Hardboiled (genre not John Woo)
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Timewriter
Active member
Not sure if this is mainly about books or films but The Outfit (1973) is one brilliantly tough picture.
IdleRich
IdleRich
This could go here, or the tv thread or probably other places too. But this thread needs more action so I'm putting it here.
I read about this tv show, it's described as neo-noir (which obviously I dig) and it's stop motion (which I also love), apparently using dolls as people or something. The review I read said that the plot is twisty-turny and dark, so all sounds promising.
It's called Ultra City Smiths, just found the trailer
Anyone?
I read about this tv show, it's described as neo-noir (which obviously I dig) and it's stop motion (which I also love), apparently using dolls as people or something. The review I read said that the plot is twisty-turny and dark, so all sounds promising.
It's called Ultra City Smiths, just found the trailer
Anyone?
IdleRich
IdleRich
I started watching this - I mean Ultra City Smiths, as discussed in the post above - now, it's a lot of fun - although I can imagine some might find it annoying, viewing it simply as pissing around with something that didn't need to be pissed around with.
The obvious comparison is Sin City in that, like that, it's set in a cartoonishly crime-ridden town which itself is represented surreally, but whereas Sin City uses that rotoscaping effect or whatever it's called, Ultra City is realised using children's dolls, a modelled background and stop motion. In each case there is a corrupt mayor or governor or something and a few good cops trying to do the right thing despite being part of a rotten system. You have the standard background of hookers and muggers and frightening looking taverns, plus gangs of feral kids such as The Nixons who all wear rubber masks of the disgraced president. And while Sin City is what you might call a post-modern neo-noir I suppose, Ultra City really goes out of its way to pile up references and quotes to a level I've never really seen before. For example there is a red balloon that floats around in... I want to say a nod to the famous animation of the same name, but nod doesn't do it justice, it's a massive, blatant quote or steal or something. Similarly there is an aging rent boy hanging around who is clearly supposed to be John Voigt's character from Midnight Cowboy and I'm sure if I put my mind to it I'll many more such things. The narrator is Tom Waits of course and it's these sorts of things along with the odd musical routine and jokes that verge on stupid that I can imagine might have some people turning it off with a disgusted shake of the head.
But personally I do think that that would be a mistake, at least on the evidence of what I've seen so far cos the story is good and it zips along satisfyingly, plus the way it's made just works, the voices are perfect and I've been drawn in. The story so far is a little bit tangled but basically a rich man called Carpenter Smith who was standing for mayor and who was seen as the last hope for saving the town has been murdered. The crime is being investigated by a detective who is new in town and referred to as New Kid by his peers, he's already short-listed eight relatives of the dead man who spoke to him on his final day and, although many have changed their name, he has established that they are all in fact called Smith - hence the title.
As well as that, there is a subplot in which a young girl who runs messages for a crime lord has somehow lost, or stolen the $43k she was supposed to bring him from a recent transaction. She and her mother, a gigantic wrestler known as Andrea the Giant are trying to recover that, and the young girl is friends with one of the Nixons who is also the daughter of New Kid's partner, and she (the partner) also turns out to be a Smith. Oh and the Midnight Cowboy guy is trying to raise $100k for a life-saving operation on his boyfriend and is now planning a bank robbery with a load of other decrepit rent boys as his associates. I fear for their success as their getaway plan involves making sure they have enough money to escape on the bus.
So yeah, all of that is going on and is all mixed up together, plus "the most dangerous man in the world" played by Julian Barrat (although he's only had one line so far) has just been released from prison and seems to be joining forces with the present mayor, police chief and gang boss who is down $43k. I'm drawn right in and I can't wait to see where it goes from here.
