Exopolitics

MATT MAson

BROADSIDE
Couldn't decide if this should go in the free energy or UFO or one of 'end of civilization' threads, so decided to make a new one.

Exopolitics is

"The art or science of government as concerned with creating or influencing policy toward extraterrestrial phenomena and extraterrestrial beings."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exopolitics

It all sounds pretty far fetched. But the one thing I find interesting about this area is the Disclosure Project - a group of mostly high-ranking ex-armed forces and defense people, Apollo astronauts and NASA scientists, who have come together to demand the US government goes public with all of its knowledge about UFOs and free energy sources.

They deliberately haven't got involved with any civilians who claim to have been abducted by aliens or whatever, they are only interested in witness who held some kind of position which would have given them access to inside info of some kind, and they have all stuck to this story for the last five-six years.

Every one of these witnesses swears the US government has free energy technologies they are sitting on, and are lobbying so that they can testify to all this in front of congress. I guess my question is, why would these people make all of this up? What's in it for them?

Free energy isn't being taken seriously by most scientists, but it's an area getting more attention what with Steorn's claim this August and Nikola Tesla becoming the new Che Guevara. Given the implications of the possibility of abundant energy sources, and the credibility of a lot of these people, shouldn't this be getting more attention in political circles?

Given the tin-foily hatness of this, it's probably not going to happen. But the ex-Canadian Secretary of Defense has joined ranks with these guys too.

Am I mad thinking there might be something to these claims?

Good Wikipedia entry on the disclosure project here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disclosure_project
 

tate

Brown Sugar
If a person is going to bring 'zero-point energy' into the discussion, one might want to add this link to the discusion, the first sentence of which reads "In popular culture zero-point energy rarely relates to the scientific notion of the subject."
 

MATT MAson

BROADSIDE
I totally agree. It's a controversial, fun subject which attracts a lot of crazies and is used to lend credence to lots of nutty ideas and conspiracy theories.

But the second sentence in that link says: "The Casimir effect has established zero point energy as an uncontroversial and scientifically accepted phenomenon."

I wasn't trying to start a debate as to the science behind this, there is another thread for that. My personal opinion is that science has become very closed minded in recent decades, especially in this area. And i understand why - there are as many free energy cowboys as there are Texan oil ones about. But the peer review system is also slower than ever, a lot of the money that goes into various centers of academic excellence comes from energy companies. Because a lot of scientists are so fed up with the situation, the open source science movement is becoming a lot more popular.

Are you saying because zero point energy is popular in science fiction and the X-files, that these 400 people, who seem pretty credible, some of whom flew Apollo missions and held high ranking positions in agencies like the CIA and companies like Lockheed Martin, should be dismissed out of hand? These guys aren't the Lone Gunmen.

They are saying the government is surpressing new ways to use this "uncontroversial and scientifically accepted phenomenon." I haven't found any evidence they as a group are shopping for a book deal or trying to offload the movie rights. This kind of thing really damages peoples reputations, yet they are all sticking there necks out over this.

I think there is a political debate to be had here, a pretty important one.

**adjusts tin foil New Era hat**
 

tate

Brown Sugar
Are you saying because zero point energy is popular in science fiction and the X-files, that these 400 people, who seem pretty credible, some of whom flew Apollo missions and held high ranking positions in agencies like the CIA and companies like Lockheed Martin, should be dismissed out of hand? These guys aren't the Lone Gunmen.

They are saying the government is surpressing new ways to use this "uncontroversial and scientifically accepted phenomenon." I haven't found any evidence they as a group are shopping for a book deal or trying to offload the movie rights. This kind of thing really damages peoples reputations, yet they are all sticking there necks out over this.

I think there is a political debate to be had here, a pretty important one.
No, no, I wasn't suggesting that the exopolitics/Disclosure Project stuff should be dismissed out of hand, I was just offering that other link b/c so frequently quantum mechanics-related topics seem to be dragged into discussions ranging from occult, conspiracy theory, sci-fi, psychology, pseudo 'po-mo', etc etc, without much familiarity with scientific details, and so I added the link . . . sorry, carry on :)
 
Am I mad thinking there might be something to these claims?

not so much mad as clutching at straws...:)

...aliens aren't likely to reveal themselves unless we crack the zero point mystery ourselves and intellectually evolve to a level where we can use that power responsibly

I imagine what contact we have had apart from the collective amnesia of interaction in prehistory has been in the form of alien joyriding. Teenage pranksters buzzing earth for a laugh, maybe losing it occassionally and crashing in the desert or rogue traders sourcing raw materials in contravention of the fedeartion pact on non involvement with evolving species...

...I've hit up physicists and asked them about free energy and zero point. They say if it was available we'd know about it cos you can't supress that sort of knowledge for long. If someone can think it and make it known then it makes it easier for others to also think it, pick up on it and move the concepts forward.

To make any progress they'd need to quantify what light/energy is and how space is made...

...heres a more telling wiki entry on zero point energy

My take is physicsts need to acknowledge the negaverse and negative energy which is NOT dark matter or anti matter. It's the place where that stuff comes from and gets converted by particle annhilation to positve energy and matter...:p

kontraribbons7zi.gif


I just hope when they fire up the large hadron collider at Geneva next year that they don't open up a large black hole and suck us all into oblivion or invite some darkside lifeforms to town for a party...

