DannyL

Wild Horses
They may be related in cause and effect but there's a sharp delineation between philosophical pessimism and medically diagnosable depression.

Yeah.

And to say that Buddhism is pessimistic isn't entirely right, either. Pessimism towards the goals of the self, and their chances of bringing lasting happiness maybe. But I see a lot of joy and celebration when I look at Tibetan Buddhist art, for instance. Compassion is obviously a huge value therein as well and I don't think you can reconcile that with pessimism.
 

droid

Beast of Burden
I would say that buddhism/pessimism is an eyes wide open weltanschauung characterised (ideally) by clarity of thought & mind.

Depression is the opposite, an emotional and neurological condition characterised by an inability to think clearly and obtain an objective view of the world.

There are exceptions of course.
 

mistersloane

heavy heavy monster sound
The closed-eye visuals from a strong dose of opium are fucking next level. Totally unlike those from psychedelics - very structured.

This. Opium really is as real as dreams, very very different from psychedelics. Super super interesting drug.
 

Mr. Tea

Shub-Niggurath, Please
It's weird, I remember mistersloane talking on here years ago about how DMT had been "everything [he'd] hoped LSD would be" before he'd tried LSD, or words to that effect - and then luka mocking me for talking about sausage casserole while coming down off DMT - but the experiences I've had just recently with acid have been among the most profound I've ever had, on drugs or off them, and they were by no means heroic doses, either. Whereas with DMT I got that 'whoosh' sensation and a sort of feeling of non-specific awe, and gorgeous visuals, but no emotional insights like I have with acid.

Perhaps it's to do with the duration, or maybe it's just different strokes for different folks.
 
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Corpsey

bandz ahoy
with DMT I got that 'whoosh' sensation and a sort of feeling of non-specific awe, and gorgeous visuals, but no emotional insights like I have with acid.

Perhaps it's to do with the duration, or maybe it's just different strokes for different folks.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QoiGdktgRw0

Dorian Yates (ex Mr Universe) talking about how DMT gave him the woosh and ayahuasca helped him sort himself out.
 

version

Well-known member
JOSEPH CAMPBELL: Well, as I said, all you have to do is read the newspaper. It’s a mess. On this immediate level of life and structure, myths offer life models. But the models have to be appropriate to the time in which you are living, and our time has changed so fast that what was proper fifty years ago is not proper today. The virtues of the past are the vices of today. And many of what were thought to be the vices of the past are the necessities of today. The moral order has to catch up with the moral necessities of actual life in time, here and now. And that is what we are not doing. The old-time religion belongs to another age, another people, another set of human values, another universe. By going back you throw yourself out of sync with history. Our kids lose their faith in the religions that were taught to them, and they go inside.

BILL MOYERS: Often with the help of a drug.

CAMPBELL: Yes. The mechanically induced mystical experience is what you have there. I have attended a number of psychological conferences dealing with this whole problem of the difference between the mystical experience and the psychological crack-up. The difference is that the one who cracks up is drowning in the water in which the mystic swims. You have to be prepared for this experience.

MOYERS: You talk about this peyote culture emerging and becoming dominant among Indians as a consequence of the loss of the buffalo and their earlier way of life.

CAMPBELL: Yes. Ours is one of the worst histories in relation to the native peoples of any civilized nation. They are nonpersons. They are not even reckoned in the statistics of the voting population of the United States. There was a moment shortly after the American Revolution when there were a number of distinguished Indians who actually participated in American government and life. George Washington said that Indians should be incorporated as members of our culture. But instead, they were turned into vestiges of the past. In the nineteenth century, all the Indians of the southeast were put into wagons and shipped under military guard out to what was then called Indian Territory, which was given to the Indians in perpetuity as their own world—then a couple of years later was taken away from them. Recently, anthropologists studied a group of Indians in northwestern Mexico who live within a few miles of a major area for the natural growth of peyote. Peyote is their animal—that is to say, they associate it with the deer. And they have very special missions to go collect peyote and bring it back. These missions are mystical journeys with all of the details of the typical mystical journey. First, there is disengagement from secular life. Everybody who is going to go on this expedition has to make a complete confession of all the faults of his or her recent living. And if they don’t, the magic is not going to work. Then they start on the journey. They even speak a special language, a negative language. Instead of saying yes, for example, they say no, or instead of saying, “We are going,” they say, “We are coming.” They are in another world. Then they come to the threshold of the adventure.

There are special shrines that represent stages of mental transformation on the way. And then comes the great business of collecting the peyote. The peyote is killed as though it were a deer. They sneak up on it, shoot a little arrow at it, and then perform the ritual of collecting the peyote. The whole thing is a complete duplication of the kind of experience that is associated with the inward journey, when you leave the outer world and come into the realm of spiritual beings. They identify each little stage as a spiritual transformation. They are in a sacred place all the way.

MOYERS: Why do they make such an intricate process out of it?

CAMPBELL: Well, it has to do with the peyote being not simply a biological, mechanical, chemical effect but one of spiritual transformation. If you undergo a spiritual transformation and have not had preparation for it, you do not know how to evaluate what has happened to you, and you get the terrible experiences of a bad trip, as they used to call it with LSD. If you know where you are going, you won’t have a bad trip.

MOYERS: So this is why it is a psychological crisis if you are drowning in the water where—

CAMPBELL: —where you ought to be able to swim, but you weren’t prepared. That is true of the spiritual life, anyhow. It is a terrifying experience to have your consciousness transformed.

 

kevinoak

Active member
Let me introduce my vision of opiod epidemic:

Patient - I have anxiety
Doctor- errmmm....how do you feel? Never mind I have something that will help Xanax
Patient- Great!

3 months later
Patient- I still have anxiety
Doctor- Ok! We'll just up the dosage!!!!! (ROFLMAO)
Patient- Thanks!

Patient then becomes addicted, and sells the extra ones on the street for extra monies to fund addiction

Just watch Requiem for a dream. That movie summarizes everything about this epidemic.

Opiod addicts need help and thanks God there are drug information hotlines that are free and available 24/7 https://addictionresource.com/addiction-and-rehab-hotlines/
 
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