also the only reason articles on hyphy ran in a lot of broadsheets, fashion magazines and mags that dont know anything about urban music (nme, dazed etc) recently is because people like the budding writers on here kept hassling them saying: there's this great new thing called hyphy (which has been around for ages, but we'll keep that quiet) and everyone is talking about it. how about i write u an article?
GRIME- breaking news, gossip, slander, lies etc
mos dan
fact music
yeah mate, it's self-interest and nothing more, i couldn't give a fuck about grime reaching a wider audience.
grow up. i can and do write about any next indie band in the press, but i'd rather the music i love was allowed to reach beyond the fucking street and the fucking rwd forum, get me? do you want grime artists to make any money or what?i think you're just content in your little vice ghetto of cool, and anyone else who maybe wants to help things forward must have some kind of malevolent vested interest. i hate advertorial crap as much as the next man, but what, vice don't run ads? you would prefer it if dazed never covered grime at all? come on.
stop throwing your toys out of the pram. i'm not aiming that directly at you. i've read pages of people saying grime doesn't get enough press coverage. then you've got people coming on here saying vice don't rep grime properly, dazed have been supporting. i was just pointing out that the 8 page feature in dazed was paid for. i go out every month and buy grime mix cds and review them in vice.
we're on the same team guys. i was just saying it's not easy to get non-indie stuff into broadsheets. but then you came back like: well. i got a hyphy feature in. how many hyphy features do you think will be running in 2 years?
we're on the same team guys. i was just saying it's not easy to get non-indie stuff into broadsheets. but then you came back like: well. i got a hyphy feature in. how many hyphy features do you think will be running in 2 years?
its pretty offensive to say that the only reason anyone would argue the point is to further their career though is it not? its more or less a direct accusation. not to mention factually incorrect (im not a journalist nor do i plan to be). it just immediately makes it personal, and calls personal integrity into question
slightly off topic but did footsie not claim to be deep with a ball before he had a kid and flopped it all? maybe he did have skills i dunno
slightly off topic but did footsie not claim to be deep with a ball before he had a kid and flopped it all? maybe he did have skills i dunno
mos dan
fact music
*collects toys, returns them to pram*
yeah fair enough - as elgato says you can see why i took offence, no hard feelings tho. fwiw i think vice's take on grime IS a big contribution, but i think it's important this is complimented by coverage in mags/papers with different demographics.
you misunderstood why i mentioned hyphy - we've been saying the same thing all along: the reason everyone *did* go for it lately - my piece included - was cos of novelty value (as you say, ridiculously, given how long it's been around), same reason dizzee got coverage and the meeja went nuts for grime in 2003.
but while capitalising on editors' perverse obsession with novelty i think it's only fair to keep pushing to change that ignorant approach, to challenge the notion that there are no stories in grime right now... like elgato said earlier the narratives there are easily the equal of whatever indie band have an album out that week.
being realistic is one thing, but there's no reason to give up on the press. i want people in suburbia to read about the movement mixtape because they could end up liking it as much as the game or fiddy or whatever US hiphop they're lapping up. is that so idealistic?
It's not a secret that the Dazed feature was an advertorial, given that the very first line is "Nike commissioned a unique project about music" but I suppose the point is that Dazed could have gone for hip-hoppers, nu-rave, or even a group outside the music scene to promote Nike, but actually ended up with Grime. Anyway...
I'm not knocking your contribution to Vice by the way - very good read. It's just interesting that put next to the coverage of say, electronic music and techno, it seems to be treated like a novelty. I haven't picked up Vice for a while now, so I this could be an out of date arguement (oh, and that's not out of choice, more that it seems to have disappeared from the streets of my home city).
Like you say, we're all on the same side even if I ain't a journo.
To get this thread back on track... ain't Wonder's new one amazing?? I finally got a copy of it on CD today. Best Foot Forward and More are just too much.
is there really that much in grime to actually write about at the moment anyway? its going to have to be a bit more productive to actually merit more articles. im not sure what people here want anyway. theres grime/dubstep review pages in DJ and IDJ, the specialist mags where it counts. mags like rwd cover it, echoes and blues n soul and touch do stuff every so often too.
mainstream mags never cover urban music (at least not in depth), unless its particularly mainstream, hyped, 'big' or newsworthy. not sure why grime should be much different. all this talk that broadsheets should be covering grime is risible - the writers in charge of commisions etc at these papers simply arent into black music and dont know a huge deal about it either for the most part, the main focus/genre of interest is rock and pop. and honestly, i cant imagine 90% of the guardians readers caring to read about many urban artists to begin with.
the best person writing about hip hop/R&B at the guardian for my money is angus batey - he treats it with the same seriousness as other music and doesnt pander to the assumed readership of the paper.