...as you can guess I've always had a thing for stuff like this since wanting to be an astronaut and being into mythology as a kid hence the HELL_SD and some space/alien tune names and even our logo which is post industrial but hints at free energy in 3 dimensions

16382926294431ac9e32710.gif
 

MATT MAson

BROADSIDE
That's all very interesting. But that's not what's interesting about this.

Whether or not any of this stuff is possible or credible is not the point. The point is - why would this particular set of people, whose careers are literally destroyed by making claims like this, make these claims?
 
^^^post traumatic stress disorder, drugs, dementia, black ops disinformation, a bit of fame/notoriety, boredom, in need of a laugh...

...who knows ???

but the fact is, as much as they think they know they can't prove anything. In academic circles it should be easy enough to cut through the bullshit or postulate free energy devices with proof and put em online but the fact that they haven't suggests it's all talk, no action...
 

MATT MAson

BROADSIDE
Thats true. But then again I can't help feeling if they had a file full of pictures of flying saucers they would just be filed away under 'ridiculous' in our psyche with all the other pictures of flying saucers.

As for it being easy to cut through bs in academic circles, I dispute that. Academia moves like a glacier much of the time.
 
I'm sure there are countless artifacts of alien intrusion from the past and present but on a need to know basis, do we need to know the specifics ???

Isn't it enough to believe we are not alone ???

I honestly think we are one genius away from enlightenment. In much the same way as Einstein revolutionised thought on space/time leading to all manner of practical/impractical inventions so will one person revolutionise thought on energy/light and lead to cheap renewable free source of energy invention...

...I don't think it will happen by reverse engineering a piece of alien technology. The revolution when it happens will most probably happen fast and free before the military industrial complex and the petrochem industry can supress it and it'll happen on-line

I reckon it will have something to do with sound maybe like the fremen weapons of Dune...
 
P

Parson

Guest
not so much mad as clutching at straws...:)

...aliens aren't likely to reveal themselves unless we crack the zero point mystery ourselves and intellectually evolve to a level where we can use that power responsibly

I imagine what contact we have had apart from the collective amnesia of interaction in prehistory has been in the form of alien joyriding. Teenage pranksters buzzing earth for a laugh, maybe losing it occassionally and crashing in the desert or rogue traders sourcing raw materials in contravention of the fedeartion pact on non involvement with evolving species...

you are basing your dismissal of the disclosure project on some pretty thin assumptions
 
I'm not dismissing it outright...

...i truly believe in alien intervention and subtle interaction

I just dont think there is some big nu world order conspiracy denying us access to proof of it...

...I reckon the govt's may know a little bit more than us and supress some stuff in their own best interests but if anything and in the grnader scheme, they know as little as we do

so until proof positive comes it's still all speculation, hear say and third hand reporting despite credentials of those doing it...
 
N

nomadologist

Guest
Oh good Lord I hope the U.S. government is spending tons of money on not just the research into "extraterrestrial life and expolitics" but on the many arms and legs of enormous bureaucracy it would require to would support such an enterprise.

People in other threads are talking about "distractions" and this, like Paris Hilton, seems like it must have been engineered to distract, and if its true, it must make party politicians millions or they wouldn't spend on it in the first place. Maybe it's one of those things the republicans feed the white trash to keep them from noticing the war on the other covers in the grocery line. Like the government invented fried chicken to keep down minorities.

Sorry this is devolving into pointless sarcasm.
 
N

nomadologist

Guest
Do you not think we should worry about good old terra firma politics first? I think anything else is, well, a waste of precious time and resources.
 
N

nomadologist

Guest
By the way, "depersonalization disorder" is an amygdala-focused localized sort of brain damage most likely responsible for "depersonalization disorder", which most psychiatrists and researchers think is the origin of "alien abduction" fantasies/hallucinations whichever you prefer. i think sometimes sleep paralysis is another theory, which was probably mentioned int he long sleep paralysis thread somewhere else here.

list of interesting-sounding primary and secondary sources:
http://mv.lycaeum.org/M2/persinger.html
 
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MATT MAson

BROADSIDE
Indeed.

Nomadologist - I suggest you watch some of the testimonies of the people involved in the Disclosure Project. Nobody here is making claims about abductions, and no one is making a lot of money from all this, a lot of them are hurting their careers. I agree, there are lots of other things we need to worry about, and I'm all for spending more time worrying about those (I just started a non-profit which some of you might be interested in - www.wedia.tv )

But the fact of the matter is, something like $80bn is spent every year on 'black projects' by the US government. And the people behind Disclosure are some of the people who see where that $80bn goes. If the nature of what they are saying is true, this has huge ramifications for the rest of humanity.
 
N

nomadologist

Guest
NPOs are good. Nice when people back things up with action. I'd be VERY interested in knowing where that money goes, Matt Mason.
 

gek-opel

entered apprentice
i think sometimes sleep paralysis is another theory, which was probably mentioned int he long sleep paralysis thread somewhere else here.

Yes it is definitely purported to be so. The thing that convinces me on this is that a lot of alien abductee cases cite a humming, buzzing sound. Before I had read anything on the subject (but after experiencing a large amount of sleep-paralysis related issues) I had noted an identical phenomena. I didn't ever imagine myself to be an abductee tho!
 
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