germaphobian

Well-known member
Sweden's government may be notionally 'liberal' but the biggest party in the ruling coalition is the right-wing populists, who are also the second-biggest party overall in the Riksdag.

You're right yeah, although they tried to keep them (the right-wing populists) out for as long as possible, but - on the other hand - the coalition also has moderates and liberals, so it's bit of a mix really. But that presents another problem which was expressed by Brecht in that little poem:

After the uprising of the 17th June
The Secretary of the Writers Union
Had leaflets distributed in the Stalinallee
Stating that the people
Had forfeited the confidence of the government
And could win it back only
By redoubled efforts. Would it not be easier
In that case for the government
To dissolve the people
And elect another?


So people give majority of their votes, or at least a large percentage, to right-wing populist parties; and I'm quite sure that it will only intensify, so what's the solution? Liberal dictatorship, liberal one party state? There was actually a talk in Germany of banning AFD, now pretty much the most popular party in the country, at least in the East. Seems kind of crazy.
Of course, another solution would be to defang the right wing parties by adressing some of the issues that push people to vote for them, and that's what it think is happening. It's a tactic not a strategy really.
 

mixed_biscuits

_________________________
The lefties consider themselves to be masters of understanding different peoples and viewpoints but they're manifestly utterly incapable of understanding the conservative mindset and of accommodating it, even if they don't understand. This is why they cannot consider themselves masters of multiculturalism.
 

sufi

lala
You're right yeah, although they tried to keep them (the right-wing populists) out for as long as possible, but - on the other hand - the coalition also has moderates and liberals, so it's bit of a mix really. But that presents another problem which was expressed by Brecht in that little poem:

After the uprising of the 17th June
The Secretary of the Writers Union
Had leaflets distributed in the Stalinallee
Stating that the people
Had forfeited the confidence of the government
And could win it back only
By redoubled efforts. Would it not be easier
In that case for the government
To dissolve the people
And elect another?


So people give majority of their votes, or at least a large percentage, to right-wing populist parties; and I'm quite sure that it will only intensify, so what's the solution? Liberal dictatorship, liberal one party state? There was actually a talk in Germany of banning AFD, now pretty much the most popular party in the country, at least in the East. Seems kind of crazy.
Of course, another solution would be to defang the right wing parties by adressing some of the issues that push people to vote for them, and that's what it think is happening. It's a tactic not a strategy really.
sure, politics grinds on, but the bigots have to talk about immigration now since racism is not allowed, they have to go on about trans and abortion since sexism and homophobia is banned - their culture war has run out of road
 

sufi

lala
The lefties consider themselves to be masters of understanding different peoples and viewpoints but they're manifestly utterly incapable of understanding the conservative mindset and of accommodating it, even if they don't understand. This is why they cannot consider themselves masters of multiculturalism.
i think mistresses of multiculturalism might be more apt? and somehow fruitier imagery?

in any case this is a hilarious logical somersault, more of this acrobatics please
 

mixed_biscuits

_________________________
i think mistresses of multiculturalism might be more apt? and somehow fruitier imagery?

in any case this is a hilarious logical somersault, more of this acrobatics please
Disregarding conservatives in failing to provide a safe space for them should be a hate crime; see my upcoming thread.
 

vershy versh

Well-known member
The momentum's with the right now Trump's heading back to the White House. I don't think it's over. A bunch of the DEI stuff's being shelved and dismantled now money's tighter and there's less pressure on business to toe the progressive line.
 

Benny Bunter

Well-known member
The momentum's with the right now Trump's heading back to the White House. I don't think it's over. A bunch of the DEI stuff's being shelved and dismantled now money's tighter and there's less pressure on business to toe the progressive line.
Is that not more of a sign that it is over rather than not?

I don't think it's "over" but there must be a lot of people relieved they don't have to pretend to believe anymore in stuff they never really did believe in, on both sides. I mean, who can really be arsed anymore?
 

sufi

lala
Is that not more of a sign that it is over rather than not?

I don't think it's "over" but there must be a lot of people relieved they don't have to pretend to believe anymore in stuff they never really did believe in, on both sides. I mean, who can really be arsed anymore?
Yeah it's over - the culture war was a froth of toxic nonsense on top of social progress that not even trumpo can roll back - he was a big help in highlighting unacceptable behaviour such as "pussy-grabbing"
 

Benny Bunter

Well-known member
I get the impression you're allowed to say a lot more stuff nowadays than would have been unsayable when the culture war, cancel culture era was at its peak.
 

Benny Bunter

Well-known member
Yeah it's over - the culture war was a froth of toxic nonsense on top of social progress that not even trumpo can roll back - he was a big help in highlighting unacceptable behaviour such as "pussy-grabbing"
I don't really understand what you mean
 

Benny Bunter

Well-known member
that's OK :)
= you can talk about grabbing pussies all you like, but grabbing pussies is not acceptable
Eh?

I wasn't talking about grabbing pussies, it's you that brought that up! I just genuinely didn't understand what you were on about, it's not very clear to me.

I think that's the problem when people talk about a 'culture war', it's very complex and hard to define, so we all end up talking past each other.
 

Benny Bunter

Well-known member
.
A war has at least two warring sides, one side having the upper hand doesn't mean the war's won, and this particular war seems to rage in perpetuity. It raged throughout the 90s, simmered for a while, then exploded back into life.
My point was that I think some people who previously adopted some of the more extreme progressive views, under pressure, and without really believing in them, can now relax a bit. And like you said, business as well.
 

Benny Bunter

Well-known member
Liberals and progressives are on the back foot and having to regroup to go again.

During the US election campaign Kamala Harris had to try and dodge questions about what she had said previously - stuff about defund the police, transitioning prisoners, etc etc - cos they realised, too late, it wouldn't win them the election. She toned down all the progressive rhetoric, but couldn't take back what she'd already said cos it was all on tape.

Politicians mostly just say anything, especially at election time. The Dems just misjudged it really badly and got the timing all wrong, chose the worst possible candidate.
 

luka

Well-known member
Barty reckons the left go all in on the culture war stuff when the right have the ascendancy politically so it should wll go feral again now Trump is back
 
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