Gutterbreakz Blog

this whole issue is just symptomatic of the general dubsetpforum idiocy that had me give up posting there. someone mentioned it upthread - general non-critical love for every tune/producer/night, and artists responding personally to anything vaguely critical. all a bit undignified.

I've enjoyed reading all independent music blogs since I discovered them (relatively recent), have discovered SO much new music and musical history from them (and on here - thanks btw) and am always in awe of the time/effort/love that goes into producing such high quality output. gutter in particular was a one-man bristol (and wider) dubstep publicity machine, and skream, luke envoy et al need to show some love/appreciation for what he and others do for their and their music's coverage (respect to paul rose for his position, btw).

would be interested to hear what blackdown thinks on this - I know Hell_sd is a bit long on this point, but in this case, where the artists BD's quite involved with have been so public with their views, I'd like to hear what BD, as a fellow blogger, thinks about it all.

peripheral said:

this whole issue is just symptomatic of the general dubsetpforum idiocy that had me give up posting there. someone mentioned it upthread - general non-critical love for every tune/producer/night, and artists responding personally to anything vaguely critical. all a bit undignified.

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i agree and i've been trying to address this. i do feel as though i'm trying to bang my head up against a brick wall. the problem is the critical thought which has been displayed so far has lacked anything of substance. more digs than anything else.

this said critical thought on dubstep has been lacking even here until the recent success of the burial thread /album.

boomnoise said:

i agree and i've been trying to address this. i do feel as though i'm trying to bang my head up against a brick wall. the problem is the critical thought which has been displayed so far has lacked anything of substance. more digs than anything else.

this said critical thought on dubstep has been lacking even here until the recent success of the burial thread /album.

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and what exactly do you mean by critical thought of substance? if its yet another dig because not everyones on the same pomo tip, then i call bullshit.

if you are saying that people uncritically accept every crumb from the plates of the dubstep elite, and the prevailing atmosphere is one of a herd mentality with people lower down the perceived pecking order getting a mass kicking (equally applicable to self-appointed intellectuals as it is council estate dubsteppas btw) - then thats something i can agree with.

bassnation said:

and what exactly do you mean by critical thought of substance? if its yet another dig because not everyones on the same pomo tip, then i call bullshit.

if you are saying that people uncritically accept every crumb from the plates of the dubstep elite, and the prevailing atmosphere is one of a herd mentality with people lower down the perceived pecking order getting a mass kicking (equally applicable to self-appointed intellectuals as it is council estate dubsteppas btw) - then thats something i can agree with.

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the latter.

i'm not taking digs i'm just frustrated with things.

by critical thought of substance i mean something a tad more analytical than the majority of what's going on at dubstepforum where criticism/analysis is reduced to 'big ups' or 'not feelings'

boomnoise said:

the latter.

i'm not taking digs i'm just frustrated with things.

by critical thought of substance i mean something a tad more analytical than the majority of what's going on at dubstepforum where criticism/analysis is reduced to 'big ups' or 'not feelings'

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'big up you. no big up you. no big up me...'


on and on. but more widely, it's not at all a good look for producers/DJs/all their mates to jump on a forum and offer all and sundry outside at the first hint of negativity. if anything this just encourages the fanboys to echo them - 'big up him!' 'allow the haters' etc etc. honestly it's like a playgroup.

there's also this weird notion flaoting around that everyone has a kind of collective moral responsibility to present a united public dubstep front - meaning being absolutely non-critical at all times. one poster on dsf even pronounced gutter's mp3 posting as 'grounds for blacklisting'. yup I know. I'm too much of a baby (in musical terms at least) to know if this kind of idea was around in the early(ish) days of other sounds when they started to get bigger, but would be interested to know how it panned out if so....

this threads about gutta...

so it's probly best to discuss yr feelings & opinions on dubstepforum ... er on dubstepforum,
please

yagetme?

