American Artlessness

[luka]

The artlessness of whitman and melville is there in lovecraft its the straining for effect the gargoyle words and popping veins

 

[Benny Bunter]

Moore is not artless. Precious but not artless

I didn't say she was!

But i think that poem in particular is relevant to the discussion. The Americans of that time were looking for an authentic american voice, distinct from the english and europeans, not always successfully

 

[luka]

Its very different the offhand casual breezy stance of o hara

 

[luka]

Simmons wore standard issue tracksuit he consulted the noosphere he placed his pale spidery hands on the crystal ball

 

[Benny Bunter]

Its very different the offhand casual breezy stance of o hara

I know it's different, that's why I posted it. There was a self conscious struggle going on.

 

[luka]

I dont like elephants 'pushing' and if the wolf is tireless why is it resting in the shade of a tree

 

[luka]

I know it's different, that's why I posted it. There was a self conscious struggle going on.

Juzt drawing distinctions

 

[luka]

Ive alwayz admired real gardens with imaginary toads in them

 

[luka]

We have to impose our will on the markets as thatcher imposed her will on the unions. All external constraints must be torn asunder

 

[luka]

This really is the final battle and we will triumph our power must be and shall be absolute

 

[luka]

Theres an american muscularity that is oblivious to or is willing to disregard tastefulness

 

[The King of Pussy Gettin]

hey check it out i saw a rabbit

 

[version]

Theres an american muscularity that is oblivious to or is willing to disregard tastefulness

It works for Ellroy.

 

[luka]

Subtlety, tact, discretion

 

[luka]

It works for Ellroy.

Ellroy is artful tho and very stylised

 

[luka]

I was reading this in the bath and finding something liberating about how rubbish it is

 

[luka]

The high euro culture in sci fi trope is pretty classic. You get it in Dune i think. Its probably in Dick too. It connotes lesuire and a degree of decadence etc

 

[luka]

HIgh euro culture mashed up with future-tech neologisms

 

[sus]

The "self-conscious American voice" that came up when @sus posted a line from Bellow a while back can grate. The lumbering, earnest self-mythologising. I struggled with Algren because of this. Everything was written in what felt like a caricature of an American voice, like one of those Looney Tunes episodes where Daffy Duck's a hardboiled detective.

HE SPEAKS IN YOUR VOICE AMERICAN

AND THERES A SHINE IN HIS EYE THATS HALFWAY HOPEFUL

 

[sus]

"Once you have given up the ghost, everything follows with dead certainty, even in the midst of chaos"