click to expand...

Foie gras totally does my head in, it's such a gross procedure to produce something that exquisite, it's straight out of De Sade. I didn't know it was banned in Chicago, that surprises me somehow.

Mr. Tea said:

I think the UK is generally regarded as being one of the better countries as far as livestock welfare is concerned, at least for bigger animals. There's still battery farming of hens, but an increasing number of people are buying free-range eggs and chicken.

Click to expand...

No way, thats coming from someone who's worked as a factory butcher (vegetarian now, surprise surprise). The worst suffering is in Pig farming, pigs are highly inteligent creatures, moreso than dogs in a lot of ways. Forget the actual legislation, it gets totaly breached day to day. No companies observe the speed rules on lines (cept the odd times health and safety visit) and the workers invaribly take out thier frustration on the animals. That goes for the farming and killing side of things. Dont know if anyone remembers those 'the real countryside' undercover expos on C4 years ago. The footage the guy got from the killing line atBernard Mathews cost them abt £100k in cruelty fines, and that was a totalybog standard day.

btw that film 'unser täglich brot (our daily bread)' someone mentioned earlier is fantastic. Besides the expo element (anyone else watch the piglet castrating scene thru thier fingers?), some of the shots were breathtaking. Those cathedral like saltmines carved out 100s of feet below ground, kilometer long greenhouses tended by robotic farmers (like something out of Silent Running http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0067756/ ) and especialy remember a shot of a Sunflower decapitating plough slicing thru a seemingly endless field.

Really? That's very sad. I guess legislation makes no difference if no-one conforms with it.

Farmers in this country get so badly screwed on prices by the big supermarkets that they must be under huge pressure to cut corners wherever they can just to break even, though.

Gavin said:

Foie gras is banned in Chicago, but a lot of restaurants, particularly high end ones, still serve it, speakeasy style. Had some a few weeks ago entirely because I appreciated the chutzpah of the establishment. Guess it's true what they say about bans....

Click to expand...

There was a reasonable point made by Hugh Fearnly Whatsisface or that other one a year or so ago that while foie gras is cruel, it seems a bit rich that a lot of people who complain about people eating it a few times a year think nothing of chowing down on cheap (ie broilerhouse) chicken three times a week.

For my part, I'm another one looking to eat veggie most of the time and then have nice free range meat occasionally, especially since my girlfriend is veggie...

I find that meat is the only thing that satisfies my hunger. Cereals and veg leave me starving a couple of hours later, whereas if I have a bit of chicken or whatever I can last for hours without eating again. Any science behind this?

swears said:

I find that meat is the only thing that satisfies my hunger. Cereals and veg leave me starving a couple of hours later, whereas if I have a bit of chicken or whatever I can last for hours without eating again. Any science behind this?

Click to expand...

Yes...part of the reason why has to do with the way carbohydrates and sugars effect your glucose/insulin levels, which effect your mood and your appetite. Protein metabolism is more efficient, but at the same time many meats are quite calorie dense compared to fruits and vegetables, so at a minimal volume, you can net more energy from what you're eating. When I was a vegetarian I had to eat so much more to feel full, it was really not cost-effective at all.

Also, I'd have to look it up, but I remember learning about how your brain tells itself it's "full", and however that process works, protein and fats start the process that chemically tells your brain to stop eating long before carbs do.

Slothrop said:

There was a reasonable point made by Hugh Fearnly Whatsisface or that other one a year or so ago that while foie gras is cruel, it seems a bit rich that a lot of people who complain about people eating it a few times a year think nothing of chowing down on cheap (ie broilerhouse) chicken three times a week.

For my part, I'm another one looking to eat veggie most of the time and then have nice free range meat occasionally, especially since my girlfriend is veggie...

Click to expand...