The obvious comparison is Sin City in that, like that, it's set in a cartoonishly crime-ridden town which itself is represented surreally, but whereas Sin City uses that rotoscaping effect or whatever it's called, Ultra City is realised using children's dolls, a modelled background and stop motion. In each case there is a corrupt mayor or governor or something and a few good cops trying to do the right thing despite being part of a rotten system. You have the standard background of hookers and muggers and frightening looking taverns, plus gangs of feral kids such as The Nixons who all wear rubber masks of the disgraced president. And while Sin City is what you might call a post-modern neo-noir I suppose, Ultra City really goes out of its way to pile up references and quotes to a level I've never really seen before. For example there is a red balloon that floats around in... I want to say a nod to the famous animation of the same name, but nod doesn't do it justice, it's a massive, blatant quote or steal or something. Similarly there is an aging rent boy hanging around who is clearly supposed to be John Voigt's character from Midnight Cowboy and I'm sure if I put my mind to it I'll many more such things. The narrator is Tom Waits of course and it's these sorts of things along with the odd musical routine and jokes that verge on stupid that I can imagine might have some people turning it off with a disgusted shake of the head.
But personally I do think that that would be a mistake, at least on the evidence of what I've seen so far cos the story is good and it zips along satisfyingly, plus the way it's made just works, the voices are perfect and I've been drawn in. The story so far is a little bit tangled but basically a rich man called Carpenter Smith who was standing for mayor and who was seen as the last hope for saving the town has been murdered. The crime is being investigated by a detective who is new in town and referred to as New Kid by his peers, he's already short-listed eight relatives of the dead man who spoke to him on his final day and, although many have changed their name, he has established that they are all in fact called Smith - hence the title.
As well as that, there is a subplot in which a young girl who runs messages for a crime lord has somehow lost, or stolen the $43k she was supposed to bring him from a recent transaction. She and her mother, a gigantic wrestler known as Andrea the Giant are trying to recover that, and the young girl is friends with one of the Nixons who is also the daughter of New Kid's partner, and she (the partner) also turns out to be a Smith. Oh and the Midnight Cowboy guy is trying to raise $100k for a life-saving operation on his boyfriend and is now planning a bank robbery with a load of other decrepit rent boys as his associates. I fear for their success as their getaway plan involves making sure they have enough money to escape on the bus.
So yeah, all of that is going on and is all mixed up together, plus "the most dangerous man in the world" played by Julian Barrat (although he's only had one line so far) has just been released from prison and seems to be joining forces with the present mayor, police chief and gang boss who is down $43k. I'm drawn right in and I can't wait to see where it goes from here.
IdleRich
IdleRich
How long do you imagine such a thing taking?
As you know, I'm running this event where I show short films, so if you could, maybe plan it a bit, so that from the moment he's first tied up, to the final agonised scream and death rattle... actually, you probably want to have a few minutes after that point for the torturers (I'm presuming you and probably @woops maybe that utterly sick and twisted fuck @version... I dunno) to wreak some damage on the lifeless corpse
, just to make sure that you not only inflict the maximum possible pain, but that you also utterly strip away his dignity shortly after his skin... But I'll leave those details to you, I'm sure you know what you're doing and ultimately I'll assume you can get him all wrapped up in less than an hour.But I'll need more than that, the real question is, can you film it in such a way as to keep my little hipster film club happy? I'm not saying you need a narrative, but characters are important, if they're gonna watch someone they don't know being ripped apart for an hour then you're gonna have to make them care, you have to make his personality come through so that they are really rooting against him. You want them to cheer at every sickening crunch or gruesome squelch - I'm thinking that you could start with that picture of him topless, smiling that evil, smug smile, then follow it up with some choice quotes and his character will be established.
Of course it's a public film thing so the rules will have to be strictly enforced, there's the one I mentioned about it keeping it shorter than an hour and... well that's about it. Let me know when you've done it and send me a copy for review and I'll decide if it's good enough. Try and get it right first time, if it's not up to the standard you'll try with Tea second time and I'm not sure the crowd will get so into that
luka
Well-known member
read a rubbish one the other day. now im about to finish another good one.
luka
Well-known member
just imagine.
WashYourHands
Cat Malogen
denied wanking
arms strapped to The Porn Chair with 23 screens rotating multiple scenes Jack has partially committed to memory
arms strapped to The Porn Chair with 23 screens rotating multiple scenes Jack has partially committed to memory
WashYourHands
Cat Malogen
Or become immortal
Ellroy's got a new one out in September about Marilyn Monroe.