100% agreed with easychord above that grime needs to get people into black music on board first. that way it at least has something solid to build on. been saying that for ages but exactly how it should do that, im not so sure. really and truly i just dont think its going to get more people on board than uk hip hop. people just dont rate british MCs by and large. and its not a new thing, its been going on for decades.
mainstream mags never cover urban music (at least not in depth), unless its particularly mainstream, hyped, 'big' or newsworthy. not sure why grime should be much different. all this talk that broadsheets should be covering grime is risible - the writers in charge of commisions etc at these papers simply arent into black music and dont know a huge deal about it either for the most part, the main focus/genre of interest is rock and pop. and honestly, i cant imagine 90% of the guardians readers caring to read about many urban artists to begin with.
the best person writing about hip hop/R&B at the guardian for my money is angus batey - he treats it with the same seriousness as other music and doesnt pander to the assumed readership of the paper.
100% agreed with easychord above that grime needs to get people into black music on board first. that way it at least has something solid to build on. been saying that for ages but exactly how it should do that, im not so sure. really and truly i just dont think its going to get more people on board than uk hip hop. people just dont rate british MCs by and large. and its not a new thing, its been going on for decades.
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just because this is the status quo doesnt mean it's OK.
Thanks for the links.I heard the show live and and doubted that the altercation was genuine as it came seconds before the top of the hour ad break.After listening to the whole thing back again and hearing some more of the facts surrounding it, I tend to believe it was genuine.Wiley certainly said some pretty provocative stuff regarding Gift during the show.He also mentioned a new war based show that he intends to host on the station.Perhaps its time to step up security?
http://www.myspace.com/thekandytangerineman
mos dan
fact music
Sunday 11pm-midnight, The War Zone (i think).
I don't think he was gonna host, it was a new idea which was to feature DJ and MC battles. Whether Geeneus will still be up for it after Wiley Vs GG is anyone's guess...
I still don't understand how they can have rushed Wiley given that there's a pass system and you supposedly have to let people in...
mos dan
fact music
exactly. i'm not gonna have people roll their eyes like i'm being naive just because i expect/demand an acceptable attitude from british newspapers.
i am a guardian and independent reader and thus i expect more as a consumer, if nothing else.
benjybars
village elder.
why has no-one mentioned the most obvious thing about that Wiley set - he was BUZZING OFF HIS FACE!! seriously, he didn't stop talking once for over an hour... it was pure jokes.. he literally could not shut up!
staged or not, that was possibly the most entertaining grime set of all time... Wiley has so much personality, charisma etc... there were too many classic soundbites in that set
also, i love the wiley always addresses the audience as 'London', as if he's the mayor or something...
staged or not, that was possibly the most entertaining grime set of all time... Wiley has so much personality, charisma etc... there were too many classic soundbites in that set
also, i love the wiley always addresses the audience as 'London', as if he's the mayor or something...
Wiley back today on Rinse
Wiley is back on Rinse today at 5pm!
http://www.rwdmag.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=124134
http://www.myspace.com/thekandytangerineman
Wiley is back on Rinse today at 5pm!
http://www.rwdmag.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=124134
http://www.myspace.com/thekandytangerineman
Wiley IS the mayor of the London as far as I'm concerned. Certainly of East anyway. Can't wait to hear what he has to say today. When I think about it, that's actually one of the best things about pirate radio, all the non-musical chatter that goes on, talking, sending messages to people 'so and so, ring so and so' over the air, jokes, etc. Anyone heard the recent Wonder set with Faction G? Faction goes off on an Alice In Wonderland riff in the beginning talking about Wonders album release party saying 'The Queen of hearts will be there, Wonder's gonna dress up in a pink bunny suit...' Really entertaining. Also, I guess it's a Hot Chip remix on the beginning of it? Really nice, is that the Skream one, anyone heard?
benjybars
village elder.
mos dan
fact music
hint
party record with a siren
He needs to do a "When I'm 'Ere"-style track, but with "You know what London..?" at the beginning of each line instead.
INSTANT ANTHEM STATUS.
to divert the topic, has anyone else picked up the Heavy Artillery EP by Virgo yet? absolutely sick, Puzzle and Freak are outrageous tracks, the melodic composition is unbelievable, these beautiful, swirling, synthetic orchestras. with that and the Clack Riddim he's one of the biggest producers going for me at the moment. is it the case that he produces for Essentials?
F1 also, ive only just clocked him, but he's been absolutely smashing it
F1 also, ive only just clocked him, but he's been absolutely smashing it
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Virgo is big.
Virgo, Mr. Slash, and Raptor are my fav newish producers... all take the dense, sample heavy sound of people Low Deep and do it even more ornately... all three kill out on all levels, where the sounds they choose are good and the arrangements are just bananas...