luka
Well-known member
What a terrible thing to say. Crowley should be ashamed of himself.
Beyond Soul.
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What a terrible thing to say. Crowley should be ashamed of himself.
pattycakes_
Can turn naughty
pattycakes_
Can turn naughty
If I could play jazz drums (I can't) and could find other people on the same page, and I bet they're hiding out there somewhere, I'd totally be doing this. When I was living in Leipzig in 2017 I started up and ran a funk jam. Had some great players involved and was adamant about not playing shit like fucking cissy strut and chameleon. We got a few tunes together as the house band and then let the rest of the nights unfold as they would. There were moments of real highness. I'm talking a room with maybe 50 people all bouncing off the walls. Sweating, going wild. 12 piece band all totally on it. And this was in Germany. I'm not going to take credit for all of that, but I definitely pushed it in a direction because I had a vision of what it could and should be, and in the end it manifested. Unfortunately behind the scenes there were a bunch of people trying to push it in other directions and eventually egos got out of hand and it burned out. Was brilliant when it was at its peak though.
I will never understand why so many jazz jams around the world always seem to be based on fucking standards. Now that is what I call stuck in the mud. Its not exciting. Its just well schooled musicians playing the shit they've been practising all week. Do you ever walk by the big music conservatory in Greenwich, luka? They're all stuck in the 50s. Or if they feel like doing something different they'll do a bebop rendition of the star wars theme or some shit. Wtf is that? Same with funk jams. Always the meters, chameleon, fucking Bruno Mars... Drummers who think funk means an opportunity to show off every single trick they know. And long assed meandering flat free-form shit that will flit from your bog standard pedestrian bs into a dnb bit, then break down into a half time thing, then some Chris dave ridiculous cross division nonsense. Chris himself is a beast but he spawned so much bullshit. Argh. Gospel bands are the shit though. America must have so many dope sessions going on that we would never hear about.
Just remembered passing clouds Sunday night Jam sessions. Any of you fucks ever go there? That was pretty high level. Bunch of old rastas and Africans all playing the tightest yet most laid back sounding shit and making it look like nothing was going on. One time when Clouds was on hiatus or maybe they'd already closed they moved to some place around the corner. Some small bar and I swear I heard some of the heaviest shit ever, like Herbie & miles plus felas 70s band at their peak leaning way into the afro thing. Every single musician blazing and looking like they were having a blast. Was there with my gf from that time who hated jazz and she was getting blown away. Also smoked some of the kindest goodvibe weed ever which helped muchly. I think it's still out there man.
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pattycakes_
Can turn naughty
Don't drink n post, dudes.
I'm reading about Wynton Marsalis now. strange chap.
http://www.gerryhemingway.com/jazzburn.html
"When Marsalis was 19 he was a fine jazz trumpeter," says Pierre Sprey, president of Mapleshade Records, a jazz and blues label. "But he was getting his ass kicked every night in Art Blakey's band. I don't think he could keep up. And finally he retreated to safe waters. He's a good classical trumpeter and thus he sees jazz as being a classical Music. He has no clue what's going on now."
For every black hero, there is a white counterpart: Frederick Douglas/Lincoln, Jackie Robinson/Branch Rickey, Louis Armstrong/Tommy Dorsey. In other words, a feel-good narrative of white patronage and understanding.
This, in part, explains why Burns recoils from the fact that Davis, Coltrane, Coleman and their descendents have taken jazz not toward a soft, white-friendly swing sound but deeper into the urban black experience. When Davis went electric, it was as significant a move as Dylan coming out with a rock-and-roll band (and not just any band, but the Hawks) in 1966. Dylan was jeered by the critical elites as a "Judas" and, despite the fact that Bitches Brew went on to be one of the best-selling jazz albums of all time, Davis is still being slammed. Burns includes a quote in his film denouncing Davis' excursions into fusion as a "denaturing" of jazz.
This, in part, explains why Burns recoils from the fact that Davis, Coltrane, Coleman and their descendents have taken jazz not toward a soft, white-friendly swing sound but deeper into the urban black experience. When Davis went electric, it was as significant a move as Dylan coming out with a rock-and-roll band (and not just any band, but the Hawks) in 1966. Dylan was jeered by the critical elites as a "Judas" and, despite the fact that Bitches Brew went on to be one of the best-selling jazz albums of all time, Davis is still being slammed. Burns includes a quote in his film denouncing Davis' excursions into fusion as a "denaturing" of jazz.
Leo
Well-known member
luv ya third but some wobbly reasoning here. Lincoln has a president, Douglas wasn't, so of course he's got a more recognized place in history. every kid in America and probably many around the world know the Jackie Robinson story, and I'll bet nearly none of them know rickey. and Armstrong is much more highly regarded for contributions to jazz than Dorsey. yes, at the time, each those African Americans got short changed but it wasn't that long after that they were rightly recognized, right?
pattycakes_
Can turn naughty
Now we've established what soul is, what about beyond it?
that wasn't me saying it don't shoot the messenger it's from that article! the point is if you're wynton marsalis and them jazz is trad classical types then you have to conclude that the jazz avant-garde in the 50s-70s were a bunch of quavering ducks eager to sell out to the majors.
Misapplied spenglerism, as a tag eloquently puts it in this thread. anyway I just found it when looking up the neotraditionalist school. I've never really investigated them before.
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Leo
Well-known member
apologies, didn't read the article and thought it was you talking. yeah agree.
sadmanbarty
Well-known member
i don't teach anymore, but i'd make an exception for you. traveling the world importing and exporting with nothing to my name other than a pair of worn drum sticks and a thomas cook loyalty card.
pattycakes_
Can turn naughty
That'd be great but I'm not planning on returning to the uk ever again!
sadmanbarty
Well-known member
arrest warrant?
pattycakes_
Can turn naughty
Wanted in 48 counties
There's definitely truth to that. But I've never really felt the UK was my roots though. Funnily enough London made me feel that 10x more.
pattycakes_
Can turn naughty
London was my first real exposure to what lies outside of the UK bubble and so much of that resonated with me more than how I felt among my fellow brits *shrug*
CrowleyHead
Well-known member
Pharaoh Sanders is trash you've got to move past this.
CrowleyHead
Well-known member
He's what all the skeptics think Sun Ra is. Useless pantomime and posture and disguises. Faux-Shamanisms and Elevated Consciousness to disguise the fact that he's sub-Yusef Lateef level.
Rahsaan Roland Kirk has soul. Pharaoh Sanders is a gimmick rock saxophonist. He sucks.
Rahsaan Roland Kirk has soul. Pharaoh Sanders is a gimmick rock saxophonist. He sucks.