Mr. Tea
Let's Talk About Ceps
anyone that eats black pudding and drinks cask ale cannot be a robot.
(Or maybe that just demonstrates that I'm an incredibly advanced model? )
anyone that eats black pudding and drinks cask ale cannot be a robot.
Which really brings us to the crux of the matter, and something that's bothered me for some time. What, exactly, do we mean by the words "spiritual" and "spirituality"? Is it meaningful to be spiritual without, at some level, believing in spirits?
The way I see it, it's not really meaningful to call yourself a 'spiritual' person without believing in something like a spirit or spirits
Zhao, there are a million ways to think about the interrelatedness of all things, or about energy flows, and rationalist or scientific explanations aren't exactly inimical to this sort thinking. In fact, some of the greatest thinkers about that "oceanic feeling" were cosmologists and psychoanalysts, even some modernists among them.
So I'm sick of the lazy binaries and dichotomies in this thread where it's "us" versus "them", and the scientists are just a bunch of no-fun, hungup, socially inept, unfeeling "robots" whereas all of you fun-loving, sophisticated, Rico Suave hippies have it all bagged up...speaking of stunted high school immaturity, that's about the height of it right there.
well, nevermind that the version of the story i endorse fits the accounts of every ancient culture on earth, but let us see what science tells us, from Jarred Diamond, Professor of Geography and Physiology at UCLA:
complete article here
this is only one paper from one scientist... there are lots of other studies which have reached the same conclusions.
could you post some stuff from other studies please Zhao? i see Jarred Diamond gets mentioned quite a bit and i know you've recently mentioned Steve Taylor once, but if you've got links to other academic papers that'd be great.
cheers.
apologies if i've missed references buried in the thread- it's quite a long one!
yes one can be a spiritual person, and immerse oneself in spiritual practices, and develop oneself spiritually and reach ever greater heights of knowledge, understanding, awareness, and sensation, without believing in any "thing" "super natural", such as "God" or ghosts.
i personally would define spiritual experiences as those which transcend the confines of one's individual being, in a connection to the universe. it's a feeling of elatedness, a "high" of sorts, where you feel you are not so alone, but indeed a part of every being that has ever lived, everything that has ever been. a feeling that the world is inside you, and you are inseparable from it.
you can have a flash of this feeling listening to a rock song, but it will not last long. or you can work on yourself to expand that fleeting moment you experienced while high on drugs, listening to your favorite band, and make it last a lifetime.
Hell, as cheesy as it sounds I've had goosebump moments solving quantum mechanics problems while listening to AFX's 'Analogue Bubblebath'. As you mention, it can be brought on by all kinds of things; drugs, music, art, meditation - and I'd add sex, extremes of physical experience or endurance, philosophical or mathematical inquiry and even humour.
if that's all spirituality means, ok--most people are spiritual.
i think the sense of connection and transcendence has been calcified or repressed in a lot / most people, who are tuck in the finite and isolated sphere of their egos, unable to empathize and motivated by selfishness.
NYT said:“God knows where the money is, and he knows how to get the money to you,” preached Mrs. Copeland, dressed in a crisp pants ensemble like those worn by C.E.O.’s.