The belated R Kelly thread...

craner

Beast of Burden
Gaga exploited the shade of controversy I reckon. Until it became a criminal certainty. Cynical.
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
You guys are struggling because of that shitty right wing deleuzianism that exalts the biopolitics of the racialised body over agitprop, seeing it as more organic rather than its own kind of prison where the abject choakhold of masculinity is made desirable and superseeding of the collective political consciousness. It does reinstate the cartesian dualism, but white men are able to occupy a privileged position in this Cartesianism, but it itself is not superseeded.

It's a constant bugbear of critics isn't it. black music is a surrogate for their own raciological theorisations whereas white music is seen as just inherently for white people, but then it all becomes a text and you either get the uncritical oh it's just fat beats man or the greg tate kind of thing (i actually ain't read any tate but i can predict what his argument is) that the platonic ideal of *the text* is revolutionary, politically poignant or subversive. A lot of pop music is very, very unethical, far more than road rap which always seems to trip up critics for whatever reason.
 
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Leo

Well-known member
I have no idea what your first paragraph means, granted I'm rather dim. can you explain your point in more basic terms?
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
it's sexuality as a jackhammer to enforce patriarchal conformity isn't it.

Like yes the religious dualism of free your mind and your ass will follow was problematic, but at least it acknowledged the truth that race based thinking is constituted (though not exclusively) as mental constructs.
 

thirdform

pass the sick bucket
all i was trying to say is that seeing the artist as mad or depraved kind of lets the underworld mechanics of the industry off. the criminals in pop music actually understand peoples desires and political sentiments more than underground music fans.

That's the way to analyse it imo, not so much spiritual militancy vs materialism. the fact is underground music fandom is self-isolating to achieve that spirituality. but probably good to let this thread die off.

Basically, celebrating sexuality in pop music is a dead end and is less morally sufficient than enjoying it as pop music. once you believe the pop ethos you've been dooped. thhis is why i don't understand poptimism really, it's like yay patriarchal bourgeoisie hello we love you.

Not that i side with rockism in this debate, but... im gonna quote this post in the thread concerning this and hopefully it will die off. now to find the thread...
 
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