phantom of the paradise is a great film...
and don't forget "hi mom" a superweird early effort that reminds me of Putney Swope by Robert Downey Sr...
but, please let's talk about actual film noir, not neo-noir...
Film Noir
- Thread starter IdleRich
- Start date
phantom of the paradise is a great film...
and don't forget "hi mom" a superweird early effort that reminds me of Putney Swope by Robert Downey Sr...
but, please let's talk about actual film noir, not neo-noir...
IdleRich
IdleRich
I watched (Fritz Lang's) The Big Heat yesterday which I don't think anyone has mentioned in this thread. It was very good indeed, dark and amoral even by the conventions of this dark genre. At one point the (fired) detective decides to kill a woman in cold blood purely because her death will trigger the release of documents that will incriminate his enemies. There are also attacks on the main character's family (unusual for him to have a family or friends) and two people being scalded by having boiling coffee thrown in their face. On top of all this there is a far reaching corruption that penetrates the top levels of the police force and removes - for a while at least - any overall sense of things "being alright in the end". There are flash baddies and one definite femme fatale with at least two other potential candidates for that role who quickly wind up dead along with pretty much every other woman who has a speaking part.
Maybe a couple of the scenes towards the end pull back from the bleakness and verge slightly on cheesiness but overall this is a fantastic film.
Maybe a couple of the scenes towards the end pull back from the bleakness and verge slightly on cheesiness but overall this is a fantastic film.
I love film noir!
I also love "Night of the Hunter" and think everyone should see it, but I don't think it's noir at all. I know it's listed that way in wikipedia, and surely it is dark. But thematically, it's almost anti-noir - mystical, religious, dreamy, rural, starring children... Mitchum is unbelievably great in it but that don't make it film noir to me..
I'd say don't neglect
The Hitch-Hiker, directed by Ida Lupino
and Criss-Cross,
both very good
I also love "Night of the Hunter" and think everyone should see it, but I don't think it's noir at all. I know it's listed that way in wikipedia, and surely it is dark. But thematically, it's almost anti-noir - mystical, religious, dreamy, rural, starring children... Mitchum is unbelievably great in it but that don't make it film noir to me..
I'd say don't neglect
The Hitch-Hiker, directed by Ida Lupino
and Criss-Cross,
both very good
slim jenkins
El Hombre Invisible
I agree there - 'Night Of The Hunter' isn't FN but it is brilliant.
Also agree about most films mentioned as FN classics. 'The Man Who Wasn't There', despite not involving a PI or cops as main characters is a brilliant homage to the 'noir' atmosphere (but then I'm a big fan of the Coens so I'm biased).
Good to see some admirers of 'Rififi' too - what a great film.
Has anyone mentioned Sam Fuller's 'Pickup On South Street'? That's well worth watching.
I think 'Double Indemnity' has just about the best script of any, due to Chandler's magic.
Must also mention Anthony Mann's 'T-Men', which is saturated with sharp silhouettes and shadows - great 'tough guy' stuff.
Also agree about most films mentioned as FN classics. 'The Man Who Wasn't There', despite not involving a PI or cops as main characters is a brilliant homage to the 'noir' atmosphere (but then I'm a big fan of the Coens so I'm biased).
Good to see some admirers of 'Rififi' too - what a great film.
Has anyone mentioned Sam Fuller's 'Pickup On South Street'? That's well worth watching.
I think 'Double Indemnity' has just about the best script of any, due to Chandler's magic.
Must also mention Anthony Mann's 'T-Men', which is saturated with sharp silhouettes and shadows - great 'tough guy' stuff.
IdleRich
IdleRich
Strangely enough I watched it this morning. Really enjoyed it, very strange/funny the way that they constantly harp on the commies as the ultimate evil. Loads of dialogue along the lines of "I never though even one of our kind would deal with a red!". Never seen a cold war/noir crossover before.
i downloaded this, i will check it out...
just saw 3 Otto Preminger films at this absolutely beautiful theatre in Jersey City, NJ... the Jersey Loews, an old "movie palace" from the late 20's...
http://www.loewsjersey.org/history/history3.php
it is insanely gorgeous....
anyways, i saw "Where the Sidewalk Ends", a definite noir, and two movies that are on the fringe of Noir , to me, "angel eyes" and "laura"... i would def recommend all 3 films, but Where the Sidewalk Ends is prolly my fav, followed by "angel eyes", due to the presence of Robert Mitchum... some nice genuine NYC shots mixed in with the backlot studio city shots...
'laura" is def a classic, i just think it's more of a hitchcock type whodunit than a film noir... there are no boxers, bartenders, gas station attendents, nightclubs, dark offices, dirty flophouses or alleyways... "angel eyes" kinda leans in this direction as well, tho the argument could be made it is a west coast noir...
for a taste of the other side (kinda), there's Dashiell Hammett. read _Red Harvest_ at least (but none of his pinko stuff made it in to the movies as far as I know)
crackerjack
Well-known member
Now reissued in the cinema too.
