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Thread: Succession

  1. #16
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    Not brand new but I did like this


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  3. #17
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    Klopp is a legend - he's as magnetic as Mourinho and Guardiola but far more of a real person.

    I liked Succession for a while, but got bored eventually because I didn't care about any of the characters and whether they l lived or died. But some of the actors, like Kieran Culkin, are perfectly cast. Among the writers is Lucy Prebble, who I think is really good (she's known as a playwright, but I know her as one of the pundits on Frankie Boyle shows)

    The Caroline Flack suicide was just awful. The dynamic with the gutter press and people's insatiable desire for seeing celebrities destroyed is really sick. Love Island should have been axed after the previous suicide. It's like some dematerialised mental health version of the gladiatorial arena - building people up to watch them perish.

  4. #18
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    I liked Succession for a while, but got bored eventually because I didn't care about any of the characters and whether they l lived or died. But some of the actors, like Kieran Culkin, are perfectly cast. Among the writers is Lucy Prebble, who I think is really good (she's known as a playwright, but I know her as one of the pundits on Frankie Boyle shows)
    I like Kieran Culkin, he's good in everything I've seen him in - the main thing that springs to mind is Igby Goes Down in which (now I come to think of it) he plays pretty much the same role.
    Yeah Lucy Prebble is another the Brits involved I think, don't really know her either.
    Yeah it's a brave decision to make a programme without any likable characters in it. But in some ways that's right, they have resisted the temptation to make Logan Roy a kind of lovably charismatic rogue like, say, Escobar in Narcos, he's portrayed as a total arsehole who only cares about money, will fuck over everyone in his pursuit of it and who hates everything he can't understand. No wimping out there and the show is the better for it. In the same way I like the way that it avoids over-reliance on twists and last minute get-outs of the kind you get in (to name a few) Billions or Mad Men or whatever. So many times you assume they're gonna come up with some brilliant plan to turn the tables but basically they just shout a lot and try and muddle through. Ultimately more satisfying in terms of story progression I feel.
    I think however that you could sort of make an argument that if you take all the nice bits from Kendall and Shiv they maybe add up to almost enough of someone to care about (though at the same time they are obviously deeply flawed to say the least). Speaking of Shiv, the actress who plays her is great, maybe the best part of the whole thing, I think she's Australian, she had a supporting role in (very interesting film) Sleeping Beauty I understand but I don't really remember her in that to be honest. The other really good thing is the double-act between Tom and Greg, it makes me laugh every time.

  5. #19
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    Yeah Tom is played very well.

    I can deal with not liking any of the characters, it's just that after a while, their fates didn't matter to me much. I have certainly been hooked before on the fate of objectively awful tv characters. Walter white is the first example that comes to mind

  6. #20
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    Yeah I don't know what it is that involves one in something. It can work with unlikable characters, but of course it's a harder trick to pull off. For me I find backstabbing and manoeuvring and so on intrinsically interesting I guess. I see the whole thing in the tradition of I Claudius or... I dunno, I'm sure there are other obvious precursors that should spring to mind here. Add in the relevance of it being about Rupert Murdoch specifically and the negative effects of the super-rich in general, and of course the implications of all the above for democracy and it's perfect for me. Though how long they can string-out the "who will actually succeed" story-line is a worry, maybe they shouldn't have given it a name that almost implies that will not be decided until the final minutes.
    Last edited by IdleRich; 18-02-2020 at 06:56 PM.

  7. #21
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    I certainly appreciated the lack of over-reliance on cliffhangers, as you said. I think I'm just not that interested in backstabbing when it forms the entire backdrop to a show, as it would in any show starting off in a multi-million dollar industry, though conversely I find it fascinating when it develops within the context of an already-developed world/set of characters (again, Breaking Bad is a superb example)

  8. #22
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    I gotta admit that although there were lots of good elements to Breaking Bad I found the poor characterisation - and bizarre changes in personality in service of the plot - a real problem that ultimately meant it couldn't quality for the top tier of TV. Plus all the kinda A-Team/McGyver stuff was just.. well, less said the better.