Yeah, I went to a freerange chicken farm once to do some recordings - poor farmer man lookin on bemused, something to tell the wife - but even the conditions there were very poor for the animals. It was very depressing, and I got very ill after having been there, with an unbelievably 'please god just let me die' flu believe it or not, about 6 months before the first flu scares. I don't normally get flu cos I drink too much.
I eat organic unless it's in Chinese food, where I'll eat everything I'm given. Except duck's tongues, which are gross.

nomadologist said:

Also, I'd have to look it up, but I remember learning about how your brain tells itself it's "full", and however that process works, protein and fats start the process that chemically tells your brain to stop eating long before carbs do.

Click to expand...

There was a big investigation into the 'Atkins' diet and that's what they discovered about how it worked to cause people to eat less

swears said:

I find that meat is the only thing that satisfies my hunger. Cereals and veg leave me starving a couple of hours later, whereas if I have a bit of chicken or whatever I can last for hours without eating again. Any science behind this?

Click to expand...

You could just be plain not getting enough protein. Meats are complete protein sources, as they contain all the essential amino acids, but plant proteins are incomplete so you need to combine different sources in the same meal. This is extremely simple tho, the most common being beans on toast!
Many cultures most common dishes have already hit upon similar basic combinations of
Grains plus legumes,
Nuts and seeds plus legumes,
Corn plus legumes etc...
Good info here: http://www.nutrition.for-vegans.co.uk/

mistersloane said:

I don't normally get flu cos I drink too much.

Click to expand...

Hang on: are you saying you can protect yourself from flu by drinking lots? I mean, everyone knows drinking a bit has health benefits, but how much are we talking here?

mistersloane said:

I eat organic unless it's in Chinese food, where I'll eat everything I'm given. Except duck's tongues, which are gross.

Click to expand...

Heh, reminds me of my dad telling me about this time he went to a Chinese restaurant and saw chicken feet on the menu...I mean, what do you actually EAT on a chicken's foot? Must have been a '70s thing, I've (Edit: never )seen it in any Chinese restaurent. :slanted:

"Heh, reminds me of my dad telling me about this time he went to a Chinese restaurant and saw chicken feet on the menu...I mean, what do you actually EAT on a chicken's foot? Must have been a '70s thing, I've seen it in any Chinese restaurent"

Click to expand...

Chicken's foot can be very tasty. It's often in some kind of sauce (say black bean), the meat is normally very tender and you kinda suck it off the bones but you have to be quite careful 'cause the toes aren't very strongly attached and you can easily eat them. Loads of the restaurants in and around Soho have them. Not too long ago a girl left work and we went for dinner round the corner from where I work and we had chicken feet and duck tongues (bit like snail with a bone attached I reckon).

IdleRich said:

Chicken's foot can be very tasty. It's often in some kind of sauce (say black bean), the meat is normally very tender and you kinda suck it off the bones but you have to be quite careful 'cause the toes aren't very strongly attached and you can easily eat them. Loads of the restaurants in and around Soho have them. Not too long ago a girl left work and we went for dinner round the corner from where I work and we had chicken feet and duck tongues (bit like snail with a bone attached I reckon).

Click to expand...

it was the bone in the tongue that really grossed me out, chicken feet are ok though, not too partial to the jellied ones though.

hehe drink enough that insects don't bite me for fear of alcohol poisoning

"it was the bone in the tongue that really grossed me out, chicken feet are ok though, not too partial to the jellied ones though."

Click to expand...

I always thought that chicken feet would be more wiry and chewy but I've never had them that way.

zhao said:

a friend of mine who runs this blog (incidentally i did the logo) tells me that a lot of the times the (questionably) "safe" procedure of force feeding through the tube is not used, and food is manually stuffed down their throats with like a plunger.

Click to expand...

I've heard (but can't remember where) that Foie Gras geese don't need to be force-fed. If you give them an unlimited supply of food they will happily do the job themselves. Apparently some artisan Foie Gras producers in Gascony use that method.

Would that meet people's ethical standards?