James Ellroy—Demon Dog of American Letters—goes straight to the tragic heart of 1962 Hollywood with a wild riff on the Marilyn Monroe death myth in an astonishing, behind-the-headlines crime epic.
Los Angeles, August 4, 1962. The city broils through a midsummer heat wave. Marilyn Monroe ODs. A B-movie starlet is kidnapped. The overhyped LAPD overreacts. Chief Bill Parker’s looking for some getback. The Monroe deal looks like a moneymaker. He calls in Freddy Otash.
The freewheeling Freddy O: tainted ex-cop, defrocked private eye, dope fiend, and freelance extortionist. A man who lives by the maxim “Opportunity is love.” Freddy gets to work. He dimly perceives Marilyn Monroe’s death and the kidnapped starlet to be a poisonous riddle that only he has the guts and the brains to untangle. We are with him as he tears through all those who block his path to the truth. We are with him as he penetrates the faux-sunshine of Jack and Bobby Kennedy and the shuck of Camelot. We are with him as he falters, and grasps for love beyond opportunity. We are with him as he tracks Marilyn Monroe’s horrific last charade through a nightmare L.A. that he served to create — and as he confronts his complicity and his own raging madness.
It’s the Summer of ’62, baby. Freddy O’s got a hot date with history. The savage Sixties are ready to pop. It’s just a shot away.
James Ellroy—Demon Dog of American Letters—goes straight to the tragic heart of 1962 Hollywood with a wild riff on the Marilyn Monroe death myth in an astonishing, behind-the-headlines crime epic.
Los Angeles, August 4, 1962. The city broils through a midsummer heat wave. Marilyn Monroe ODs. A B-movie starlet is kidnapped. The overhyped LAPD overreacts. Chief Bill Parker’s looking for some getback. The Monroe deal looks like a moneymaker. He calls in Freddy Otash.
The freewheeling Freddy O: tainted ex-cop, defrocked private eye, dope fiend, and freelance extortionist. A man who lives by the maxim “Opportunity is love.” Freddy gets to work. He dimly perceives Marilyn Monroe’s death and the kidnapped starlet to be a poisonous riddle that only he has the guts and the brains to untangle. We are with him as he tears through all those who block his path to the truth. We are with him as he penetrates the faux-sunshine of Jack and Bobby Kennedy and the shuck of Camelot. We are with him as he falters, and grasps for love beyond opportunity. We are with him as he tracks Marilyn Monroe’s horrific last charade through a nightmare L.A. that he served to create — and as he confronts his complicity and his own raging madness.
It’s the Summer of ’62, baby. Freddy O’s got a hot date with history. The savage Sixties are ready to pop. It’s just a shot away.
IdleRich
IdleRich
@william_kent help me!
I'm in a bookshop, loads of hard-boiled stuff.
Gonna take an Ed McBain 87th Precinct one, those are good.
Also a Mickey Spillane, why not?
But do you know much about any of these...
James Hadley Chase
Robert Charles
John Creasey
Peter Chutney
Nicholas Blake
MG Braun
Hammond Innes
Gil North
John Wainwright
Nan Maynard
Ngaio Marsh
Gonna take a Spillane and a McBain (and some stuff from other sections) but if people can advise on the others may well come back for the ones you recommend.
I'm in a bookshop, loads of hard-boiled stuff.
Gonna take an Ed McBain 87th Precinct one, those are good.
Also a Mickey Spillane, why not?
But do you know much about any of these...
James Hadley Chase
Robert Charles
John Creasey
Peter Chutney
Nicholas Blake
MG Braun
Hammond Innes
Gil North
John Wainwright
Nan Maynard
Ngaio Marsh
Gonna take a Spillane and a McBain (and some stuff from other sections) but if people can advise on the others may well come back for the ones you recommend.
IdleRich
IdleRich
Meanwhile let's play a game.... I'm thinking that if you just jumble up the following words you can generate a load of titles ...