  9. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Corpsey View Post
    The Sun had a circulation of 1.4 million in 2019 but that was down from 3 million in 2010.

    "Between 1994 and 1996, The Sun's circulation peaked. Its highest average sale was in the week ending 16 July 1994, when the daily figure was 4,305,957. The highest ever one-day sale was on 18 November 1995 (4,889,118), although the cover price had been cut to 10p. The highest ever one-day sale at full price was on 30 March 1996 (4,783,359)."

    Dunno if this is as heartening as I want it to be, given the left-wing press is also haemorrhaging readers perhaps those so inclined are simply finding their right-wing sensationalist garbage online these days?
    The Mail's website is apparently one of the most visited 'news' sources in the world, so I wouldn't get your hopes up.

  10. #24
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    Yeah The Mail website is famously full of the kind of scantily clad women that the magazine (er, paper - accidental typo but I think I'll leave it) deplores. I believe that the Guardian website also punches above its weight as regards sales of the newspaper - but I don't think they've really found a way to monetise that yet, hence every article ends with a plea for donations...
    Anyway, what about Succession? Anyone watch it?

  11. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by baboon2004 View Post
    The Caroline Flack suicide was just awful. The dynamic with the gutter press and people's insatiable desire for seeing celebrities destroyed is really sick. Love Island should have been axed after the previous suicide. It's like some dematerialised mental health version of the gladiatorial arena - building people up to watch them perish.
    The other thing is it's now glossed over the fact she was a domestic abuser. She apparently smashed her boyfriend over the head with a lamp whilst he was sleeping and also assaulted a previous boyfriend then made him sign a gagging order to stop him talking about it, so the takeaway as far as I can tell is that Flack, the media, the public and various others were all at fault.

  12. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by IdleRich View Post
    Anyway, what about Succession? Anyone watch it?
    This is the second time I've heard of it, but I've never seen it. I might give it a go at some point, but I'm terrible with TV. I watch one episode of The Young Pope every two months or so atm and I still haven't watched plenty of other stuff I've intended to.

  13. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by IdleRich View Post
    I gotta admit that although there were lots of good elements to Breaking Bad I found the poor characterisation - and bizarre changes in personality in service of the plot - a real problem that ultimately meant it couldn't quality for the top tier of TV. Plus all the kinda A-Team/McGyver stuff was just.. well, less said the better.
    That's interesting. I can see the point about changes in character that don't always hang together, but it didn't bother me that much - I can forgive some of it as playing upon archetypes, playing straight into a semi-mythic dimension (the whole Ozymandias trope etc).

    I wouldn't put it in the top tier of TV either, because it didn't engage me emotionally at all - but then this modern era of TV rarely does that, concentrating as it does upon being structurally clever, addictive and 'having something meaningful to say about society' (mostly, imo, really obvious observations that are then lauded as genius - see the Sopranos) at the expense of much else. But I'd put it right at the top of the tier of TV that is purely about entertainment. Some of the set pieces in BB were incredible, eg. in 'One Minute', straight out of top drawer film, and I loved the way the New Mexico landscape became a world unto itself. Also the sense of different worlds colliding, with Lydia and the cartels.
    Last edited by baboon2004; 19-02-2020 at 09:21 AM.

  14. #28
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    What was the One Minute episode then?
    There were some good set pieces I guess but the stuff with magnets and that was stupid. I liked the one where he blew him up with the wheelchair. The final episode with the machine gun on the bonnet was kind of good and bad.

  15. #29
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    It was this but if you can get it on Netflix and watch the preceding minute or two as well, it works better

    Magnets was legendary!

    giphy.gif

    "I liked the one where he blew him up with the wheelchair" I like how this would sound out of context in an overhead pub conversation

    Yeah, the last episode stretched credulity somewhat (!), but I thought it worked emotionally as a kind of dreamscape where Walt found some redemption in saving Jesse, but that that still didn't wipe out the past.

  16. #30
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    Was that when those twin assassins came from Mexico?

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