IdleRich
IdleRich
Yeah, I saw that was coming out - is it part of some kind of Burt Lancaster retrospective or something?
Saw this not too long ago as well. Not bad and makes for quite uncomfortable viewing at times due to the discrepancy between what they think about the main guy and what you know.
crackerjack
Well-known member
Would be nice to think so. Burt was great, much under-appreciated, the first (i think) of the Hollywood stars to pioneer the one-for-me, one-for-the-studio working method. Sweet Smell of Success, The Train, Local Hero, Elmer Gantry, all brilliant. And I still haven't seen The Swiimmer.
slim jenkins
El Hombre Invisible
'Sweet Smell Of Success' is an absolute classic - 'Match me, Sidney'...
Also features Chico Hamilton's band in the clubs scene, as I recall. Haven't seen it for ages but it's really one to own. Surely Tony Curtis's best fillm.
You left out 'The Bird Man of Alcatraz'!
Also features Chico Hamilton's band in the clubs scene, as I recall. Haven't seen it for ages but it's really one to own. Surely Tony Curtis's best fillm.
You left out 'The Bird Man of Alcatraz'!
crackerjack
Well-known member
'Sweet Smell Of Success' is an absolute classic - 'Match me, Sidney'...
Also features Chico Hamilton's band in the clubs scene, as I recall. Haven't seen it for ages but it's really one to own. Surely Tony Curtis's best fillm.
You left out 'The Bird Man of Alcatraz'!
And From Here To Eternity and Atlantic City (a personal fave) and 7 Days In May. Apache is one of the first great leftwing westerns too.
slim jenkins
El Hombre Invisible
Yes, Atlantic City is great. Don't thnk I've seen Apache. Who plays the Commies, the cavalry or the Injuns...? Or have I oversimplified the subtext?
crackerjack
Well-known member
Don't thnk I've seen Apache. Who plays the Commies, the cavalry or the Injuns...? Or have I oversimplified the subtext?
Just a smidge. Lancaster plays the title role (not all of them, obviously, just the one renegade) and it was one of (if not the) first to tell the story from the injun POV. It would have been seen as a brilliant Vietnam allegory if only it wasn't made in 1954.
Guilhèm de Peitieus
Wild Horses
http://www.bfi.org.uk/whatson/bfi_southbank/burt_lancaster_part_one
Saw The Killers on Saturday as part of this for the first time. The shot of the robbery is incredible. I wasn't completely bowled over by immediately, but in retrospect it is almost faultless. I think my only problem with it was that it seemed too neat - not enough false leads and unresolved bizarreness, perhaps not enough of the Chandler/Bogart wise-cracking for me either. I can definitely see myself getting more out of it on repeated viewing though.
IdleRich
IdleRich
Ah, that must have been what I was on about - cheers.
On an unrelated film noir note I saw The Blue Gardenia the other day which is directed by Fritz Lang but after a promising beginning I found it quite disappointing. The ending was just far too convenient with a (small) twist suddenly making everything alright.
On an unrelated film noir note I saw The Blue Gardenia the other day which is directed by Fritz Lang but after a promising beginning I found it quite disappointing. The ending was just far too convenient with a (small) twist suddenly making everything alright.
"blast of silence" just got issued on DVD...
ii saw it about 10 years about at a film noir festival and it really stuck w/ me...
first, because it was made 1961, it's WAY past my film noir cut-off (i cannot stand Kiss Me Deadly because it is SOOOOOOOOOO 50's and bourgeoise...), yet is it so fucking dark and urban. It is all filmed in NYC right when urban decay was beginning...
second, because it was so obviously the work of one man... Alllen Baron wrote it, directed it, and starred in it; total indie film thing...
third, becuase it seemed very influenced by the French new wave (particluarly Goddard's Breathless), which is funny as the French new wave was very influenced by American film noir!
But, the idea of a film about a criminal, complete with a low key "boring" middle section involving romance and woman and the dialogue therein is exactly out of Breathless... Shit, but not to give the movie away, but it even ends like Breathless... remove the French post-modernism and STYLE and add pure NYC dirt.grit.and.blood. and you get BLAST OF SILENCE.
i am curious as if he was familiar with Cassavete's "Shadows", as they have alot in common. Now, don't get it twisted, one is a Hollywood gangster pic and one is a underground sketch, but they have alot MORE in common with each other than they do with any other movies that came out between 59-61...
slim jenkins
El Hombre Invisible
That sounds great. I imagine he was influenced by 'Shadows', as any filmmaker looking for new directions in America would have been. You've certailny whetted my appetite. Cheers.
fokse vektaire xeven
Arab Nazi
Yeah, I'll second Blast of Silence, It's as hardboiled as they come! I can't really see the new wave influence, at least that way round- plotwise it's strictly "B" territory, doesn't entirely hold up or make sense- it's the execution that makes the film. Looks like a sooty daguerrotype and the bustling jazz soundtrack and incessant snarling tough-guy voice over are just perfect. Great opening too...