ta

sufi said:

so it's probly best to discuss yr feelings & opinions on dubstepforum ... er on dubstepforum,
please

yagetme?

ta

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yup point taken, got you. but it is about gutta - this all kicked off on dsf after all. the wider point was about a dubstep hegemony that, not just on dsf, is becoming a bit pervasive. this is what gutta seems to have fallen foul of. so...I was asking dissensians if this was just a common feature of a sound as it spreads to a wider audience - did it happen with dnb, for example - or is it exclusive to dubstep?

i don't think that ideas about 'blacklisting' exist any further than the skull of that particular dsf poster you quoted.

also i can't help but wonder how many of the numerous samples on said individual's latest record have been cleared / paid for? hmmm...

Noel Emits said:

i don't think that ideas about 'blacklisting' exist any further than the skull of that particular dsf poster you quoted.

also i can't help but wonder how many of the numerous samples on said individual's latest record have been cleared / paid for? hmmm...

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ok. good. and isn't it tho...if derivative basslines were as immediately 'ownable' as mp3s, I doubt it would be only gutta in a bit of bother...

Some of the folk who laid into GB in that other place really are a morally superior breed and it would be hard for anyone to match their standards. Fine upstanding individuals who PAY for all their software, LOVE their mums and NEVER illegally download.

Self-rightous twonks!

boomnoise said:

this said critical thought on dubstep has been lacking even here until the recent success of the burial thread /album.

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Well the big people have stepped in with their support for parts of the project, k-punk has given it an enormous amount of thought, maybe as part of the hautology idea.
there are people (like me), paul meme, you etc who are both big fans and critical of the genre/can see where it's likely to fuck up.

Dubstep forum is a one issue fan site really, there are others, like the idm type sites which have a similar character.
However i think what happens overtime is early on artists post there, then posters become artists, then posters who are artists but unsucessful attack bigger artists who no longer post there (after flaming/overzealous fanboyness/work, fame taking over.)
One genre forums usually turn out to be pretty bitter places after a few years.
Oddly the people hating on the dubstepforum site seem to be doing what fanboys often do- expressing their opinions on behalf of the artists involved, imagining they are speaking for those artists and protecting their interests, which is frankly bullshit.

peripheral said:

yup point taken, got you. but it is about gutta - this all kicked off on dsf after all. the wider point was about a dubstep hegemony that, not just on dsf, is becoming a bit pervasive. this is what gutta seems to have fallen foul of. so...I was asking dissensians if this was just a common feature of a sound as it spreads to a wider audience - did it happen with dnb, for example - or is it exclusive to dubstep?

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There was that drum'n'bass producer - General something? - who got blacklisted for saying he invented jungle and then DJ Rap got death threats for playing his tracks. Obviously that was on a much bigger scale but represents a similar mentality I think.

Ned said:

There was that drum'n'bass producer - General something?

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levy

I read that about the blacklisting thing. Its complete madness. All the people taking that line are ridiculous, jumped up nobodies who think their tin-pot productions are gonna make them millions. Totally deluded!

mms said:

Well the big people have stepped in with their support for parts of the project, k-punk has given it an enormous amount of thought, maybe as part of the hautology idea.
there are people (like me), paul meme, you etc who are both big fans and critical of the genre/can see where it's likely to fuck up.

Dubstep forum is a one issue fan site really, there are others, like the idm type sites which have a similar character.
However i think what happens overtime is early on artists post there, then posters become artists, then posters who are artists but unsucessful attack bigger artists who no longer post there (after flaming/overzealous fanboyness/work, fame taking over.)
One genre forums usually turn out to be pretty bitter places after a few years.
Oddly the people hating on the dubstepforum site seem to be doing what fanboys often do- expressing their opinions on behalf of the artists involved, imagining they are speaking for those artists and protecting their interests, which is frankly bullshit.

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yeah, i was just having a bad day.

nice observations on the patterns of one genre forums.