Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 43

Thread: owning your web presence/history?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Brooklyn NY
    Posts
    524

    Default owning your web presence/history?

    In the light of a few recent developments, which led to someone wanting their entire history of participation removed from the board... I'm struck by what an interesting idea that is.

    I understand removing your current presence. But removing your past presence, that's something else again.

    I'm curious what people think of the idea (NOT OF THE INDIVIDUAL WHO CHOSE THIS) - what rights do you have or want to have over your web presence in various forms?

    Especially things like this - voluntary participation in group discussion?

    I'm curious because I think in genuine interpersonal exchange, the whole is more than the sum of the parts, but also that means removal of the part (i.e. one voice) after the fact kind of destroys the whole. In some cases, that's a shame (it depends on how valuable you think the whole/discussion is)

    I realized that I just assumed if I didn't like participating in dissensus any more (enough to quit), it would not have occurred to me to try to remove my past posts. Then again, I did go through an old weblog/online journal and make "friends-only" a lot of my more explicit posts I wrote 10 years ago when the Web was smaller and less searchable.

    What about y'all? if you decided you wanted to leave, would you take your past with you? would it be different for a blog than for a board?

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    15,716

    Default

    I remember thinking about this sort of thing a few years ago, about how the old Nazi-style book-burnings could never achieve anything like their intended goal these days since pretty much any document that some authority decided it wanted to erase would probably, by the time said authority became aware of it, exist on the hard disks of servers and PCs all over the world. Thanks to the Internet, any information you put into the public domain, that is of interest to at least one other person, will probably exist for ever and ever.
    Doin' the Lambeth Warp New: DISSENSUS - THE NOVEL - PM me your email address and I'll add you

  3. #3
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    12

    Default


  4. #4
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    THE YABBA
    Posts
    5,704

    Default

    I really like this area of thought, I think the beauty of the net is such that one can - in theory - take control of ones thoughts and then delete them, erase oneself from the presence one had, I wish the rewind were possible in real life.
    I'm personally, nowadays, into leaving traces, but for years, had the possibilty of walking in the snow without leaving a trace been possible, I would easily have chosen that, a self-deleting biosoft.
    Last edited by mistersloane; 08-04-2008 at 11:51 PM.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    Posts
    15,716

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by booky View Post
    Haha..."Anyone can take your image...even middle-aged men who do unskilled labour!!!!11"
    Doin' the Lambeth Warp New: DISSENSUS - THE NOVEL - PM me your email address and I'll add you

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    ottawa
    Posts
    2,958

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ripley
    I'm curious because I think in genuine interpersonal exchange, the whole is more than the sum of the parts, but also that means removal of the part (i.e. one voice) after the fact kind of destroys the whole. In some cases, that's a shame (it depends on how valuable you think the whole/discussion is)
    I think you're exactly right, and if we're talking about removing several thousand posts from a few hundred discussions then the intelligibility of the whole starts to be eroded, especially if it becomes the norm. It's different from someone having second thoughts about a few specific posts for particular reasons and deleting or editing them themselves (or asking a mod to). As a rule I ask myself if what I'm typing seems worthwhile enough and whether I'm comfortable with it being online the next day and in a few years. I've probably aborted half as many posts and I've made here.

    Plus there are some related implications. We've just had a furor over the forum's integrity following the moderators' collective decision to remove a single thread. Now the mass, retrospective gutting of hundreds of threads by individual request is being proposed.

    Also, from a technical standpoint the software's documentation cautions against intensive pruning like that because it taxes the server (making it slow or prone to crashing) and poses a risk to the database structure.
    Quote Originally Posted by ripley
    would it be different for a blog than for a board?
    I think so. You've only got yourself to think about with a blog, in the sense that it's a private expressive space. But if you're taking part in a public discussion then I think it comes with resignation to the fact that what you choose to post is out there and potentially beyond your control. Exceptions might be a once-private forum made public, or a listserv that has been publicly archived without the prior knowledge of contributors.
    BOOK: sound/bodies // paul.autonomic deeptime.net

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    3,981

    Default

    Just to be clear, I do not regret anything I have ever posted and do not want to take anything down because any one particular post or part of one is problematic in my own mind or by my own standards for what is "internet appropriate."