Cop, Pusher, Long, Dark, Deadly, Farewell, Painted, Silver, Cold, Hot, Red, Blue, Midnight, Dress, Train, Silence, Wolf, Carnation, Dahlia, Bullets, Deadly, Kiss, Killer, Sucker, Scorpion, Joker, Big Violence, Murder, Devil, Wolf, Naked, Angel, Third... and quite a few more obviously.
But have a look at the following; each group of titles contains one fake that I made up, can you spot the fakes?
The only problem with this game is that I might make up a real title by accident...
The Finishing Stroke
The Long Dark Naked Kiss Farewell
The Longest Second
The Killing Time
Darkness Falls From The Air
The Sweet Ride
Wives To Burn
Devil With An Angel's Face
Summer of the Red Wolf
Journey of the Wolf
The Third Wolf
Inspector West Cries Wolf
The Cry of the Lonely Wolf
Horse Under Water
The Cypriot Hawk
The Flight of the Raven
The Trojan Hearse
Assignment Silver Scorpion
A Pride of Pigs
The Angry Mountain
The Strange Face of Murder
Death's Lovely Mask
Night is a Time To Die
The Long and Deadly Kiss Of The Killer
The Third Bullet
The Third Side of the Coin
The Third Train at Midnight
The Third Man
The Third Part of the Night
What is it with "third"? Why is that in so many titles? I mean, I get that "Naked" or "kiss" or "Killer" comes up a lot, but why is it always the third something or other? That means that the most generic title of all the above is The Third Wolf cos I found a whole bunch of wolf books and a whole bunch of third books - the only way it could be more generic if that third wolf was I dunno, doing something that was long as he said farewell to the killer with a the blue carnation
Cop, Pusher, Long, Dark, Deadly, Farewell, Painted, Silver, Cold, Hot, Red, Blue, Midnight, Dress, Train, Silence, Wolf, Carnation, Dahlia, Bullets, Deadly, Kiss, Killer, Sucker, Scorpion, Joker, Big Violence, Murder, Devil, Wolf, Naked, Angel, Third... and quite a few more obviously.
But have a look at the following; each group of titles contains one fake that I made up, can you spot the fakes?
The only problem with this game is that I might make up a real title by accident...
The Finishing Stroke
The Long Dark Naked Kiss Farewell
The Longest Second
The Killing Time
The Long Dark Naked Kiss Farewell - starting with an easy one
Darkness Falls From The Air
The Sweet Ride
Wives To Burn
Devil With An Angel's Face
Devil With An Angel's Face
Summer of the Red Wolf
Journey of the Wolf
The Third Wolf
Inspector West Cries Wolf
The Cry of the Lonely Wolf
The Cry of the Lonely Wolf
Horse Under Water
The Cypriot Hawk
The Flight of the Raven
The Trojan Hearse
Assignment Silver Scorpion
A Pride of Pigs
The Cypriot Hawk obviously
The Angry Mountain
The Strange Face of Murder
Death's Lovely Mask
Night is a Time To Die
The Long and Deadly Kiss Of The Killer
The Long and Deadly Kiss of the Killer - in fact is almost the same as the first one I made up, I'm even getting cliched in my attempts to make cliched pisstaeks of the cliched ttitles
The Third Bullet
The Third Side of the Coin
The Third Train at Midnight
The Third Man
The Third Part of the Night
The Third Train at Midnight I completely made up, but I did cheat a little in this one, cos although The Third Part of the Night is indeed a film, it's not from the hardboiled or noir genre, in fact I think it's quote from the Bible
What is it with "third"? Why is that in so many titles? I mean, I get that "Naked" or "kiss" or "Killer" comes up a lot, but why is it always the third something or other? That means that the most generic title of all the above is The Third Wolf cos I found a whole bunch of wolf books and a whole bunch of third books - the only way it could be more generic if that third wolf was I dunno, doing something that was long as he said farewell to the killer with a the blue carnation
william_kent
Well-known member
I'm afraid none of those are on my hard-boiled radar, although the only one I've read is Hammond Innes when I was a kid, my dad had one and as far as I can remember it was about white men riding around in a jeep killing Africans