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Thread: Lady Sovereign - the Grime test

  1. #1
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    Default Lady Sovereign - the Grime test

    In the Pitchfork thread, no less an authority than Mr. Sama said the following.

    Quote Originally Posted by Logan Sama
    I like Lady Sovereign.

    She is like the secret entrance exam for anyone who wants to like Grime. If they like her, they don't get it.

    She's a nice way of weeding out the fashion followers.
    Now I like Lady Sov, not as a poseur test, but becasue I like her voice and her cheekieness.

    I'm just a casual follower of grime, and I know she didn't ome up through the pirate scene, but this seems a little harsh to me.

    So what do all of you lot think? Does liking Sov make one a pretender?

  2. #2
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    lol

    You are taking an off the cuff remark to be a law sent down on an acetate tablet from Mount Music House.

    I have no problem with people finding her "cheeky" or "entertaining", because that is exactly what she is. But when she is getting the same sort of rave reviews that someone of the talent of Kano is getting, that is when I have a problem.

    If Lady Sovereign gets more people listening to grime as a product of her name-checking her favourites and inspirations, then fairplay to her. If she puts people off listening to grime because she's a novelty act and people get sick of her, then it would be to the detriment of the music.

    I just can't listen to her for more than 2 seconds without wanting to reach for the power switch.

    But that's just me.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Logan Sama
    You are taking an off the cuff remark to be a law sent down on an acetate tablet from Mount Music House.
    Nah man, I'm taking it as an off the cuff remark. It's all good. But I was wondering what other people thought of her mostly.

  4. #4
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    I'm fairly new to grime but even I can understand where Logan comes from.

    My first grime experience came thru hearing Plasticman. (After hearing Dizzee of course) Although I never realised there was a whole scene of the stuff.

    I've been avidly listening to Rinse FM for the last 2 months or so and I really like it.

    However, If I was played a Lady Sov track before I had heard Plasticman + the Rinse Crew (Logan included) I think I would have ignored grime full stop.

    I find Lady Sov really cringe worthy - that Random video on Channel U is sheer comedy genius for all the wrong reasons.

    It surprises me the amount of press she is getting - especially as the whole hype around her seems to have been generated around the press cuttings themselves rather than actual street credibility.

  5. #5
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    The thing I find weird is that like two years ago she was posting all the time on UKGarageWorldwide (yes, I might as well out myself as a long-term lurker on UKG forums), posting crappy quality audio clips of her crew (HL Family or something like that?) and getting lots of attention on that particular internet forum (arguments, 'Sov is well buff/Sov is butters' threads, 'listen to my audio' all that sort of stuff), but nowhere else. Then, whammo, suddenly she's in the press as being like some kind of emblematic grime figure. How did this happen? She didn't even really do the pirates or the long-term slog up the ladder did she? Did someone just decide they like the look of her and that she could be a marketable quantity? Inquiring minds (well, me) want to know, because to be honest the appeal escapes me.

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pearsall
    Did someone just decide they like the look of her and that she could be a marketable quantity?
    Yes

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pearsall
    She didn't even really do the pirates or the long-term slog up the ladder did she?
    Dues paying is overrrated

    Quote Originally Posted by Logan Sama
    I like Lady Sovereign.

    She is like the secret entrance exam for anyone who wants to like Grime. If they like her, they don't get it.

    She's a nice way of weeding out the fashion followers.
    I am a fashion follower!

  8. #8
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    Okay, let me see if I’ve got this straight. So far, what are the criticisms of Lady Sovereign that are being put forward, other than a basic “don’t like the way her stuff sounds”?

    - She’s okay as (mere) “entertainment” but doesn’t have the (serious, artistic) “talent” of another (coincidentally male) artist.
    - She’s a “novelty” act (because humour has no place in music?).
    - She hasn’t come up through the right route – ie, hasn’t done the necessary work (lacks the protestant work ethic!), doesn’t come from the right place (lacks authenticity!).
    - She’s only enjoying her current success because of the way she looks and the machinations of marketing men (as has been said about every female pop artist since ever).