    I would like to take all of them down because I prefer not to be associated with this forum in any way. I think there are people who make it an ugly place and I've had enough of the bullshit. If there's no possible way for all of my posts to be deleted, so be it. No big deal, just thought I would give it a shot.

    (Re whether it is technically possible-- I asked a friend who is good with these things and he said he could probably easily do it himself because Dissensus does not have a very secure server, apparently...)

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    ottawa
    Posts
    2,958

    Default

    so you're proposing to get someone to hack the server then?
    BOOK: sound/bodies // paul.autonomic deeptime.net

  9. #9
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    3,981

    Default

    Not at all. I asked a friend who is a web developer whether it would be technically possible to delete all of a member's post from a message board. He looked at this one and said yes, and said it doesn't have a secure server. That's all.

    God he has better things to worry about I'm sure.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    3,981

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by nomos View Post
    We've just had a furor over the forum's integrity following the moderators' collective decision to remove a single thread.
    Much of that "furor" (mine at least) had everything to do with there being yet another allusion to the fact that stelfox wanted to start banning "at least 10" posters because he didn't like their style of posting. It had nothing whatsoever to do with deleting Jaie's misguided thread, in my mind at least.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    ottawa
    Posts
    2,958

    Default

    See the other thing is that every time your posts were quoted by someone else your username and words were reproduced in their posts. It would be virtually impossible to remove every trace of that username.

    Also, I just checked, and because the original username has been deleted it's no longer possible to perform any actions on it in the admin interface. It doesn't show up.

    (Sorry for going OT Ripley)
    BOOK: sound/bodies // paul.autonomic deeptime.net

  12. #12
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    3,981

    Default

    Well, I know you can't get rid of the quotes, but I think my friend was talking about getting rid of the rest on a really basic level of programming somehow not from the control panel...but I know nothing about that stuff so I'm not really sure.

    Anyway, it's ok--thanks for giving it a try! I sincerely appreciate it.

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Jan 2005
    Location
    Brooklyn NY
    Posts
    524

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by mistersloane View Post
    I really like this area of thought, I think the beauty of the net is such that one can - in theory - take control of ones thoughts and then delete them, erase oneself from the presence one had, I wish the rewind were possible in real life.
    I'm personally, nowadays, into leaving traces, but for years, had the possibilty of walking in the snow without leaving a trace been possible, I would easily have chosen that, a self-deleting biosoft.
    Yeah, the rewind. But of course it can never happen, because you are not alone in your life. So you're talking about erasing parts of other people's experience.

    But it's a little creepy (even for an anti-individualist like me) to realize that other people have claims to make on you and your past. I don't think this is universal, though. I would imagine people in different cultures are more or less comfortable with the idea that your being is collectively owned..

    that's part of what's so interesting online - these "traces" that used to be so ephemeral, are saved. To some extent we may be conscious of creating those histories, but even so, it's hard to imagine what it means.

    again, this is all aside from the REALLY creepy data privacy aspect (i.e. when your health insurance can build a profile of you from your web presence. ugh)

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
    Posts
    3,151

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ripley View Post
    I don't think this is universal, though. I would imagine people in different cultures are more or less comfortable with the idea that your being is collectively owned..
    What about that old supposed superstition about how some pre-modern tribes used to feel about cameras? Actually I don't like having my picture taken possibly for reasons a bit like this.
    Quote Originally Posted by ripley View Post
    that's part of what's so interesting online - these "traces" that used to be so ephemeral, are saved. To some extent we may be conscious of creating those histories, but even so, it's hard to imagine what it means.
    At least it's good to see that dissensus has opted out of being filed on the amazing but sometimes quite scary wayback machine.

  15. #15
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    North East London
    Posts
    5,744

    Default

    It is an interesting subject - it looks like we may be the last generation to have our teenage years completely undocumented on the net, for example.

    The young 'uns seem much less hung up on privacy also - having photos of yourself online seems de rigeur whereas most people I know (and indeed people here) don't do that.

    It's one of those strange things about the internet - if you fall out with someone in real life you can't erase all traces of yourself from their life...

    Blogs are different I think - a few people I've know have deleted theirs in their entirety, I think because they didn't want to bother with them any more and needed to remove the self-imposed pressure to post.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •