luka

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Having read up to the expulsion from the garden what impresses itself on me is how the Holy text brings the counter-text into being, and thus, I suppose, how God gives rise to Satan.

It is there, between the lines, always present, the very nature of holy writ makes this necessary and inevitable.

Paradise Lost is, as Blake pointed out, that counter-text, the advocacy of Satan.

The opposition between knowledge and obedience also seems fundamental and unavoidable, written into the very nature of what is. I don't think this can be evaded. He-Who-Knows-What-Is-Best-For-You (and I don't doubt, actually, that He does) is in opposition to Experience. Experience is the road to death. The wages of sin is death. Again this is in Blake, part of what is folded in to Blake's notion of Experience.
 

other_life

bioconfused
i was thinking of this. we are told in so many ways in so many places that the true religion hinges on the discernment and knowledge of good and evil, and choosing the former over the latter. "run to every good and flee from every evil" (jewish) "love good and hate evil" (hermetic). we don't know shit fuck even less so as children.

but it's da'at [knowledge] itself which problematises this and make it thorny, twisting, woven tightly together etc. it's not possible to delve into it without making errors, once you set out you inevitably stumble, there is evening before there is morning, there is a descent before/into the ascent... This Is The Power of Dialectics

i think we could go on forever ab everything in b'reishis [genesis] but we should read along w the 929/tanakh yomi thing, maybe. i don't care that it's a zionist initiative, that comes w the territory and it's a good idea, besides (one chapter of the hebrew bible (w its book order and verse numberings, mind) a day).

we could also wait to start a structured reading w simchat torah ['joys of torah', when the traditional reading cycle starts over] this year [evening of october 21-morning of october 22], and follow along w the weekly torah portions and complementary haftarot (traditional readings from the prophets + writings).

the downside to this is waiting, whereas we could jump right into 929 since that doesn't end for another 3 years, anyway. craner and i it sounds like were both at shmuel alef/1 samuel anyway which is where that is right now (according to sefaria.org [killer resource]).
the parashat ['sections' 'portions'] also does not cover the whole prophets + writings

the obvious upside to waiting? sacred time.
where's your frequency luka
 
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luka

Well-known member
Staff member
It's on the way up but please understand you are literally speaking a foreign language here and if you don't translate it I can't communicate with you. I literally don't know what you are saying.
 

luka

Well-known member
Staff member
Me, poetix, cranium, corpsey, other life, padraig (us)
 
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Corpsey

call me big papa
I'll read it. My nose is blocked up and my head is wracked tonight, and the serpent ate my homework, so I won't get far.
 

other_life

bioconfused
It's on the way up but please understand you are literally speaking a foreign language here and if you don't translate it I can't communicate with you. I literally don't know what you are saying.
edited to be more readable
 

padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
I'm 100% in

Got thru a big chunk of it awhile back

Up to destruction of Sodom etc iirc

KJV only tho, none of this modern plainspoken biz
 

luka

Well-known member
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Thanks for cooperating. I'm not waiting till October. I never wait for anything. It's impossible for me. I've got a malfunction.
 

padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
One strong reaction I remember

Old Testament God is a petulant asshole

Always punishing people for breaking rules they didn't know existed, needlessly cruel, vindictive

Abraham + Isaac, Moses, Job, Tower of Babel, etc
 

Corpsey

call me big papa
You can see why they (or anybody) would think God is a cruel vindictive being, though. The Greek gods are the same, perhaps worse.
 

padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
Like OK its allegorical + reflects the culture (tough, warlike, insular desert/hill people) that produced it

But still

Its not the harshness, but the pettiness + insecurity OT Hod is depicted with. Like shouldn't this all powerful deity be above most of this, aloof?
 

luka

Well-known member
Staff member
One strong reaction I remember

Old Testament God is a petulant asshole

Always punishing people for breaking rules they didn't know existed, needlessly cruel, vindictive

Abraham + Isaac, Moses, Job, Tower of Babel, etc
Today, 01:46 PM #56 Corpsey's Avatar Corpsey Corpsey is online now
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Two responses to the Bible that are too obvious to be interesting

1. God's a cunt
2. In spite of my rational atheism, I can see great aesthetic beauty in the book of X,Y,Z - I'm not a monster!
 

luka

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It is vital we keep corpseys wise words in view throughout the course of this assignment or you will all depress me too much and I will refuse to play with you.
 

padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
The Greek gods are the same, perhaps worse.
Sure. Or the Scandinavian gods, or etc

But the Greek gods are more like humans with superpowers so it makes sense for them to have human passions, habits, foibles.

OT God, creates everything from nothing, moves in the face of the waters, is all-seeing/knowing etc unfathomable infinite entity

Then populates creation with people and immediately starts being a completely unreasonable dick to them in a very personal way
 

padraig (u.s.)

a monkey that will go ape
I'm not saying OT God is terrible

I'm saying I find it an interesting contrast, or inconsistency, in betrayal, very unflattering
 
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