    I’ll happily admit that I don’t know a huge amount about grime, especially compared to some people here, but I think I recognise the above – isn’t this what some people used to/still call ‘rockism’? I’ve never found that term ideal, but it’s as good a term as any to describe a certain set of recurring values that tend to frame some people’s dislike of artists who have any kind of pop element to their music.

    If what was being said was “people who ONLY like Lady Sovereign but not Kano or No Lay or whoever, don’t get it”, that would be one thing, but as far as I can tell, the implicit idea is if you like Sov at all, that means you don’t have a clue, even if you like a whole bunch of other people.

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    The thing I find weird is that like two years ago she was posting all the time on UKGarageWorldwide (yes, I might as well out myself as a long-term lurker on UKG forums), posting crappy quality audio clips of her crew (HL Family or something like that?) and getting lots of attention on that particular internet forum (arguments, 'Sov is well buff/Sov is butters' threads, 'listen to my audio' all that sort of stuff), but nowhere else. Then, whammo, suddenly she's in the press as being like some kind of emblematic grime figure. How did this happen? She didn't even really do the pirates or the long-term slog up the ladder did she? Did someone just decide they like the look of her and that she could be a marketable quantity? Inquiring minds (well, me) want to know, because to be honest the appeal escapes me.
    Yeh I remember that as well.

  10. #10
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    Oh, come off it. Yeah, she is funny and entertaining, but she *can* spit. There is absolutely nothing wrong with her. And as for being a "novelty act", she's hardly the fucking Cheeky Girls now, is she?
    This is like saying Elephant Man isn't dancehall because he makes comedy tunes.
    Logan, I totally admire your trenchancy, your knowledge of grime and the fact that you like to stir shit up, but you really aren't right here.
    Personally I couldn't care less about "realness" (that whole standpoint is just pissy drum & bass council-style scene guardianship to me) and I don't find her attractive, either; I just think she's good. Not as good as Riko, who is my unabashed grime hero, but she pisses all over the likes of Shystie and made it into my top 10 singles of the year with a bullet - and i totally stand by that.
    I'm really not a fashion person. Several people here can testify that I usually look like shit and I don't like MIA.

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Melchior
    In the Pitchfork thread, no less an authority than Mr. Sama said the following.



    Now I like Lady Sov, not as a poseur test, but becasue I like her voice and her cheekieness.

    I'm just a casual follower of grime, and I know she didn't ome up through the pirate scene, but this seems a little harsh to me.

    So what do all of you lot think? Does liking Sov make one a pretender?
    I rrrrrrreally love Lady Sov. As much as I like Shystie, I thought her record was a letdown. So yes, I guess her latest single, Random, is very *accessible* and will probably/hopefully do well with the *general public*. The fact remains she's good. I love how people *blame* her looks for all the media attention.

    "on that particular internet forum (arguments, 'Sov is well buff/Sov is butters' threads, 'listen to my audio' all that sort of stuff), but nowhere else."

    Oh no, you missed her posts on the Knitting Message Board. ;-)

    I am happy I failed the Grime test.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by stevienixed
    'Sov is well buff/Sov is butters'.
    she looks like a child to me, but then again i am a middle aged ex raver. policeman are getting younger too!

  13. #13
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    Thing about Lady Sovereign vs most Grime, is that Lady Sovereign is actually good.

    Y'know, makes records you can actually listen to, dance to even, instead of all the juvenile testosterone wank that has always bedevilled Grime.

    Dunno whether I'm into fashion -- doubt it cos I don't know what's hot. But I look great.
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  14. #14

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    Sov is big. She is very attractive, undoubtedly talented and has star quality.
    The same reason people hate on Dizzee is why they hate on her IMO.

  15. #15
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    I don't think setting up a dichotomy between Lady Sovereign and "juvenile testosterone wank" does her any favours either. If she DOES becomes an artist who's liked by people who don't like any other grime (and maybe it's happening already), it won't necessarily detract from the quality of her music, but it will irritate the fuck out of a lot of people, including me.

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